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Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
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05-29-2012, 12:45 PM
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PZEV, there's nothing like it :)
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Vehicles: Accord, Ranger, and anything else ;)
Location: Northern Illinois
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Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
Latest projections by Honeywell predict one-million new turbocharged vehicles will be on US roads this year alone.
Wayne Gerdes - CleanMPG - May 29, 2012
The highly regarded 2012 Chevrolet Sonic when equipped with the 1.4L turbo and 6-speed stick is only one of many current and future automobiles being provided fuel economy and performance benefits thanks to a Honeywell turbo.
With fuel costs remaining near $4.00 across much of the country and some locales paying far more (California), Honeywell released an unabashed write-up about how its Turbocharger group is working with auto manufacturers to meet an ever increasing demand for affordable and fuel-efficient downsized turbocharged engines that save money at the pump without compromising performance.
Honeywell estimates the number of turbocharged commercial and passenger vehicles sold in North America is projected to reach 3.2 million in 2012, up from 2.2 million in 2011. Passenger vehicles alone account for nearly 850,000 additional turbo engines a 61 percent increase from 2011.
Tony Schultz, VP for the Americas, Honeywell Turbo Technologies:
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"It's a proven technology that can be used across market segments and has been a fuel economy driver for decades in the United States."
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Honeywell's turbocharging technologies is a key enabler for replacing larger naturally aspirated engines by downsizing to a smaller turbocharged engine with improved fuel economy and equal or better performance.
According to J.D. Power, turbochargers were fitted in only 2 percent of gasoline vehicles produced in the United States in 2008, but that figure jumped to 9.5 percent in 2011 and is expected to more than double to 23.5 percent in 2017.
The EPA has cited turbocharging as one technology helping to make engines more efficient by allowing automakers to shift to smaller engines. A smaller turbocharged engine can provide a 20 to 40 percent fuel economy improvement and deliver the same performance as a larger engine.
Industry data points to the ongoing downsizing trend as the average engine size in North America is decreasing from 3.6L in 2007 to a projected 2.9L by 2016.
Honeywell Turbochargers are incorporated in Ford's award winning and highly recommended EcoBoost lineup as well as both the Chevrolet Sonic and Cruze 1.4L. The 2013 Dodge Dart will also feature a fuel-efficient Honeywell turbocharged 1.4L engine as is the diesel models of the Chevrolet Silverado and Volkswagen Touareg.
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Last edited by xcel : 05-29-2012 at 09:38 PM.
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05-29-2012, 05:50 PM
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Bible Scholar, Environmentalist
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Vehicles: 2001 Honda Accord; 2009 Honda Pilot
Location: Weatherford, TX
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
Would slapping a turbo in my car help MPG?
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05-29-2012, 06:36 PM
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Veteran
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
No, if you had an engine with a turbo, to get the best mileage, you'd want to drive it so the turbo never engages. When running, a turbo has the same function as a cold air intake, it crams more air and fuel into the cylinders so it produces more power at the expense of burning more fuel. These new turbo'd engines allow the auto manufacturer to put a smaller engine in the car that, if non-turbo'd, would give an acceleration expected of a typical car from the 70's (15-20 sec 0 to 60 times), but with the turbo running, allows the engine to produce sub 10 sec 0 to 60 times. You gain the fuel efficiency of the smaller engine, but with the power output of a larger engine. But in addition to poor mileage, I'd expect extended use of the turbo would reduce the engine's life, and most turbocharged engines also require premium fuel.
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05-29-2012, 06:44 PM
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PZEV, there's nothing like it :)
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Join Date: Feb 2006
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
__________________
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05-29-2012, 08:23 PM
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Bible Scholar, Environmentalist
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Vehicles: 2001 Honda Accord; 2009 Honda Pilot
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
sarcasm doesn't work on the internet..
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05-29-2012, 09:28 PM
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Veteran
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
Any measure that gives a temporary boost to engine performance can be beneficial, in that engine size can be reduced. Honda's second gen civic hybrid engine (1.3 liter) had a cam shaft with two cams for each intake valve, one with more lift. Normally the low lift cam was used, but under heavy load the higher lift cam came into play, shifted over by hydraulics I think.
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05-29-2012, 10:09 PM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 932
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
Turbo's -- useful in fuel efficiency ,.... as long as they aren't used..
Turbo's -- they put the catch 22 in fuel efficiency.
Last edited by Carcus : 05-29-2012 at 10:18 PM.
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05-29-2012, 10:43 PM
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Veteran
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
The turbo cannot propel the auto on its own so in my estimation it can only hurt FE over all? I agree with Carcus! H
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05-29-2012, 11:10 PM
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Senior Member
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
Isn't the simplist way to look at small displacement "fuel frugal" DI turbo gasoline engines (or diesels for that matter) ... the turbo allows the acceleration "kick" [torque] under heavy throttle over the rpm range similar to a larger engine while allowing "at speed" cruising without turbo for the fuel economy of the smaller engine?
Cruising at Psl can often be accomplished "on the flat" with less than 25 to 30 hp for a moderate size/weight vehicle for lower fuel cosumption in the proper configuration.
Over simplified I'm sure ... but, I think it is close.
Further, fine manipulation of operating window and various parameters with the assistance of turbo and other technologies can significantly influence emissions ... for better or worse.
There is an interesting discussion about the twin turbo SkyActiv-D and it's emissions management ... speed limited at 5,200 rpm [any US diesel close to that rpm?], see
http://www.mazda.com/mazdaspirit/sky...kyactiv-d.html
Is this close enough?
Last edited by 50 mpg by 2012 : 05-29-2012 at 11:33 PM.
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05-30-2012, 07:42 AM
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Veteran
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Re: Turbocharging Is the Real Deal
Turbos on spark motors are finally helping.
1)They should drop the weight of the engine -which means everything else can be lighter
2)They should allow lower friction losses-at 2500 RPMs friction losses are less-much less-than at 3500 rpms
3)The smaller fewer cylinder motor-should have less total friction surface-smaller diameter pistons shorter stroke
Of course you only "need" maybe 60 hp to hold a Suburban sized vehicle at maybe 80 mph-so yes the 360 hp dual turbo 3.5 Ford pickup motor is being used to produce power and FE.
Now the 20-40% just by virtue of downsizing and turboing-is a HUGE overstatement.
Hy the 3.5 is 22mpg GMs 5.3 V-8 is 21mpg- 5%-city about 2 mpg-so maybe 8% overall.
Of course the 5.3 GM is a very mature design-very efficient-the dual turbo 3.5 probably has "more FE" i its future.
Turbo spark motors reappeared in late 70's early 80's-in response to a fuel price runup.
They died out then because1) gas went down in price-2)The 4 valve non turbo 4's started developing more and more power 3) They weren't reliable-cooked their bearings etc 4) Didn't have the electronic controls we have now
Yeah turbos are hear to stay this time-DI also.
They make small TD's pointless-cheaper and approaching(maybe 90%) TD FE
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