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A request for SGII X-Gauge programing help.

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Old 04-26-2011, 06:00 AM
The Bun-yip's Avatar
The Bun-yip The Bun-yip is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Vehicles: Mazda3 1.6D TS
Location: Southern England
Posts: 2
Question A request for SGII X-Gauge programing help.

In my introductory post here: http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showt...970#post305970 I described a major need to be able to use X-gauges to be able to monitor some crucial parameters of the PSA/Ford Particulate Filter operation used in my Mazda3 1.6D.

My ScanGaugeII (Ver 3.16) shows CANSF as the mode that was auto detected. I have successfully input the X-Gauges for Engine power. (Kilowatts in my case) and Turbo boost. The latter was found here. Thanks. Both gauges appear to function correctly during a short test run.

The additional parameters that are needed to address my ‘regeneration’ problem appear to be included in the standard list of PIDs described in the Wikipedia article here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OBD-II_PIDs

Initially I wish to monitor the load on the DPF. From an examination of some data here: http://www.phones-direct.ro/public/f...r/Test-uk.html I think it will be measured as a percentage.

Temperature measurement in Centigrade is required for the DPF temperature. My Guess is that the temperature range may fall between some notional ambient value say zero degrees C and perhaps as high as 700 degrees C. (There are other PIDs I should like to measure but I do not want to swamp anyone with a large list.)

The Wikipedia entries are as follows

Mode_____PID_______Description
(hex)______(hex)

01________7C________DPF Temperature
01________86________Particulate Matter Sensor

To me it seems certain that there is simply not enough information available above to code an X-Gauge for these PIDs. My Googling has not revealed any further information for these PIDs either. Then again my search skills are pretty basic.

Ques. 1. Is it possible that using the ScanGauge Commands (MORE>MORE>CMNDS) function it might be possible to interrogate the bus for the PIDs and discover the information needed to enable one of the resident experts to write the code for the RXF, RXD and MTH entries?

Ques. 2. Can anyone offer me any ideas or even step by step instructions that might lead to success for the X-gauges I would love to have?

Unfortunately my retiree's sole remaining brain cell failed to grasp the intricacies of hex programing outlined in the ScanGauge documentation and discussed more fully on this forum. I had kidded myself that I might have been able to work it out for myself. It is frustrating to have to admit that I am not going to be able to sort it out for myself.
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Old 05-14-2011, 11:43 PM
CarlD CarlD is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Vehicles: 2005 Ford Escape Hybrid
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 427
Re: A request for SGII X-Gauge programing help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bun-yip View Post
In my introductory post here: http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showt...970#post305970 I described a major need to be able to use X-gauges to be able to monitor some crucial parameters of the PSA/Ford Particulate Filter operation used in my Mazda3 1.6D.

My ScanGaugeII (Ver 3.16) shows CANSF as the mode that was auto detected. I have successfully input the X-Gauges for Engine power. (Kilowatts in my case) and Turbo boost. The latter was found here. Thanks. Both gauges appear to function correctly during a short test run.

The additional parameters that are needed to address my ‘regeneration’ problem appear to be included in the standard list of PIDs described in the Wikipedia article here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OBD-II_PIDs

Initially I wish to monitor the load on the DPF. From an examination of some data here: http://www.phones-direct.ro/public/f...r/Test-uk.html I think it will be measured as a percentage.

Temperature measurement in Centigrade is required for the DPF temperature. My Guess is that the temperature range may fall between some notional ambient value say zero degrees C and perhaps as high as 700 degrees C. (There are other PIDs I should like to measure but I do not want to swamp anyone with a large list.)

The Wikipedia entries are as follows

Mode_____PID_______Description
(hex)______(hex)

01________7C________DPF Temperature
01________86________Particulate Matter Sensor

To me it seems certain that there is simply not enough information available above to code an X-Gauge for these PIDs. My Googling has not revealed any further information for these PIDs either. Then again my search skills are pretty basic.

Ques. 1. Is it possible that using the ScanGauge Commands (MORE>MORE>CMNDS) function it might be possible to interrogate the bus for the PIDs and discover the information needed to enable one of the resident experts to write the code for the RXF, RXD and MTH entries?

Ques. 2. Can anyone offer me any ideas or even step by step instructions that might lead to success for the X-gauges I would love to have?

Unfortunately my retiree's sole remaining brain cell failed to grasp the intricacies of hex programing outlined in the ScanGauge documentation and discussed more fully on this forum. I had kidded myself that I might have been able to work it out for myself. It is frustrating to have to admit that I am not going to be able to sort it out for myself.
Well, for question 1 the answer is yes, you can go to CMNDS and enter:

017C and then hit SEND and see what comes back. It should be something rather like:
417Cxxxxxxxx

and similarly enter 0186 for the 8C PID.

but if you get something like 4110xxxx or the like where the third and fourth digits don't match the 7C (or 86) then likely the vehicle does not support the PID.

If you do get a response, for temps you might be able to deduce the scaling by looking at the values after the vehicle has been sitting a while and everything is at ambient temp. A lot of Ford temp PIDs have an offset of -40C and unity scaling.

The tried and true method of decoding PIDs is to hook up a factory or similar scan tool and listen to the CAN traffic using a y-cable from the OBD-II port. I will check my source for Ford PIDs to see if I can uncover any diesel stuff.

