Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

Ford C-Max touted to get better gas mileage than its Toyota rival, the Prius V

Ricardo Bowlin - CleanMPG - May 17, 2012

C-MAX - More FE than the Prius v.

Ford dealers are starting to place orders for America’s most affordable and soon to be fuel-efficient hybrid utility vehicle – the 2013 For C-MAX Hybrid – with innovative technologies such as a hands-free liftgate, spaciousness for five passengers and cargo as well as the fun-to-drive character shared with well-handling cars including Ford Focus.

The C-MAX is a compact hybrid utility vehicle and the company’s first dedicated line of hybrids. The 2013 C-MAX Hybrid will be available this fall with a base price of $25,995 – approximately $500 lower than the Toyota Prius v’s base price.

The C-MAX Energi plug-in hybrid will follow later this year with better electric-mode fuel economy and overall driving range than the Prius plug-in hybrid.

The C-MAX Hybrid blends fuel economy with performance, with projected best-in-class horsepower and torque along with Ford’s third-generation powersplit technology that allows for higher speed while in electric mode than Toyota Prius v.

C-MAX Hybrid benefits from 20 years of research and innovation behind the software and hardware technology driving it, with many of Ford’s almost 500 hybrid vehicle-related patents contained within.

That means that along with SYNC with MyFord Touch, drivers get class-exclusive features like hands-free liftgate (offering hands-free cargo access with a simple kicking motion), SmartGauge® with EcoGuide, regenerative braking and an advanced lithium-ion (Li-ion) battery pack that is being used for the first time in a Ford hybrid.

Room

C-MAX Hybrid is a compact hybrid utility vehicle jam-packed with features and room for five people and cargo.

The vehicle has a high roofline (63.9 inches) offering ample interior space and flexibility. C-MAX Hybrid offers 99.7 cubic feet of passenger space compared with 97 cubic feet in Prius v. The spacious C-MAX Hybrid also provides greater headroom in both front and rear seats than Prius v (41/39.4 inches vs. 39.6/38.6 inches).

For cargo, C-MAX Hybrid has 60/40 split-fold rear seats that easily fold flat with 54.3 cubic feet of space behind the first row and 24.5 cubic feet behind the second row.

Tech

C-MAX Hybrid features the company’s innovative hands-free liftgate, allowing for quick and easy access to the cargo area without messing with keys. A gentle kicking motion under the rear bumper opens the liftgate when used in combination with a key fob the user keeps in his or her pocket or purse that tells the car it’s OK to engage. The same motion can close the liftgate.

The vehicle also features the newest version of MyFord Touch to help inform, enlighten, engage and empower drivers. MyFord Touch offers multiple ways for customers to manage and control their phone, navigation, entertainment and climate functions through voice commands, menus accessed through controls on the steering wheel, touch screens, buttons or knobs.

C-MAX Hybrid also offers the next generation of SmartGauge with EcoGuide. Designed to help drivers get the most from the C-MAX Hybrid, information such as instantaneous fuel economy can be displayed on the left cluster to help drivers more closely monitor how their driving behavior affects the vehicle’s efficiency.

The left cluster also shows Brake Coach, a feature that helps drivers optimize their use of the braking system so that driving range can be enhanced through proper braking techniques. In the right cluster, redesigned imagery of green leaves shows overall driving efficiency – as drivers improve their efficient driving, they are rewarded with more leaves.

QC

The 2013 Ford C-MAX Hybrid is new, but its software and hardware technology have been evolving for nearly two decades.

C-MAX Hybrid is powered through the combination of a gasoline engine and a battery-driven electric motor. When powered by gasoline, the C-MAX Hybrid uses the all-new 2.0-liter Atkinson-cycle four-cylinder engine – a powerful and fuel-efficient engine and among the most advanced non-turbocharged four-cylinder powertrains Ford has ever offered.

The electric motor of the C-MAX Hybrid is powered by an advanced li-ion battery system designed to maximize use of common, high-quality components, such as control board hardware that has proven field performance in Ford’s critically acclaimed hybrid vehicles.

C-MAX Hybrid also offers Ford’s next-generation powersplit architecture that allows the electric motor and gasoline-powered engine to work together or separately to maximize efficiency. The engine also can operate independently of vehicle speed, charging the batteries or providing power to the wheels as needed. The motor alone can provide sufficient power to the wheels in low-speed, low-load conditions and work with the engine at higher speeds.

