The 2010 Yamaha WR250X Review Has Begun…

Discussion in 'Street and Performance Bikes' started by xcel, May 26, 2010.

  1. warthog1984

    warthog1984 Well-Known Member

    Looking good. Now I'm almost wishing I found a used 250 after the KLX deal blew up.

    Wayne-

    In between IB rides and dodging twisters, give me a shout so we can schedule a ride together before that beauty goes back to whence it came.
     
  2. beatr911

    beatr911 Tightwad

    I like how this is coming together. Quite the farkle fest.

    When you hit the west coast, you can give it an off-pavement test in my backyard (literally) in the Capitol Forest www.capitolforest.com.

    On your way south lets scrape pegs up to Windy Pass and see the volcanic crater of Mount St. Helens riding through the bast zone of the volcano. A ride you'll never forget - trust me.

    Looking at the WR, I'm getting the itch for a new, fun bike. Currently only at salivation, almost to drool.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2010
  3. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Marc:

    What are you doing tomorrow? It looks like rain but maybe in between, we can knock out some miles around the suburbs… I have to place some miles on it to make sure everything is sorted out anyway? I think I may do the IB on Sunday as it should be cooler, less chance for tornadoes (like those are out to get us :D) and possibly even a better chance of success.

    Beatr911, I cannot wait to get out there as you as you have a “to die for” ride planned up to Mt. St. Helens!

    Both of you would love the WR250R or X’s. While on the slightly expensive side, very low mile - used WR’s can be found in the $4K or less range. The WR’s FI adds a mid-range and high RPM punch that the others in the class cannot come close to matching. In addition, any climbing and the FI adjusts without losing power like a jetted carb will do through any 3,500 to 5,000' delta. The WR's long suspension adds a softer ride for the first 3 + inches and when setup, can provide a decent amount of traction and flat ride over the most inhabitable of undulating terrain. The 26,000 mile Valve adjustment interval is almost insane in the bike world with most at 7,500 or less.

    For those with shorter inseams including female riders as short as 5', the WR's can be lowered as much as 5"! The Ergonomics while tall, are stretched out (even better than the 1200 GS and GS Adventure we rode last month!) let alone the almost unfathomable number of HQ accessories available for this very popular Dualsport (the R)/Supermoto (the X).

    Finally, I have to thank many members of the WR250forum for their past experience in selecting the best of the best add-on gear to make the WR "100-mpg - Quarter Liter Adventure-Tourer" Project bike ride even imaginable let alone doable. At least I think it is doable ;)

    Wayne
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2010
  4. msirach

    msirach Well-Known Member

    Do you have an out the door cost as you have it equipped now?
     
  5. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Mike:

    I was going to create separate review threads for all of this but here goes…

    The following is the "retail" prices for the bike and most of the gear which of course can be found for a discount. Knock off $1,000 for the whole list... I did not include the Big Agnes Insulated Air-core (~ $75), Slumberjack 40 degree sleeping bag (~ $50 ) or the Seal Line 30L Dry bag (~ $27).

    2010 Yamaha WR250X - “100 mpg Adventure Touring Project Bike"

    Column1Column2
    Bike, Std. Gear or AccessoryRetail Pricing
    2010 Yamaha WR250X$6,490

    Aerostich Darien Jacket$427
    Aerostich Fleece Liner$127
    Aerostich Darien Pants$297
    Aerostich Back Pad$75
    Aerostich Hip Pad$35

    Alpinestar SP1 Leather Gauntlet Gloves$79.95

    Aria XD-3 Helmet$569.95

    Avon Distanzia Front Tire - 120/70 R17 58H$112.99
    Avon Distanzia Rear Tire - 130/80 R17 65H$125.99

    BMW Cross Gloves$59.00
    BMW GS Rallye Boots$389.00

    (2) Canari Gel Liners$30.00 each

    (2) EVS Sports Ultimate Shorts$55.00 each

    Gerbing's Dual Output Controller$99.95
    Gerbing’s Heated T5 Gloves$169.95
    Gerbing’s Heated Jacket Liner$199.95
    Gerbing’s Heated Pants Liner$199.95
    Gerbing’s Heated Insoles$59.95

    Giant Loop Fandango Tank Bag$149.95
    Giant Loop Great Basin Soft 50 + L Rear Bag$399.00

    IMS 3.0 Gallon Fuel Tank$274.95

    Moto Billet/Fastway F5 Pegs$129.95
    Moto Billet Rear Rack$139.95

    GPS Ram-Mount$49.95

    Ricochet Skid Plate$89.95

    RoxSpeedFX 2” Anti-Vib risers$149.95

    Slipstreamer Spitfire Windscreen$79.95

    Spider M1 Grips Off-Road/Motard$16.95


    Miscellaneous 12V socket, wiring, foam tape and connectors came to ~ $35.00.

