CleanMPG Reviews the 2013 Mazda CX-5

Quite simply the most affordable and highest fuel economy compact crossover available in all of North America.
Click here to read the entire review

The diesel (IF it makes it here) would be very nice.

However, this 2.0 6mt version will probably remain the highlight in CUV "bang for the buck/true cost to own" category.

Hey 50mpg, I was doing really well and then about 2/3 of the way through your post I hit my acronym limit! Damn, I was so close to understanding it completely

But I get the gist, it's an air quality regulation thing. As long as the regs are more stringent here, from the manufacturers point of view there's no incentive to make diesel work, other than as a market research tool to make sure they don't miss a sudden surge of interest in diesel tech.

I'm torn, I'm glad we have the air quality standards (in here in California we have even more-stringent standards than in the rest of the 49 states), but on the other hand if we had a huge market like the U.S. pumping money into Diesel it seems like we would move the tech forward more rapidly.

jm

Hi 50 mpg by 2012:

While we have reported a number of times that the SKYACTIV-D would not use NOx aftertreatment, there was a report from I believe Auto News or the Detroit Free Press about 6-months ago saying Mazda may need an LNT to meet T2/B5? I have looked over every doc on the Japan and US media site and there is no mention of this other than the addition of a highly ceramic based DPF they will be using for the Mazda 6 when it arrives next year. I hope this is the case for all our sakes because the SKYACTIV-D will be even more efficient than the -G and we have already seen what the 2.0L provides. Any more of these kinds of possibilities and we might have to reclassify Mazda from an Advanced Auto Manufacturer to an Advanced "Hypermiling" Auto manufacturer given the new found efficiencies

Mazda still could mate i-Stop and i-ELOOP to the SKYACTIV-D for a production variant here in the US but the Concepts are really out there.

Equipped with a SKYACTIV-D 2.2L turbo diesel engine, TAKERI features the i-stop idling stop system and i-ELOOP, the world's first capacitor-based regenerative braking system. i-stop restarts in a single engine cycle unlike other stop-start systems, which require two cycles. At less than 0.4 seconds, i-stop achieves the world's fastest diesel engine restart time. i-ELOOP efficiently converts kinetic energy into electricity during deceleration, which is stored in capacitors and then used to power the vehicle's electric equipment, reducing engine load and improving fuel economy by as much as 10 percent.

I also do not know of anything noteworthy that the Domestics are exporting to Europe?

Wayne

Hi All:

I moved the entire CX-5 Review to the Review section and added the appropriate commentary and pics to the Review itself. If anybody sees anything missing, by all means let me know.

Wayne

True, the EU Step VI limit is ≤80 mgNOx/km.

However, VCA already rates the SkyActiv-D CX5 between 67 and 71 mgNOx/km for 2WD MT and AT ... and as I understand it WITHOUT aftertreatment. The 4WD AT CX5 diesel is rated 73.0 mgNOx/km.

Hopefully that suggests minimum NOx aftertreatment for US CX5 diesel compliance and lower incremental cost.

Meanwhile, the current typical EU diesel seems to be between 120 and 150 mgNOx/km.

I believe gasoline engines in the EU and probably the US are going to come under pressure for carbon particulates under 2.5.

IF I understand correctly, generally these smaller particles are a far greater health risk than the typically larger, more easily captured diesel particles. This is because the smaller particles can penetrate both particle filters ... and deeper into respiratory systems. Further, gasoline ICEs generally emit a greater mass/mile of these smaller (hard to capture) particles than typical EU fuel frugal class of <2 Liter diesels regardless of particle size with aftertreatment.

As I previously posted, there are NO certified Step VI gasoline vehicles in the UK as of yesterday. There are 7 BMW and the CX5 Step VI diesels VCA rated >60 mpg(Imp) combined. Mercedes has number of Step VI diesels but with lower fuel economies, best case 45 mpg(Imp) combined for their 2.143 Liter S Class 7AT.

IF I have made any errors in this ... hopefully someone will correct me.

Meanwhile Step VI continues driving EU OEMs (including the Det3 EU) to reduce emissions even further for both gasoline and diesel.

From my point of view ... this seems to put the Det3 on at least DUAL develpment paths for engine/powertrain technologies, doubling (or more) development costs ... unless they can figure out how to consolidate to one relatively limited set of engine technologies and sizes.

Mercedes is an interesting example carrying a legacy of 10 different gasoline displacements ... but appears to limit their diesels to 4, possible 5 with an even smaller displacement probably to meet Step VI CO2 requirements. About 80% of their diesel offerings use the 2.143 Liter with different tunes.

Currently, it appears that each of the Det3 may have dozens. Each engine design must be certified by appropriate authorities prior to market. And all of that takes a toll on profitability generating upward pricing pressures with the high probably shrinking the market.

Hi 50 mpg by 2012:

The Domestics in Europe are under the same constraints that every other manufacturer is so there is really no separation. As far as Meeting Euro VI, Ford and everyone else in Europe can already. It is a matter of cost however.

Meeting T2/B5 is also a matter of cost and according to the SKYACTI-D's NOx emissions in Europe, Mazda will need an LNT or SCR. Hopefully not nearly as robust but they will more than likely have to follow Ford, GM, Ram, VW, BMW and Audi with some sort of NOx reduction technology besides the SKYACTIV-D's lower CR, upwards of 9 injections per power stroke and some really interesting valve tricks. I hope they do not but...

We are fortunate to have SCR because it works and it is not that expensive. While DEF is an expense, it does not harm the combustion process like lighting off an LNT every few minutes or some really high flow EGR solutions.

When we discuss to DPFs however, those things murder diesel FE during their regeneration phase. Hopefully due to Mazda's low CR and more complete combustion, their Ceramic DPF needs only a minimal amount of regeneration vs. the big boys here in the US today. To see over third of a gallon of diesel wasted to regenerate a DPF is almost blasphemy!

About the 2.5 micron particulate from gasoline engines, the EPA has done numerous studies on it but I have not read anything anywhere that the EPA, the EU or Japan is going to mandate any type of reduction in the near term. If you have a link stating otherwise, I would be greatly interested in seeing it.

Wayne

Wayne,

I have no specifics on furher tighening on 2.5 particle requirements ... but the health risks are being discussed.

I'll share if I find anything.

Waxman might have more details.

Wayne, how much does an LNT or SCR catalytic converter cost?

FWIW, ....

Stopped by the Mazda dealership today. The salesman I spoke to was expecting the diesel versions to arrive stateside in the spring of 2013. He thought the diesel (170ish hp/300ish ft-lb tq?) would be a $1,000 to $2,000 upgrade and would be available with both trannys.


-- that should get you out the door for under $25k on the 6mt diesel ... and would negate my "most bang for the buck" ranking for the gas version.

/add ... I'm gonna guestimate the diesel version at 28/37/32 on the epa

I hate to trade in my car so soon but if the salesman is right then I would be very tempted. I have said it before though, I will believe it when I see it.