EDIT: have found the following European diesel PIDs which may or may not work and/or may or may not be of interest:

Pre-particulate Filter Temp:
mode 0x22 PID 0x0992
Enter 220992 in a CMNDS memory and hit SEND

Differential Pressure on Particulate Filter
mode 0x22 PID 0x09E2 (also discovered this as PID 0xC90A)
Enter 2209E2 in a CMNDS memory and hit SEND

Exhaust Gas Temp PreCAT
mode 0x22 PID 0xC907
Enter 22C907 in a CMNDS memory and hit SEND

Exhaust Gas Temp PostCAT
mode 0x22 PID 0xC908
Enter 22C908 in a CMNDS memory and hit SEND

for these the response should be 62 in front of the PID, i.e.

620992xxxxxx

6209E2xxxxxx

62C907xxxxxx

62C908xxxxxx


-cd-

Last edited by CarlD : 05-15-2011 at 10:26 AM. Reason: added PID info
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Old 08-08-2012, 04:16 AM
maertl maertl is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1
Re: A request for SGII X-Gauge programing help.

Hi Carl,

I've been using Scangauge II for a few weeks now, and it is working great.
My car is a European Ford S-Max with two liter diesel engine (2.0 TDCi).

My original intention was to monitor the particulate filter, as there are no indicators in the dashboard. I've spent quite some time to find the required Ford specific PIDs, but was not successful. I also sent a request to Scangauge, but didn't get any response. The only relevant PID which I could get to work, is one of your previous post:

Differential Pressure on Particulate Filter
mode 0x22 PID 0x09E2

It returns valus from 30 to 100 at idle well up to 2000 a high revs and hight load. It corresponds well to drinving conditions, yet the scaling is unclear. Also ist is not a very practical value because of dependance on momentary load and rpm.

What would be much more interesting are values like:
- distance since last regeneration
- filter soot load (%)
- average distance between regenerations
- temperature at or before filter (your posted PIDs don't work in my car)
- filter regeneration status (active/passive/off)

I'm sure, that some or all of these values are available in CAN somewhere. I would appreciate any help in finding the corresponding PIDs and the scaling. Maybe your "sources" have some hints?

Thanks in advance
Martin
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:11 AM
Squonky Squonky is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1
Re: A request for SGII X-Gauge programing help.

Apologies for the essay, but I think this info might help some people.

I've had some success in using the OBD-II interface to detect when my '57 reg Focus 1.6 TDCi is doing a DPF regen cycle. Thanks to a previous post, I have discovered that the EGT reading comes out on mode 22, PID 0992. I'm using the Android Torque app with one of those £12 Chinese BlueTooth ELM interfaces. I have it configured to send 220992 and the result is 2 bytes of actual sensor data, which appears to need the standard ((A*256)+B)-40 to turn that into a degrees C reading. My guess is that this really is degrees C. It won't read lower then 100C and quickly starts rising from there about 30s after a cold start. Trundling around town gets me about 200-250C indicated and motorway cruising at 60-70MPH gets 300-350, depending on load.

One night on the way home, I put my foot down going up a hill on a dual carriageway and it took off: 400... 500... 600... and topped out at 611C on my rudimentary gauge. Unfortunately, I was only 3 minutes from home and it's downhill all the way. Coming into town I could see that the ECU was trying to keep the EGT up above 500C. I went round the roundabout and back up the dual carriageway and let it finish its business. This was noted when about 10 minutes later, the EGT started to plummet and quickly got back to around 200 as I arrived home. On tickover, it's 150-190C.

In past days, I've seen it start a regen cycle approximately every 150-200 miles. Because it has no real intelligence, it always seems to do it JUST before I get home, or get into heavy traffic, or get off a fast road. Other interesting phenomena: A regen cycle is preceded by the intake air temp rocketing up from say 5C to 50C in just a few seconds. I'd wager that it was closing the intercooler bypass. If I didn't have the OBD gauges, I wouldn't know it was happening. No discernible difference in performance, instant MPGs or coolant temp.

Thanks to other posters, I am also able to get what appears to be the DPF differential pressure reading out on 2209E2, but this info is useless to the layman. Treating the 2 bytes output as separate hex digits seems to work: ((A*256)+B) gives a reading that tracks RPMs and engine load. As might be expected, there's a HUGE disparity between tickover and motorway cruising.

I tried to normalize the reading by dividing by RPM but that doesn't work because you could be at 2000 RPM with 15psi of turbo boost, or you could be at 2000 RPM with your foot off the pedal, decelerating down a hill. Also tried dividing by MAF reading, but that's no good either.

I have come to the conclusion that the differential pressure reading is utterly useless on its own for determining % DPF loading (blockage factor). I am sure that the ECU in the car must populate some data table while you're driving and can thereby, over a period of time see a gradual increase in differential pressure against a calibrated set of characteristics programmed by the manufacturer.

As Maertl says, what we really need is to find the OBD-II PID that tells us what the ECU's calculated % reading is. I can understand why manufacturers don't display this information to the driver - I've nearly gone off the road several times, obsessing and tinkering with my EGT gauge. On a commercial airliner which flies itself for 90% of the journey, it's quite OK to have 100+ gauges telling you everything from the EGT on 4 engines to the toilet flush water level. Not so in a road-going car.

In conclusion, I need to do what this guy did: http://www.phones-direct.ro/public/f.../index-uk.html and build my own microcontroller-based gauge that gives a simple bar graph EGT reading. Coupled with an audible beep whenever a regen cycle starts (i.e. EGT goes over 500C) and job's a good-un. I can use the OBD EGT readings to calibrate the analogue measurement from the sensor, because it's sure to be non-linear. The big advantage of having a separate, analogue measurement of EGT is that it doesn't tie up the Bluetooth on your phone, having an OBD app running all the time.
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