Time for new IMA battery

Discussion in 'Honda Hybrids' started by jmelson, Jun 9, 2022.

  1. jmelson

    jmelson Well-Known Member

    I have a 2009 Civic Hybrid with 184xxx miles. The battery is now giving the dreaded battery pack deterioration code. Honda wants $3800 for a new pack. Can anybody recommend a vendor who does rebuilt packs? Falcon Hybrid seems to be the cheapest, at $1200, bumblebee is $1295, greentec is $1350.
    Anybody have experiences to share? (I got a warranty replacement at 68K miles, before the software update was put in. The software update obviously worked to extend battery life, but wrecked the fuel economy.)
    Thanks,
    Jon
     
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  2. S Keith

    S Keith Well-Known Member

    Congratulations on making it that far. Especially considering it's only the second pack. That's pretty amazing.

    I know the owner of Bumblebee. I know their source. I know their process. I have purchased garbage Prius modules from Falcon Hybrid, and I have received very low quality Greentec cores for battery replacement that had been in service for only a few months.

    Bumblebee hands down.
     
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  3. jmelson

    jmelson Well-Known Member

    Thanks S Keith, Bumblebee is only slightly more expensive than the others, so I will go with them! I don't want to put a lot of money into this car at 184xxx miles. Honda wanted over $4K to put in a new pack. That's 40% of what I paid for the NEW car 12 years ago!

    Jon
     
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  4. BillLin

    BillLin PV solar, geothermal HVAC, hybrids and electrics

    You had a heck of a deal 12 years ago. So now it is just operating cost (insurance, excise tax if any, maintenance). Wonderful! A new pack should last you another 5+ years assuming the engine's still good.

    Edit: And if the car's still marketable (as it should be) after the replacement, I see an '09 with 170k miles listed at $6999 on one of those car web sites. :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2022
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  5. S Keith

    S Keith Well-Known Member

    Truth. Used car prices are insane!
     
  6. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Saw one individual used car selling for almost THREE TIMES MORE than we paid for ALL THREE of our Hyundais……when they WERE NEW.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2022
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  7. jmelson

    jmelson Well-Known Member

    S Keith,
    Well, I ordered a rebuilt battery pack from Bumblebee on June 10, and they charged my credit card on June 13. Now it is July 8, and they still have not shipped it. They can't even talk to me they let the phone go to their answering service, and then send an email saying it will take a while! I am not real impressed by their service.
    Jon
     
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  8. S Keith

    S Keith Well-Known Member

    I've messaged the owner and directed him to your post.
     
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  9. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    A 2019 Fit LX , which cost around $19K when new , is selling for
    $22K with 29K miles on it. Ouch.
     
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  10. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Yeah, I wanted Honda Fit, but got our last Hyundai Elantra for under $13,000. There was no contest. AND it appears our two reliable Elantras WILL eliminate future purchases of cars till 2030+.

    As high as used cars are now, I doubt a used Elantra with 29K miles can sell for $22,000. If one can’t afford a used Honda Fit, check out an Elantra or even a cheaper Hyundai Accent.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2022
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  11. jmelson

    jmelson Well-Known Member

    I got the new battery yesterday, and put it in. A seat bolt broke off, and 2 of the Torx screws stripped out the Torx socket, but we got it in, and the car starts.
    I will have to see if the check engine light goes out. I bet it will, and expect the gas mileage to improve, too. Thanks for pointing me to Bumblebee!
    Jon
     
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  12. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Jmelson:

    Keep us informed on this pack replacement as soon as you have some miles on it.

    It is a sad state of affairs that a small Hybrid battery pack costs this much when OEMs are paying as little as $130/KWh. :(

    Wayne
     
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  13. S Keith

    S Keith Well-Known Member

    [rant]

    Being deep into various battery technologies, I'm not going to join the outrage on costs.

    Toyota charges their dealerships $1,100/kWh for Gen2 Prius packs. Significantly more on all others.

    OEMs pay $130/kWh in massive quantities. Consumers can get very close to that pricing if purchasing LFP production fallout (cells that don't meet EV standards, but are otherwise great for things like off-grid storage, etc.).

    The U.S. is at least 5 years out from having any input into the Lithium supply chain.

    Increased demand is going to outpace supply.

    The year over year decline in Lithium battery prices has stopped, and it started increasing BEFORE the supply chain issues. Lithium batteries are almost certainly going to increase in cost from this point forward.

    CATL Sodium batteries are fairly promising, but they are still recovering their R&D costs. They will come down while Lithium rises, and Sodium will eventually become cheaper. Then increased demand will put pressure on supply and Lithium/Sodium will pretty much cost the same $/kWh with a small premium attached to Lithium for weight.

    The a$$hats promoting Lithium for grid storage need to STFU and GTF away from lithium. There are many better, cheaper and more reliable technologies than having a big farm of Tesla storage. One does NOT need lightweight high density battery storage for the grid. Lithium = Dumb, and it only makes the supply issue worse.

    My prediction: We're going to plod along for the next 5-10 years with fairly stable but steadily increasing battery costs until a significant "breakthrough" makes it to the production status. Then we will see another incremental improvement in cost and power density. Rinse and repeat every 10-20 years.

    Oh, and more nuclear reactors please. :D

    [/rant]
     
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  14. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    I agree. Clean , safe nuclear energy is what civilized countries use.
     
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  15. jmelson

    jmelson Well-Known Member

    Well, not a whole lot of miles so far, I am largely working from home lately. But, the check engine light has stayed off, the mileage diaplay is starting to go up, and it seems to work well. I have not seem a recalibration since the first couple miles on the new pack. So, I am pretty happy with it. Of course, this is like the joke about the guy who went to the gas station and tripled the value of his car. I seriously increased the value of my car, at least with what I put INTO it.
    Jon
     
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