The Think City: they're building your first electric car

[xcel]

And it's solid and safe, with charisma to boot.

Dan Neil - LA Times - June 25, 2008

2008 Th!nk City -- All-road legal BEV with 112 miles all electric range (AER)

When the price comes down a touch, can you imagine anything better for an inner city car? -- Ed.

OSLO, NORWAY -- INGVIL LADEHAUG is battery challenged.

Her laptop is running out of juice. Her cellphone is down to its last electrons. But the director of communications for Norway's Think -- beginning production in September of perhaps the best electric car in the world -- feels good about our chances of getting home.

"We're going to make it!" she squeals as we cross back into Oslo proper. "Fantastic."

It's been a long day for our adorable yellow test car. This morning we headed for Think's factory in Aurskog, some 40 miles into the bluegrass Scandinavian countryside, with about an 85% charge in the car's advanced sodium-cell battery. But Ladehaug -- who is directionally challenged, too -- got us turned around. Now, after several course corrections that added perhaps 20 miles to the trip, we're both eyeing the battery gauge, while warning lights flash ominously. Still the Think City -- a 2,449-pound runabout with plastic body panels and an official range of 112 miles on full charge -- hums along… [Read More]

[BailOut]

While I'm glad to see the world of EVs advancing again this one doesn't sound promising. The price is too high. Sub-$20k might have a fighting chance but $25k plus monthly fees for a subcompact is just too much.

I also think the proposed monthly fees of $150 to $200 are exorbitant. Ignoring the initial vehicle cost, gasoline would have to top $8/gallon for the monthly fees to be considered reasonable for me.

Combine all that with the limited production run and I doubt it will be my first EV. The reality is that most of our first EVs will likely be from China rather than Norway if things continue on their current path.

[c0da]

Those past crash videos from Chery still make me cringe at the thought of riding in those deathtraps... Those sedans had the same crash rating as the old Metros!

[FireLikeIYA]

Quick math and the battery lease makes sense... From what I can gather, fully electric cars can only get roughly 100K out of the batteries. If the vehicle would normally sell for 35K but they are willing to give it to you for 20K plus a 200 lease it would initally save you the 15K. It would take 75 months at $200 to equal that 15K (Think of it as a 0% interest loan!). If you drive 15000 miles a year like most people I know then in 75 months you would have accumulated over 93K miles on the batteries. Say in 75 months the cost of the batteries dropped from $15K to $10 K depending on demand you still wouldn't be shelling out all that cash at once. Continue to make the $200 lease payments until a better or more exciting car comes along and sell the Think. There would be no loss in battery investment on a car that has over 100K miles on it at this point and whoever buys it would not have to worry about the batteries because the lease covers everything! It seems like a win-win situation to me.

[brick]

I want to want it, but the "mobility fee" just sounds like a car payment that never ends on top of the car payment that I would already have. And since it would be a commuting and shopping-only car, I would only drive it about 1000mi per month. That means that even if electricity were free, gasoline would have to cost $9 to $12/gallon for it to make sense vs. the car I already have. But it will be nice for the people who are made of money.

[Kurz]

Thats the price of moving from a proven technology to an experimental one.
Batteries for cars is not widespread.
So with the Lease it protects you, the person who buys your car,
And society in general will like the idea.

I spend close to 200 bucks a month with 4.00 gas.
So to me its just an exchange for the short term.

Though I would love to have a car that has the battery fees included in the price.
Then Have the company replace the batteries... once, twice before the replacement is gone?

[WriConsult]

The price is exactly what you should expect for a vehicle for advanced batteries. The only way you're going to get a real EV for under 20 grand is with (heavy) lead acid or (verboten, thanks to Cobasys/Chevron) NiMH batteries.

I think the battery lease is a good idea. These batteries are relatively unproven in long term automotive problems. This protects the consumers from problems that might crop up.

I say the price of this car is perfectly reasonable for what it is -- despite the fact that the economics don't work for me. But that's true of any new car. In general, practical people on budgets buy used cars, not new. We always have to depend on early adopters and the less frugal to forge the way for us. Those of you with more money to throw at transportation -- PLEASE buy these when they come out!

[mparrish]

I don't want an EV with 120 AER. I don't want a PHEV with 20 AER and a gas tank. I want an EV with 20 AER (along with good public transportation to boot for longer trips).

I have a feeling I'm a very small market. But that car might indeed only cost $12-15k? I'm buying batteries I don't need with this thing. It would be my commuter. This is a good EV for long commuters. How 'bout some more options?

[Dan]

Originally Posted by mparrish

I don't want an EV with 120 AER. I don't want a PHEV with 20 AER and a gas tank. I want an EV with 20 AER (along with good public transportation to boot for longer trips).

I have a feeling I'm a very small market. But that car might indeed only cost $12-15k? I'm buying batteries I don't need with this thing.

Well just sign on the dotted line, and $11,220 gets you a Hymotion L5 pack installed by Christmas which would probably yield a 10-15 AER. 11,220 after TTL is a bit rich for me. I'd bite at about half that price, so I'll have to sit and watch for now.

11011011

[mparrish]

Originally Posted by Dan

Well just sign on the dotted line, and $11,220 gets you a Hymotion L5 pack installed by Christmas which would probably yield a 10-15 AER. 11,220 after TTL is a bit rich for me. I'd bite at about half that price, so I'll have to sit and watch for now.

11011011

Yeah, but it's $24k for the Prius plus $11k for the upgrade.

I'm talking about Marc's fictitious world where he doesn't own any automobile, and just buys a cheap EV only for his 10-15 mile AER driving needs, with great public options for trips longer than that.

I'm just talking about fantasy land.

And it's too rich for me too. I'm still holding out for the PHEV that is perfect for my needs & wallet.