    I have a Cardo Systems Scala Raider G4 (dual even though I only needed a single) Bluetooth Radio/Cell Phone/MP3 player Communication system setup to try out. Those are $419.95 for the dual and $219.95 for the single setup. I have yet to even read the directions so I had better get cracking on that!

    Wayne
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2010
  6. warthog1984

    warthog1984 Well-Known Member

    Wayne-

    See PM. The Bandit can only handle F2 twisters and below, so we may have to dodge the bigger stuff;).
     
  7. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Marc:

    Yeah, an F2 will relocate the roof really well and may even blow a biker off the road... Darn Tornadoes always sneaking up on those bikers at every turn :D

    Tomorrow at 01:00 PM if that is ok with you?

    Good Luck

    Wayne
     
  8. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    Marc (WH1984) came down so we could go for a WR shakedown ride yesterday :)

    [​IMG]
    Marc and his Bandit on the Shores of Lake Michigan yesterday…

    Wayne
     
  9. warthog1984

    warthog1984 Well-Known Member

    Hi everybody:

    Posting some of my impressions from yesterday when Wayne was kind enough to let me ride the WR250X for part of the shakedown trip.

    The first thing I noticed when I walked up to the WR is just how tall it is. Getting a leg over with my 31" inseam required a fair amount of stretching. Once on the bike, however, the suspension settled enough to get both feet on the ground and I was ready to take it out on the road.

    On the highway, I immediately noticed the Yamaha's MX background- its single cylinder 4-stroker required fairly high (>3000) revs to smooth out but would drop rpms quickly- more inline with a 2-cycle engine than the V-Twins and I4s on previous bikes I've ridden (Nighthawk 250, Bandit 600). Those who like shifting or the scream of an environmentally-friendly pseudo-2-stroke will enjoy the project bike's engine and tall gearing.

    After getting the WR250X going fast enough not to lug, I started noticing the differences between it and the standard 600 I had been riding. The Yamaha is very light with its mass distributed evenly throughout its tall, skinny frame- A real plus for visibility or around-town errands. Those with mountain bike experience will feel right at home, while newbies will appreciate the "big-bike" feel and increased cager awareness. The only downside of course, is that compared to my shorter and wider bike, the Yamaha's 180# weight advantage and 4" taller frame left me much more aware of lean angles and required more throttle to stay upright when hauling it over on its side. Additionally, I found that the pegs- setup for Wayne's 6'+ height- were very far away and I had to reach for the gearshift.

    A very capable bike, overall. Would I trade my UJM for one? Probably not, given my typical 30+ mile highway commuter use. But for someone who likes their street motorcycles "freshly-mudded" or is looking to maximize savings on an around-town runabout with occasional long trips, the 2010 Yamaha WR250X belongs on any shortlist.
     
  10. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    And now to the details of the bike… I was supposed to be on an Iron Butt ride to the East Coast this morning but had to postpone due to our test ride. Regarding the upgraded WR250X, some of the mods are a must have, do not even bother starting it up before installing them. Some were good, and one is not ready for our uses. Unfortunately that “one” is the most work to revert back to OEM :(

    Let us start out with the good.

    Moto Billet/Fastway F5 Pegs: A spectacular addition to the WR250X! Not only do they allow a bit more room thanks to the low Boy position, the flat platform when standing adds a degree of stability I have never experienced on a bike before. Really good stuff here!

    Moto Billet Rear Rack: I have only attached a few items to it using bungie cords and it worked as expected. I will have it loaded up for a few lengthy rides planned over the next few days including the Iron Butt and the 100-mpg attempt ride back to LA. Solid as a rock and it is so damned good looking with the some of the best machine work I have seen from an OEM accessory anywhere!

    RockSpeedFX Anti-Vib 2” Risers: Yet another HQ addition. Reducing vibes through the incorporated rubber isolation while also making the WR much more comfortable for someone 5’-10” or taller. I thought there would be a lot more bar movement while still heading straight yet there was none. You can tighten them up even more to reduce any rubberey feel the isolations may have induced but from their arrival on a mostly asphalt ride, I did not feel any unintended movement whatsoever. They will however get in the way of lowering the front forks in the triple clamps as they mount over the inner edges of the fork tubes from the OEM bar mounts with the bottom end bolts allowing at most 1/4 of an inch of rise before they come into contact.

    RoxSpeed FX Anti-Vib Riser and IMS Prototype tank topped off

    [​IMG]

    IMS Prototype – Larger cap tank: .99 gallon from a portable fuel container as shown previously and then a short ride to a local station < .5 miles away for the top off. I filled 1.796 gallons plus ~ 1/100th of a gallon to start up the WR for 15-seconds or so the other night and ride the WR to the station yesterday morning. All total, 2.801 gallons from bone dry to topped off…

    When topped off using the IMS prototype cap, any movement of the bike and a small amount of fuel squirts out the top. With a tank bag, this could be a problem so a word to the wise, without an anti-evap OEM like cap, don’t top off the IMS as you will have a small amount of fuel leaking underneath your bag base and down the side of your tank until a few ounces are consumed.

