C-MAX mileage

Discussion in 'Ford Hybrids' started by Paymaster, Oct 18, 2012.

  1. Paymaster

    Paymaster Well-Known Member

    I know there is a mileage log but I thought at first anyway it might help to put some numbers here. I just put in my second tank. I had an indicated 43.9 mpg with 11.29 gallons used for 496.3 miles. That was indicated however it took 12.254 gallons to fill it up for an actual 40.5 mpg. The first tank seemed pretty close to indicated but this is the first one that I filled it up both times. I know there can be some variance on the pump shutoff but you wouldn't think the indicated vs actual fuel usage would be off by almost a gallon.
     
  2. all_about_the_glide

    all_about_the_glide Well-Known Member

    My theory is an average of at least 5 fills with the same protocol before you can figure actual. Unless of course you do a Wayne neck to neck fill.

    Drove one today...loved the interior, driving position,view, ride, handling... very perplexed about the wanna be EV hybrid system: Over the same 7 miles back to back cmax was 47.7 Vs 60.5 in my hch2. Pictures and details later. Saw a Fusion Hybrid fresh off the truck... beautiful.
     
  3. brick

    brick Answers to "that guy."

    See how it does over a few tanks. Fillup-to-fillup variation can be surprisingly large, even in a car with a normal (solid) fuel tank. Some pumps are more touchy, some vehicles are more sensitive to fill rate than others, some have tortuous filler necks that give inconsistent fills...you get the idea.
     
  4. NeilBlanchard

    NeilBlanchard Well-Known Member

    Right, try to use the same pump at the same station to get as consistent fill ups as possible. Also, you need to learn how to drive any vehicle that is new to you. And real traffic conditions are tough; and weather conditions also will have a strong effect on FE.

    Factory FE indicators are almost always optimistic. You need to check the odometer for accuracy, which you can do with a GPS unit or on a measured highway for 20-30 miles and see how accurate it is.
     
  5. CRT1

    CRT1 Newbie McNewbster

    Does the C-Max have an over-eager throttle? Are you testing
     
  6. Paymaster

    Paymaster Well-Known Member

    I haven't tried any controlled tests yet. I am just driving my normal routines. As for the throttle, I don't think it is over eager. I have been about as gentile with it as I can, much more so than on my Civic Hybrid. Today I was 45 mpg to work. I did hit 49 on the way to work the other day but it was warmer and less windy. The drive home though brought it down to 45 for the day. At least in this weather(40-50 degrees) I think that 45 mpg is the best I can hope for, and that is with trying. I had hoped for better but if I can maintain that in these conditions I will be okay with it. I know it will go down as it gets colder.

    I am just under 1500 miles so far.
     
  7. CRT1

    CRT1 Newbie McNewbster

    Paymaster,

    Are you a hypermiler or are you just driving gently but normal?

    Are you using E10 or pure gas?
     
  8. southerncannuck

    southerncannuck Well-Known Member

    To me 45 mpg is wonderful. After a certain point it's nothing more than a numbers chase. The difference between 45 mpg and 55 mpg is less than a gallon a week, based on 12K miles annually. Sounds like a home run for Ford.
     
  9. Paymaster

    Paymaster Well-Known Member

    CRT1- no, I am not a hypemiler. At least not yet. Basically I do my best to coast to stops and take off from stops at a fairly slow pace. I have also been trying to get it to go into EV mode as much as possible which is new to me. I was recently shown some hypermiling techniques and I have played with those some but for the most part I just drive.

    Southerncannuck - I drive about 30,000 miles a year so I will notice the drop from my HCH2 but the C-MAX is a nicer car than the Civic so I guess I am okay with it. I just have to work a little harder than I did before to get the mileage.
     
  10. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    A small tip -- you want to avoid electric propulsion as much as you can to maximize efficiency. EV mode should be used to induce an engine off glide with as close to no use of power as possible. There are lots of conversion losses associated with using electric propulsion in a non-plugin hybrid.
     
