Diesel Automobiles Clean Up for an Encore

Discussion in 'Diesel powered automobiles' started by atlaw4u, May 22, 2008.

  1. atlaw4u

    atlaw4u Well-Known Member

    Volkswagen says it will be the first to market with diesels clean enough to pass muster in every state. Jetta TDI sedans and wagons are due to arrive in August.

    [xfloat=left]http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/2008_VW_Jetta_SEL_Front.jpg[/xfloat]Lawrence Ulrich - NY Times - May 18, 2008

    AFTER years in the automotive wilderness, largely exiled to the smoky borders of truck stops, diesel is coming home. Americans may not recognize its freshly scrubbed face.

    A 19th-century invention by Rudolf Diesel, the diesel engine has always been known for outstanding fuel efficiency, with better mileage (by 25 percent to 40 percent) than gasoline. But the kerosenelike fuel and the engines that burn it were dirty, noisy, dawdling and even deadly, linked to increased risk of cancer and respiratory disease.

    That has all changed, in part because of cleaner-burning fuel — its 2006 rollout had been mandated in 2000 by the Clinton administration — that has 97 percent less of the sulfur responsible for diesel engines’ sooty particulates.

    The low-sulfur fuel, hailed by the Environmental Protection Agency as a historic advance, has opened the door to sophisticated emissions controls that let diesel engines meet the strict pollution standards of California. Those rules, the world’s most stringent by far, require 2009-model diesels to be as green as gasoline or even hybrid models.

    In the meantime, advances like turbocharging and high-pressure fuel injection have transformed diesel cars from soot-belching slowpokes with a telltale clickety-clack sound to smooth, tidy and powerful machines that many Americans would have a hard time distinguishing from gasoline models.

    With technical and environmental hurdles overcome — and facing tougher mileage standards that call for a 35 m.p.g. average by 2020 — automakers are rushing in with clean-diesel cars....[rm]http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/18/automobiles/18DIESEL.html?ref=automobiles[/rm]
  2. toastblows

    toastblows Well-Known Member

    Just in time for $5+ gallon diesel. Corporate auto america dropped the ball again i guess. My gas civic now costs less per mile than my 50mpg diesel.....$3.55 vs $4.59 price difference makes a bad arguement for diesel these days...and china's huge thirst for diesel will a) go away soon, b) never go away.......b.
  3. msantos

    msantos Eco Accelerometrist

    Yes... one of the redeeming paragraphs in this article: Keep it positive and frame the bigger picture since we're all in this together.


  4. GreenVTEC

    GreenVTEC Well-Known Member

    The important thing to remember is even if they cost more than a comparable hybrid long term diesels will still have their attraction.

    It's all from the fact a diesel can get better than average economy while still being driven by the average lead foot American driver. Many American's like torque and power, so buying a diesel makes sense for these people. Some of these people will NOT move into a slower more efficient car. Better they at least get 50 highway mpg than 30 in a similar basic performance car like a 3 series.
  5. Vooch

    Vooch Well-Known Member

    Indeed - the Hybrid versus Diesel tempest is silly; each power train has its pros and cons - fortunate for us, we are soon going to have lots of choice !

    But bad news - the Sunday NYT has a similar promo on the tier II Bin 5 diesels - they showed the forthcoming Jetta TDI as only getting 33 City and 46 HWY.

    can anyone else confirm these nos>
    Last edited: May 22, 2008
  6. bikersupermoto

    bikersupermoto New Member

    hello from glasgow, scotland!...

    we have had the tdi vw/audi/seat/skoda (all the same engines) cars for many years here now, the latest models are more luxurious and therefore heavier than before and the figures you have there are not far off depending on how you drive them!...many brits drive the tdi (we have had the 2.0 tdi for about 3 years here now) and its gets around 35-40mpg around town and around 50mpg on the motorway if you dont drive too aggressively!

    my own car, i drive the honda civic (european version) es, i-ctdi car.....americans need to know some things about european diesels before they think its the alternative to high fuel prices!

    here in uk petrol (gas) is now around the 5 pounds a gallon (us$10) mark and diesel is about 5.30 or just under $11 a gallon.

    my civic diesel gives me around 46mpg around town and 55mpg on the motorways. according to honda i shud be getting 49 and 60mpg respectively so dont believe the manufacturers figures! they are not too far off, but dont be expecting miracle economy!.

    in the winter time in scotland we go down to around -5c, in these temps the diesel (due to its thermal efficiency) takes forever (20 minutes) to warm up and produce any cabin heat, so your windscreen takes ages to de ice and its not very nice in freezing cold wet weather to wait so long for the car to heat up. audi hav pre heaters in their cars to speed up the heating process but they use fuel and you end up back at petrol model mpg figures if you use the pre heater.

    when u start the civic in the morning its clattery as is vw/audi/seat/skoda (they use the same vw/audi group engine)... u know its a diesel car!. once its warmed up its quieter but you still know its diesel!.

    vw/audi group cars apart, most of the diesel cars here (especially from japanese companys) are manual gearbox only. i dont like that, but the vw/audi hav the dsg (automated manual) option which is a fantastic combination with their diesels. but the vw 2.0 tdi engines are noisy and gruff altho they offer some of the best fuel economy figures.

    the best diesels we have here in terms of refinement are the french cars, peugeot and citroen, they are so quiet and smooth that never mind knowing its a diesel, it can be hard to tell the car is even turned!. peugeot/citroen have been making and refining the diesel for a long time and seem to have cracked the noise/refinement aspect very well.

    why dont i hav one, well great engines, but electrics are the french weak spot and things go wrong with them when they get a bit older, i put up with my unrefined civic because its japanese, its reliable and its got the room i need and saves me a little money at the pumps!.

    when about 10 years ago in uk diesel cars began to get more popular due to the better mpg figures, the government taxed diesel higher so now its more expensive than petrol, so as long as the american government doesnt start to do the same if american people start to switch to diesel in large numbers like happened here in uk, then the better mpg of diesel cars shud help to ease the pain.
  7. bikersupermoto

    bikersupermoto New Member

    something else to bear in mind, the diesel cars drive very differently to petrol engined cars especially in manual form.....they make most of their torque/pulling power from around 1500-3000rpm, where when pushed the car can pull forward really hard, but after about 3,000 many diesels tail off and u need to change up to get the pull of the 1500-3000 band of power.
    an automatic takes care of that but the way you change gears is different in a diesel and in town driving can be quite relaxing as you get lots of pull without too much revving!.
    once you get used to it, a petrol manual car seems hard work to drive!

    for those of you interested in the european honda civic diesel, have a look at our website/forum where you can read owners fortunes and foes with these cars - www.civinfo.com
  8. Squint

    Squint Member

  9. bikersupermoto

    bikersupermoto New Member

    ummmm....hav vw/audi group figured into fuel figures passenger & driver weights???.....the size weight of the average american is nothing like the average weight of a german!!!.....most germans are fit and slim (some exceptions), most americans (75% ish) are so overweight!....u need fuel to move that weight around!
  10. donee

    donee Well-Known Member

    Hi Biker...,

    Are you aware of the differnce between UK Gallons and US Gallons ? The UK gallon is so overweight. About 1.2 times the size of a US gallon. And that is 100 % of them UK gallons are overweight.

Share This Page