    Size, 2.8 gallons from the prototype (3.0 + the final production unit will include) is certainly better than the miniscule 2.1 the OEM tank can hold and will come in quite handy when riding across Wyoming, Idaho and Oregon ;)

    Slipstreamer Spitfire Shield: If you are doing long slab rides, this low cost add-on is absolutely the bomb. It allows some air flow to catch the upper part of the chest while reducing the wind blast down the Interstate by at least a factor of 5. Marc and I rode some higher speed sections of I-94 from Milwaukee back to the IL/WI border and at 65 + mph, the buffeting is way down and the constant reminder of being pushed back and bounced around is almost eliminated. On the terminal speed run in both directions, the Bike in fifth w/ new gearing to match the OEM in sixth topped out at the same 82 mph per the Garmin.

    Yamaha GYTR accessory 14T front/40T rear sprockets: If you run over 45 mph, yet another addition I thought was very worthwhile. While most are throwing on lower gears on the off-road capable R’s (12/48’s seem to be a common swap) in order to add punch, moving up adds a much needed subdued quality not available from the OEM gearing while on the super slab. The Speedometer is now reading two to 3 mph under actual while above 45 mph vs. the 6 + mph over as the OEM stock readout provided. This is a plus for making sure you do not get run over but a negative in case you are prone to speeding tickets. Nobody here would be prone to that, right ;)

    Some warned me about a first gear launch may need some clutch work with the taller gearing. I did not find this to be the case other than when launching in the dirt and climbing over a small curb when I killed twice while being my usual non-aggressive self. Other than that, launches from a standstill felt hardly any different from OEM stock which was pretty low to begin with.

    One negative item all OEM WR250’s incorporate is a rather significant throttle tip in between fuel cut and the injector coming online. Carbureted bikes do not really have this but a small displacement single with literally no inertia having fuel injected where there was none before can be slightly disconcerting during the on-off power addition. Any WR rider will tell you that you get used to it quickly but the taller gearing removed much of the “tip-in launch” without negatives that I could tell so far…

    While I have always searched for the mythical 7th gear on every bike I have ever ridden including the OEM WR250X, this was the first time that I only did that once and it was a downhill section at 55 + mph when I asked for it. In some cases, I accidentally found myself in fifth when there was another gear available above 45 mph! The Yamaha accessory gearing really feels right for an all-pavement rider. For much of my riding, I was actually swapping between fifth and sixth and back again allowing me more choice to match the terrain and speeds I was riding vs. OEM in sixth the entire time and wishing for more.

    For those that believe this setup would be too tall, drop back a gear for your technical sections and it places you right back at OEM. Drop back two gears for those doing the wild short gearing and you are right into the sweet spot. All the while making 45 to 70 mph speeds far more relaxing as I had hoped when beginning the project. I was initially considering far taller gearing than the almost 15% addition through Yamaha directly and I am so glad I did not make that mistake. The WR250 engineers were on the top of their game when offering the 14/40 gearing solution through Yamaha itself. This is about as high as I would want now that I have experienced it firsthand.

    Ricochet skid plate: I incorporated this addition due to its aerodynamic qualities. The underside of the bike (just about every aspect of the bike and rider) is a real mess in terms of aero qualities. The Ricochet plate smoothed out the entire under section portion of the engine/frame while still offering an oil drain hole and 10-minute bolt-on experience. I used a thin strip of foam tape between the frame rails and the skid plate so as to eliminate the possibly of the two beginning to vibrate and sing as things loosen up over the miles. Very easy install, great bash protection and it sure does cleanup the short section under the engine itself.

    Spider Off-Road/Motard Grips from RockSpeedFX: Yet another soft and comfortable feel over OEM. While I cannot speak of vib reduction due to the vib reducing riders doing all the work, At a touch over $16.00 and another must have.

    The Ahhh Ohhhs…

    Regarding the Avon Distanzia's… First, let me say the Distanzia’s add some on-highway stability over and above the OEM Bridgestone BT90’s. While riding a rain grooved cut concrete section of I-94 through downtown Milwaukee, the wallowing that had to be corrected for with the OEM BT90’s was almost absent with the Distnazia’s. Same section of road with the two different tires and two different feelings of stability. Less twitchy might be a better description for it.

    For light off-road, there was a section of light, hard packed sand I was riding through and the Distanzia’s made this ride doable without the washing out feel that the OEM BT90’s were prone to whenever leaving hard asphalt or concrete. Confidence inspiring on both the slab and clean off-road trail that I was very pleased to experience.

