The DEADLY Silence of the Electric Car

[Chuck]

"Frankly, we've been working for 30 years to make cars quiet -- never thinking they could become too quiet,"

Peter Whoriskey - WASHINGTONPOST - Sept 23, 2009

Why not more effort on behaviorial road hazards like texting, speeding, DUI? Is the emphasis the easy fix instead of an honest threat assessment? --Ed.

After years of trying to make cars sound as if they were riding on air, engineers are considering how they might bring back some noise. They're trying to make some of them -- those silent hybrids -- more audible.

But how?

A team of engineers developing the Leaf, the forthcoming electric car from Nissan and a front-runner in the race for a mass-market electric car, have recently been presenting their ideas for artificial noises to government officials and focus groups.

Maybe Chime No. 22?

Melody No. 39? ... [Read More]

[WriConsult]

I know this goes against most of the opinion on the board, but then again I get out of my car and walk a helluva lot more than the average American. I think this is a significant hazard, and that the deadly weapons known as cars should announce their approach down our streets and in our parking lots. I'm not suggesting they be loud -- certainly no louder than conventional cars -- but I think a motor vehicle in operation should make more than just tire noise.

[EVuser]

"Officials with the National Federation of the Blind, which has pressed the safety issue with automakers and regulators, have advocated that electric cars make sounds similar to those of gas-powered cars."

That really defines it. The Prius was gas powered last time I checked.

FWIW the EV1 had a ped alert noise maker that could be activated as needed on the turn signal lever (sort of a polite way of honking), early models also had a back up warning that was removed in later models as most people found it annoying (drivers and pedestrians.)

[Chuck]

Darrell,

The concern could be sincere, and I know you are honest, but skeptical about many of the people out their raising this concern. It's just a decade of fearmongering about hybrids - EMF radiation, shock hazards in a crash, the "toxic" battery packs, delusionary people that see hybrids as giant political bumperstickers....just suspect many feel mortally threatend by hybrids for no reason at all.

Add to that, gas engines can be pretty quiet, but it was not biggie until hybrids came out.

[99LeCouch]

Most cars moving at 15-20 mph only emit tire noise anyhow.

And blind people have exceptional hearing. Many hear things us sighted folk outright miss.

EV quietness is a non-issue for me.

[Chuck]

Originally Posted by 99LeCouch

And blind people have exceptional hearing. Many hear things us sighted folk outright miss.

For years, Dr Bob Peters has taught at Tyler Junior College and done weather forcasts at KTBB. A college basketball accident has left him 100% blind, yet he knows several languages - five I think.

People have attemped to leave his class and he asks them to stay, possibly by name.

[SolarBird]

I'm not sure how serious of an issue this really is (is there one single case of a blind person being struck by a hybrid?) but will admit that a silent vehicle backing out of a parking space could be a hazard to an unobservant or sensory-impaired pedestrian.

The story claims that blind people are endangered because of an inability to hear the quite hybrid or electric cars. What about an inability to hear normal cars due to a nearby, extremely loud vehicle?

I tried to imagine being blind and having a need to walk across an busy intersection. Would it be more dangerous to deal with a few quite cars, or the majority of standard gasoline-powered vehicles that may be drowned out by something much louder?

Think Harleys, jake-braking trucks, leaf blowers, stupid kids and young adults with their booming car stereo systems. These are excessive noise-producers that we all encounter in traffic everyday. If certain people and organizations are truly concerned with the safety of the visually-impaired due to the presence of difficult-to-hear hybrids, I would think that they would also have the same concerns related to excessively loud vehicles and devices making the mass of other vehicles also difficlut to hear.

[Elixer]

Originally Posted by SolarBird

Think Harleys, jake-braking trucks, leaf blowers, stupid kids and young adults with their booming car stereo systems. These are excessive noise-producers that we all encounter in traffic everyday. If certain people and organizations are truly concerned with the safety of the visually-impaired due to the presence of difficult-to-hear hybrids, I would think that they would also have the same concerns related to excessively loud vehicles and devices making the mass of other vehicles also difficlut to hear.

This is a point I've made previously as well. Our hearing is greatly affected by the amount of ambient noise. If all cars were as quiet as hybrids, there would be no problem, however the ambient noise from other cars is what makes hybrids potentially dangerous. Therefore any regulation that requires hybrids to be quiet should also regulate the maximum amount of noise that other cars on the road emit.

Also, someone needs to do a case study to determine if this is an actual risk or just a perceived one. As stated, the braking distance at the low speeds where a car makes little noise are very short. I can't imagine a blind person crossing at places that are not designated cross walks, and drivers are required to stop for pedestrians at such places. Therefore I don't see why this is a major risk, and someone should do a study of sorts to see if it really is a risk. Right now there's no evidence either way.

[ILAveo]

I think the safety gain of putting a noisemaker on a Prius would be small but real. Blind pedestrian accidents are rare enough that it would take years (decades?) to gather meaningful data. The danger to distracted pedestrians is probably more significant (think of children playing marbles in the driveway when the car is pulling out.)

[MyPart]

So as I read this the chart (and article), a hybrid's stealth only works up to about 6.2MPH and then it's associated noise almost matches that of a standard vehicle. According to this chart from James Madison University the stopping distance for a car at 10MPH is 5 feet. Simple math puts a 6.2MPH at around 3.1 feet (actually less since stopping distance appears to be non-linear).

I say the chart and the associated stopping distance points out that this is a moot point. Who can't stop in 3 feet!?! Most people won't let anything, including pedestrians, get within three feet of their car.