  11. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    45 MPG for a 47 MPG EPA hybrid is embarrassing. I'm not knocking you or your efforts ,Paymaster, but I am calling out Ford for "gaming" the EPA. Also, your results aren't too bad for a green (not-broken-in) car. I hope you'll see much better tanks.
     
  12. 08EscapeHybrid

    08EscapeHybrid Moderator

    Trying to stay in EV mode as much as possible may be hurting you. If you run EV to the point where the engine starts to charge the battery, it will rev the engine unusually high to try to charge the battery quickly, which is bad for your mileage. Also, there may be instances where you can do things like accelerate or go up hills in EV mode. but it may be more efficient to do these with the engine running.

    When I first got my Escape, I tried to keep it in EV as much as possible, and my mileage was not what I expected. There's a time and a place for EV, and after a while you'll know which instances you'll be better off with the engine running rather than trying everything to keep it off as long as possible.
     
  13. elem

    elem Well-Known Member

    Maxing the EPA----:flag:

    Possible if they started with a fully charged battery, given the high speed EV mode capability.

    Are the EPA numbers quoted for ECO mode?

    Andrew
     
  14. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Elem:

    The EPA is onto that game and designed their test protocols for hybrids around that possibility quite some time ago. They measure the packs capacity before a given test and IIRC, subtract for a lower number at the end of the test if it did not achieve its steady state SoC at the end? I will have to make some calls to make sure but SoC is accounted for in the test cycles and you cannot game it with a maxxed out pack at the beginning and a depleted one at the end.

    Wayne
     
  15. lolder

    lolder Well-Known Member

    The direct drive efficiency of a hybrid ICE through the eCVT is probably over 95%. The efficiency through the EV cycle is only about 70%. Non-plug in hybrids should avoid EV. It's advantage is at low speeds below about 40 mph, transient acceleration until the ICE speeds up and regen braking. P & G with a hybrid where you avoid any HVB current flow yields 30% gains over steady speed EV cycling.
     
  16. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Lolder:

    Except when the system was designed around these rules.

    The HSH/KOH run EV at highway speeds and when the ICE starts, its HSG charges the pack quickly while the 2.4L also powers the wheels for another ICE-Off highway drive cycle a few minutes later.

    Wayne
     
  17. elem

    elem Well-Known Member

    Thanks Wayne

    I believe that they would be unlikely to game it as it would leave them open to litigation.
    Are the EPA tests just dynanometer? Cd maybe poor?

    Andrew
     
  18. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Andrew:

    Yes, the EPA tests are all conducted on the dyno and Cd is taken into account with the dyno settings.

    Wayne
     
  19. CRT1

    CRT1 Newbie McNewbster

    Edwin, back off Paymaster. He just said that he is not a hypermiler (yet) so I would not expect him to beat EPA. If you go over to Priuschat many of those Prius guys don't beat EPA in their Prii. It seems that for an average driver the C-Max is delivering about what is expected. A little over six months ago I was getting just under EPA in my FIT. :eek:

    Paymaster, with a little bit of knowledge and practice you should be able to boost your FE 10-20% I am guessing. Read the threads about how to drive various hybrids and take note. As 08EscapeHybrid says, you don't want to use the engine to charge the battery to drive the car, especially at highway speeds. Forcing EV at highway speeds will hurt your FE. The most efficient path for power is from the ICE to the wheels, but only when you need power. Otherwise try to get the ICE to turn off and glide around in EV where and when you can, especially at lower speeds, down hills, in traffic, etc.

    Best,
    Chris
     
  20. Paymaster

    Paymaster Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the advice, and I didn't take Edwins comment as criticism. I know it is different but I have been driving a 2006 Civic Hybrid that I bought new. With that car without any effort at all upper forties weren't a problem. With the C-MAX that isn't going to happen. I will see what I can do about keeping it out of EV mode but so far it seems that if it can go to EV mode it does without to much coaxing from me.
     

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