    Finally, the BT90’s have a tendency to skip a few mm’s when turning hard on rougher sections with lots of sealant filled cracks. Although I only have ridden through a few sections similar to this with the Distnazia’s attached, the unnerving skip that the BT90’s had was absent with the Disntazia’s and these were brand new tires without a mile on them until two days ago!

    And now the negatives :( The tires are much heavier as discussed earlier and the weight is added at the worst location (at the outer ends of the wheels) for a lightweight 250. I thought about just installing the rear when I finally had the rear OEM BT90 off and weighed it against the Disntazia but decided to install front and rear and let the results be what they may…

    Column1Column2Column3Column4Column5Column6
    ManufacturerTireF/RSizeWeightCircumference
    AvonDistanziaRear130/80 R17 65H16.25 pounds79"
    BridgestoneBattleax BT90Rear140/70 R17 66H9.5 pounds76.75"

    AvonDistanziaFront120/70 R17 58H9.5 pounds72.625"
    BridgestoneBattleax BT90Front110/70 R17 54H6.25 pounds72.5"

    The slight extra weight caused a slightly heavier feeling when swinging the bike around. Not anything that would procure riding the bike by any means but just a heavier feel when maneuvering the bike from side to side. This probably accounts for the increased higher speed highway stability too!

    Acceleration effects. The heavier tires cause you to have to use a lot more throttle to get to speed than the OEM’s. At first I thought this could be entirely contributed to the taller gearing installed so I began using fifth gear to match OEM’s sixth. The bike was lugging during any acceleration under my standard acceleration scenarios (vey light and as easy as traffic allows) vs. the OEM which I could keep just above lug with similar throttle inputs. During the first high speed terminal run, it took almost ½ a mile to get up to the same terminal speed as before (in fifth gear to match the OEM 6th gear) vs. ~ 1/3 of a mile from 50 to 80 + with the BT90’s. I was WOT for a lot longer period and running out of real estate before reaching and holding that same terminal of 82 mph.

    And the crux of the matter. The new 14/40 gearing and slightly taller Distanzia in the rear had to be accounted for with any future distance/FE calc’s. I did a short 15.2 mile run two nights ago for a ball park offset. With a reset Trip A, 13.6 miles rolled off over ~ 15.2 miles for an 11.76% negative offset. I used this for the first two fuel economy calculations of the lightly modified WR250X Adventure Touring Project bike.

    Using the 11.76% offset, Marc and I rode from my home, through somewhat scenic farm country on County highways and through some of North Milwaukee’s finest stop light to stop light traffic conditions. This was a very similar run and on some of the same roads as the Review rides first tank which allowed slightly over 105 mpg.

    From the Adventure Touring Project bikes initial fill in Kenosha, WI to my home and then to Milwaukee, the results came in as follows…

    51.4 miles via Trip A (~57.44 miles actual with 1.117 gearing offset applied) /.731 gallons = just 78.587 mpg. This is way too low for the bikes intended goal!

    As mentioned above, I did perform the one WOT Terminal speed segment over an ~ 1 mile distance which consumed ~ .0333 gallons (1-mile at just 30 mpg) which I will take into account in the final calculations below…

    From that fill, we rode a higher speed mostly Interstate run to Miler Park. I wanted to get a longer distance calibration offset so I reset Trip B at the Miller Park Exit and Highway 18 and off we went. Google Maps listed the trip at 49.0 miles and the Garmin listed it as 49 miles to destination. Just before arriving at our destination, I stopped for a second short tank, higher speed top off to top off FE calculation which revealed the following:

    52.7 miles indicated (~ 58.9 miles per the first short distance 1.117 gearing offset applied)/.829 gallons = 71.049 mpg.

    Final long distance offset calculations - We arrived at our destination with Trip B showing 43.1 miles ridden while Google and the Garmin said it was a 49.0 mile ride. This longer distance odometer calibration leads to a 13.689% negative offset which I can now take into account for fuel calc’s above.

    Top-off to Top-off City/Country Short Tank #1: 58.4 miles/.731 gallons = 79.94 mpg

    Subtracting the ~ 1-mile Terminal speed run and fuel consumed from the Short Tank #1 calculations…

    Top-off to Top-off City/Country Short Tank #1: 57.4 miles/.698 gallons = 82.27 mpg

    Top-off to Top-off Higher Speed Highway Short Tank #2: 59.9 miles/.829 gallons = 72.27 mpg

    Avon Distanzia Conclusions

    While offering a number of benefits including a light off-road capability to the on-road based WR250X, improving highway stability and adding cornering confidence through rougher sections, the lower speed stop sign to stop sign and light to light FE was decimated to the tune of almost 23%! The higher speed all Interstate rides at 72 + mpg was not bad at all however. All said, the Disntazia’s do not harm the X’s FE when running at higher RPMs, higher LOADs but any stop/start like riding and they are a fuel economy killer :(

    Because of the slower speed FE detriment, I have to pull the Disntazia’s and re-install the OEM Bridgestone BT90’s for the cross-country run. It is too bad too as it sounds like Beatr911 has some off-road Mt. St. Helen’s riding areas we will traverse where the Distnazia’s would be perfect vs. the cussing I am going to be giving to the OEM’s while taking the same route across the same and hoping not to dump the bike in the process! If only the Avon’s were constructed from a lower rolling resistance compound and were lighter weight to match the OEM’s, they would be the bomb for me. For most WR250Xs riders, the Distanzia’s provide all and more over and above the OEM BT90’s and I would not dissuade anyone from purchasing one of the best true dual sport tires available for those that ride the on-road WR250X.

    2010 WR250X on the Shores of Lake Michigan

    [​IMG]
    Riding across a short segment of hard sand and brush to the shores edge.​

    Good Luck

    Wayne
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2010
  11. alvaro84

    alvaro84 Homura-chan's selfishness

    Huh, a long read :) I've been lurking but did not have anything useful to say or ask, but now I may do :eek:

    Starting here:

    These numbers look pretty normal to me (we often get similar results with our bikes without any mods), not as extreme as you did in the reviews :D And I have a bunch of questions starting from here. I have no experience with the effects of mods but you went into details with the tires, you may know more about the other mods you mentioned here.

    - How did risers affect FE? They give a more comfortable, upright position but may increase aero drag. Though it may be compensated by lowering the rear end :confused: And did I just answer that there's no answer this time? :confused:

    - How much did the taller gears help? I'm especially curious about it, I think it may worth to do the same to Ciliegia (5th can be used from 25mph on and revs close to 8000 on the freeway at 70mph...)

    - A pretty uneducated question (sorry): Doesn't that 'beak' hurt aero? (I see you left it intact.) The most apparent difference between the F650GS and CS' shape is that the GS has a beak; and there's a small difference in their FE (not scientifically, but measured by my f650.hu board mates on a longer trip) the CS having a slight advantage. Of course there are many other differences (even their final drive and tire sizes are different), but can this be a factor?

    - What's the effect of the tire compound on FE? Should I switch to a harder rubber next time? It would affect their lifespan too, but as I'm an all-weather rider, now I use tires that are considered good and sticky for touring rubber (Metzeler Z6), inflated a bit more than BMW recommends. Can something with a harder compound help FE or it doesn't worth the difference in the traction on cold and wet roads (I never scratch my footpegs, have some chicken strip and I'm even more careful in wet/cold weather)?

    These questions may can not be answered through this particular experiment, but you have so much experience with so many different vehicles that you may know anyway :eek:
     
  12. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Alvaro84:

    Just got back from the Sam’s Club and swapped out the Avon Distanzia’s for the OEM Bridgestone BT90’s… Again :rolleyes:

    As posted yesterday, the Avon’s were a great to the WR for rougher corning and straight line stability on the concrete or asphalt plus added an off-road confidence the on-road only BT90’s will never have. The only negative being the 50+ % greater unsprung weight at the edges of the wheel where it takes the most HP and torque (read Fuel) to get them moving and keep them moving. They were very close to the perfect compromise but the FE hit was just to harsh for our purposes. For higher speed slab ride, the Distanzia's would not harm FE hardly at all as evidenced by the 72 + mpg while riding the Interstate at higher speeds. Where they got nailed is the stop and go stuff when every acceleration has to be performed perfectly and the extra mass at the outer edges just hurt too much :( On a bike that idles with 10 + HP like the 650’s on up, the Avon’s would probably not harm the FE nearly as much but on the smaller 250’s, there is some good power given the hopped up Motocross engine heritage but 22 HP at WOT and maybe 3 to 4 HP from idle is not much when trying to move a great amount of tire and wheel weight around.

    The RoxSpeedFX Anti-Vib Risers do not really set you up any higher but reduce the reach to a more comfortable upright position.

    Here is the OEM reach:

    [​IMG]

    I do not have a pic of the riding position with the Risers and lower pegs installed (modded) available yet but will get one soon hopefully.

    The taller gears are only helpful after 45 mph which is where the WR250X began to rev. The almost 15% taller gearing really made a difference on the highway as I stopped grabbing for the extra gear. It was darn near perfect for 45 to 70 mph in fact!

    For the lower speed segments, I will not be in 6th gear nearly as much as previously but swapping between 5th and 6th to match traffic and terrain. A choice I was lacking with the short OEM WR gearing previously. At 55 to 65 mph, it makes a huge difference as the bike is not nearly as buzzy. At 70 mph she begins to rev high but that 10 mph faster than she used to begin to get buzzy and a welcome relief indeed.

    The Slipstreamer Spitfire windscreen does not hurt aero as the terminal velocity of the OEM w/out screen and modded Adventure Bikes with are equivalent at 82 mph. Now that I have the OEM BT90’s back on, I will do some terminal tests again tonight and I can bet its higher. A bikes aero gets killed mainly because we are sitting in that air stream and humans are not to aerodynamic ;)

    The Windscreen’s purpose is twofold however. It reduces the aero drag against me and reduces the buffeting that all bike riders experience as gusts form passing vehicles or just wind gusts continue to blow us around. In this respect, that Spitfire has scored an absolute 10. At speeds up to 82 mph, the drag and buffeting have simply vanished! I am really impressed with this as it is only a 31/2 to ¾ height screen yet reduced the chest blast to hardly anything. Better than the 1200 GS’ we drove last month in fact. Just another mod that worked out so darn well I wish more WR, KLX and CRF riders would consider for their 250’s.

    Regarding tire compounds… Just like cars, some tires are lower rolling resistance than others. When the WR was brought to market back in 2008, Yamaha intentionally placed a decent road tire BT90’s on the WR250X but they were not the stickiest that it could have came with. They are however low rolling resistance which was discussed in its initial release. Today, low rolling resistance does not necessarily mean they are harder or less sticky given many low rolling resistance automobile tires offer wet and dry traction rivaling the std. RRc tires. For bikes however, they receive pretty good FE right off the showroom floor so few if any manufacturer is pushing the bikes for it… There is a lot of tweaks to be made to bump the numbers up of course but nobody is taking advantage of the low hanging fruit just yet. When gas hits $10.00 per gallon in Europe, you can bet BMW and the Asian manufacturers will be clamoring all over one another with new and far more fuel efficient designs to one up each other on the marketing front. At $10.00 per gallon, even 70 mpgUS becomes extremely expensive as it is like driving an SUV (17 to 20 mpgUS FSP) in the US the same distance at our $2.89 USD per gallon prices today.

    And for the BMW… Go with whatever is on them until they wear out. Europe will have that Fuel Saving rating on their tires by the and of next year or in early 2012 IIRC and maybe the Motorcycle tire manufacturers will be forced to rate their tries on the same scale? If so, you will have a good system to pick a decent traction tire with great fuel economy potential. Today, it’s a crap shoot as nobody really reports FE increases or decreases when swapping tires out on their bikes :( At least we know of one site that did ;)

    One other item I forgot to mention about the Moto Billet/Fastway F5 Pegs. My left boot now fits under the shift lever without squirming around to make a shift and I am not missing gears nearly as much as I was with the OEM pegs and lever in its OEM position.

    Finally, I received a CamelBak HiViz Hydration system in the UPS today. Just made it so I will have a write-up on that before this is all said and done as well!

    CamelBak HiViz
    [​IMG]

    Good Luck

    Wayne
     
  13. alvaro84

    alvaro84 Homura-chan's selfishness

    It would be an interesting development of events :)
    Of course I won't replace the tires until they wear, it would be a great waste! They're pretty new. OK, they're on since last October and have rolled 12,000km~7,500mi since then, but hopefully they're not at the half of their life yet.

    On the windshield: I have a set of a windshield adjuster brackets for the F650CS, I just lacked the motivation to equip them :eek: It would be another interesting experiment and may save me wearing earplugs on main roads and freeways, but I don't have any exact method to determine how they affect FE yet. I can't use the terminal velocity to determine their effect, because
    1. it's too high even at a freeway
    2. it's the rev limiter that stops me from accelerating over 175km/h (109mph) indicated

    A coasting test might be the best approach - to start coasting from the exact same speed at the same point, same wind and temperature and see how far I can get before my speed drops to a specific value. Both upright and tucked position.
    I must not be this lazy :mad:
     
  14. beatr911

    beatr911 Tightwad

    Rolling resistance figures for both motorcycle and car tires would be a welcome addition to tire purchase information.

    With respect to gearing, if models targeted to fuel efficiency begin to creep in maybe we'll see more 7 or 8 speed transmissions. A wide ratio 6 speed would be pretty good but lacks the close ratio spacing needed to wring the absolute maximum out of a small engine, and have a deep low gear for slow speeds.

    The heavy Distanzas I'd guess are due to a tough casing to minimize off-road punctures. What are the ply ratings for the two tires?

    Sitting close to a small windshield can make a huge difference in comfort. Not having done any aero testing with/without windshields, I'm a little suprised that it would be better with the shield. It seems to me that the greater frontal area would be a detriment if anything. Hey, if it works, it works, 'nuf said. Sometimes increasing the ability to ride more often and longer far outweighs any negative effects it may have.

    Last weekend I was ecstatic over the possiblity of picking up a 1989 Honda NX250, <2200 miles, excellent conditon. A very rare bike that is a 26hp liquid cooled thumper motard-ish styling. The first of it's kind marketed to us Americans, it didn't sell all that well, but would be a great seller these days. The front fender though, was like a streetbike letting plenty of cool air to the radiator and much improved aerodynamics. On my '82 XL 500 the dirtbike fender blocked most of the cooling air on the street. This hot-running motor would routinely warp the cam cover and leak oil all over the exhaust. Lucky for someone else, the NX sold within hours of posting on CL. Time is short before the ride, but using a front wheel hugging fender would help clean up the front end a little.
     
  15. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Alvaro84:

    The coast down sounds like a good test but any lengthy long distance RT A-B ride with and without should tell you one way or the other. I would also always wear my hearing protection even with a windscreen as noise levels are simply too high for long term hearing health.

    Beatr911, the OEM Radial Bridgestone BT90 uses three belts, 2 Nylon and one Aramid. The Radial Avon Distanzia uses 3 belts, all Rayon. Like you said, possibly the off-road puncture resistance makes the Avon a much more substantial tire and thus the added weight?

    Last night when I swapped the tires back to the OEM BT90’s, I pinched the rear tube so I picked up another this afternoon and its back to 100%. Heading over to my parents to install the rear and do some odometer offset calculations (the OEM has a slightly smaller circumference than the Avon Distnazia and still have the new 14/40 gearing installed), FE calc’s and final shakedown ride later this evening.

    Cardo’s Scala Rider G4 Communication Gear

    I configured the Cardo Systems G4 Scala Rider and boy does that work nice. A little lacking in the tuning and quality sound department but configuring Bluetooth for the Cell phone was a breeze! It also includes an AGC circuit which increases volume with increasing ambient background (think of higher speed within the helmet) so we will see how that works as well? To pick up a call, just blow or speak into the mic and it wakes up, picks up the call and you are talking via Cell while heading down the road. We will see how it works in practice later this evening as well?

    I could not get two Bluetooth phones to synch with the Garmin 1490 so that Navi unit is suspect regarding its Bluetooth capabilities…

    The Slipstreamer Spitfire does not really add any more frontal area as it has just a slightly larger face than a rider’s lower helmet, neck, arms and chest. What it does do however is clean the airflow up a touch and from my 150 miles on the modded Adventure Bike so far, it has performed superbly in that regard.

    CamelBak HiViz

    I also filled up and configured the CamelBak Hydration System with the Aerostich. Really high quality construction and design for that system too! We'll see how 60 to 70 ounces feel on my back and closing off some of the Darien’s ventilation later this afternoon as well.

    Good Luck

    Wayne
     
  16. warthog1984

    warthog1984 Well-Known Member

    From experience with CAP: very heavy after 3-4 hours, but a lifesaver on very hot, humid days especially in slow traffic. Whenever we had been out in the sun for 6-7 hours, there started being a noticeable difference in the liveliness, body temp, and even mental capacity between the guys with CamelBaks and those of us stuck with canteens.

    I put it down to more water and much easier access leading to less of the scorch-dehydrate-refresh extremes.
     
  17. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Marc:

    Thanks for the CamelBak experience discussion.

    New results

    Results with the OEM’s BT90’s after I replaced the rear tube and got both BT90’s back on saw her FE pop right back up again.

    I took a ride to Milwaukee last night and early this morning over the approximate same routes previously ridden but rode a bit further West to put a good 50 + miles on the short tank.

    I topped off when I left and per the non-adjusted Odometer, 53.3 miles later added .572 gallons to top off for a 93.1818 mpgUS calculation. This does not include the new gearing offset.

    I then headed back to Milwaukee’s Miller Park to do the lengthy odometer calibration but by the time I reached the I-94/894 split, the WI DOT had shut down the Interstate for night time road work??? The alternate took me through North Milwaukee on 27th Ave towards Rawson Rd. before heading back to the Interstate. I reset at that intersection with the Garmin indicating it would be 38 miles to my destination. I arrived with 33.7 miles per the OEM odometer and Google calculated the route out at 37.6 miles.

    37.6 miles actual / 33.7 miles OEM Odometer = 1.115727 or an 11.573 percent offset thanks to the new YGTR 14/40 gearing vs. OEM 13/42.

    Going back to the top off to top off fill, 53.3 miles per the odometer indicated = 59.468 miles actual / .572 gallons = 103.965 mpgUS.

    I am pretty tired given the early morning hours and will fill in the CamelBak HiViz hydration and OEM tires now that I have an A-B-A completed.

    Wayne
     
  18. beatr911

    beatr911 Tightwad

    Frozen Camelbacks are like AC. When I lived in Barstow, CA for a few years, bicycle training rides in the 100F heat were murder unless measures were taken. One day I tried it on the motorcycle and thanked the Good Lord for the brilliant idea! Wearing it under the jacket allows for airflow through the vents.

    Keeping the spine and upper back cool do wonders for keeping alert and comfortable. I used an insulated Camelback to prolong the effect and not freeze my skin, lasted 2 or 3 hours. Do not fill the bladder completely to allow for expansion! -Garth
     
  19. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Garth:

    Thanks for the tip! It was 75 degrees and muggy all last night and the CamelBak did impede the Darien’s ventilation. Because it is such a nice and bright HiViz however, I really should use it on the outside of my jacket. Maybe for day-time riding go under and at night, go over when its cooler?

    Regarding the mouth piece. There is no way to tie it up under my Aria XD-3. Just not enough room so I just let it hang from my right and reached over with my left to pull the cap, open up the valve and feed it up for a quick drink. I would close it off and cap it up before I dropped it back to hang by my side. While not optimal, it worked and gave me the ability to drink while driving down the pavement at 55 to 70 mph.

    Cardo Scala Rider G4

    At speeds below 40 mph, it worked great! Phone calls could be received and local FM stations could be listened to. At speeds above 45 mph, it did not work out at all. The instructions say to get the ear speakers as close to your ears as possible so I have to work on that today for better listening at speed.

    The AGC worked fantastic up to the 45 mph level when it becomes mixed in with the high dB of the wind rush. At 40 mph or so, the speakers were loud enough to hear music just fine. Slow down to a stop in an AS and they would quiet right down. Close the shield or open it and the volume would change.

    All said, a very nice design other than when above 45 mph. My time is too short to come up with a good working solution for that :(

    A-B-A from the OEM BT90’s to the Avon Distnazia’s to the OEM BT90’s again.

    First off, the 11.5% taller gears do not rally effect the slow speed operation with the BT90’s. With the Avon’s, the WR was lugging at any speed below 40 mph. With the BT90’s, 33 to 35 mph just as with the OEM gearing. Almost a completely different bike in that regard. Because I rode the I-94 cement section w/ the rain grooves through Milwaukee, the OEM’s showed that slight wobbly feel whereas those Distnazia’s all but removes it. In addition, at 70 mph, the OEM BT90’s allow you to be thrown around on the road when passing vehicles whereas the Distanzia’s were much more stable. To think that 10 extra pounds of rotating mass would change the nature of the bike this much is incredible.

    I did a 1-block section of gravel road four times and the OEM BT90’s were like trying to keep your speed and balance up in sand. Anyone that has ridden sand knows that feeling as you try to get the bike to float and then let it meander side to side with minimal input from you to keep it upright and heading in a generally straight line. The Avon’s were a lot more stable on this section. They offer so much more stability and utility with light off-road but for our purposes, the FE hit is simply too harsh :(

    The WR250X

    I think its ready... Or at least I hope so anyway? I will do an oil change on it this afternoon and off to Boston I go probably tomorrow.

    Good Luck

    Wayne
     
  20. skierd

    skierd New Member

    Not at all surprised by your mileage figures, especially given my own experience with the bike.

    My best mileage with my first one (which was stolen over new years, long story) at just about 76mpg. Filled up with gas in Boise City, OK and then 155 GPS miles later in Trinidad, CO. Not 'hypermiling' either, though I knew I had to be extra careful with the throttle given the distance between potential stops and the terrain ahead. Not bad considering I was carrying about 50 pounds of gear with me (including extra gas, just in case, but I wanted to see how far I could get her to go) in a pair of saddle bags and a tail bag. That bike was stock except for gearing (13/47 instead of the stock 13/43, new 0-ring chain also) and tires (120/90/18 Dunlop D606 instead of the stock 120/80/18 deathwing).

    The current bike hasn't gotten close to those figures, but I haven't had a chance to ride it similarly yet either. Best on it was 67mpg blasting up and down the switchbacks on CR55 in West Virginia trying to play keep away from some guys on sport bikes (amazing how well a dirt bike can handle the curves :D ). It was an easy one to calculate, as I had only traveled 67.1 miles (GPS) since my last fill up and put 1.00x gallons in. Again the bike was loaded for camping, though carrying about 20 pounds less and much of it closer to the bike. This is with fuel efficiency killing mods too: FMF Q4 exhaust, power programmer, and opened up air box, 13/46 gearing, and a much taller than stock pirelli mt43 trials tire at 12psi. Another WRR rider on the same ride with nearly the same mods (differences are a power commander, no autotune, instead of the power programmer and added the FMF powerbomb header) got significantly worse mileage, in the high 40's, on the exact same route at near enough the exact same speeds.

    BTW thanks for posting over in the mega-thread and the WRR/X forums. I've used some of your techniques in my daily riding and have seen a 3-5mpg increase without losing any of the fun factor.
     

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