In the C-MAX Hybrid, the li-ion battery pack is recharged when the gasoline engine is in operation. Further, the regenerative braking system can recapture more than 95 percent of the braking energy that would otherwise be lost, and is able to use that power to help charge the battery. C-MAX Hybrid requires no plug-in charging.

The C-MAX Hybrid is being produced at Ford’s Wayne, Mich.-based Michigan Assembly Plant alongside Focus, Focus Electric and Focus ST.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

The V has surprisingly low mileage compared to its slightly smaller brother. I wonder if there's some extra they could tweak out of it to boost that.

Even if the Ford beats it, it won't be by much. Either way, we the customers win in a big way. Maybe Mazda will hurry and bring the Mazda5 Skyactiv to compete with not as good mileage but a much lower price. Competition is great!

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

I think the 'v' was a gimmie for Toyota. Just put an existing drivetrain into a new body that fills a segment gap, then make money. But just as the 1.8 in the regular liftback did better than the undersized 1.5 of the previous gen, that same 1.8 in the 'v' has a hard time getting into the groove of perfect timing and fuel delivery as long or as frequently with the v's weight and aero.

I think the C-Max will arrive with the 2.5 from the Fusion Hybrid or a minimum 2.0, much better tuned I would hope, as the current fusion hybrid does worse than the larger 'v'

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Toyota could add direct fuel injection and increase the compression ratio further.. not too sure how I feel about the extra complexity and headaches.

Very impressive about the C-Max minivan, do we know the interior dimensions yet?

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Some competition will hopefully give the consumer some leverage at the dealerships.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

The coming Fusion though (which in reality is the one that really matters) is rated a very nice 47/44 city/hwy. They are dropping only a small amount for the C-max. based on a smaller vehicle.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Thanks, the new Fusion numbers aren't posted yet.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

I'm skeptical: do the later Prius actually get better mileage than the 1.5 liter versions? I haven't seen anything to that effect, as far as real-world driving. Just sayin'.

Harry

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Too bad we don't get the Grand C-Max with 3 rows.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Wow, this is gonna be exciting. Still, to beat the Prius V the C-Max is going to have to get only barely lower mpg than the Fusion hybrid. It's going to be quite a feat for Ford to pull this off, but I'm withholding judgment until that actual EPA numbers are in. Even if it does beat the V, I doubt it would be by more than 0.1 gal/100mi.

And regardless of whether or not the C-Max bests the V, I'm sure its numbers will be quite impressive, and having a second high-mpg hybrid family hauler in the market is going to be HUGE.

What I was told here by cleanmpg folks a couple years ago, when I was looking at and test driving Priuses, was that in the hands of a skilled driver the gen2 version could do better, despite slightly lower EPA ratings and a more limited EV mode. And I found that to be exactly the case in my own driving.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

http://media.ford.com/images/10031/2013_CMAX_Specs.pdf

Slightly more passenger room than the V ... less cargo space 54.3 max cubes vs. 67.3 cubes for the V and heavier 3682 vs. 3274 for the V.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

It depends on how you look at it. I have not driven a GenIII Prius yet but, here is what I've heard about the comparison between GenII and GenIII: The Gen III will get better mpg than the GenII for those people who can't/won't be troubled with driving the car to take advantage of the car's features and capabilities. If you are going to do some hardcore hypermiling and throw every trick you have at it, the GenII will eat the GenIII's lunch and pop the bag.:p:D

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Yikes, that's a LOT more weight ... if Ford really can beat the Prius V on mpg that's going to be one amazing feat. I'm getting a little more skeptical.

I'd be curious to know the cargo space with rear seats up, since that's what matters to families who want to take their kids on on a roadtrip with them. Ford quotes it at 24.5cf (as opposed to the Prius V's 34cf), but they may be quoting the under-the-cargo-cover or up-to-the-beltline volume (as opposed to floor-to-ceiling volume), as is done in Europe and sometimes by the EPA, so it may not be apples-to-apples.

Then again, the max volume being 13cf less in the C-Max, maybe 24.5cf really is the floor-to-ceiling measurement. If that's the case, then it's considerably smaller than the Prius V in back, and at the very small end of the CUV and small-wagon classes (which typically run anywhere from 24 to 36cf). And basically at the top end of the hatchback class. Might make it a tough sell for some families.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Ford's press release today trumpeted every advantage their marketing folks could conjure vis a vis the V, but was tellingly quiet about cargo capacity...I'm hoping it's an understatement, but wouldn't bet a nickle on it. I will wager that it's much easier to beat the EPA city estimate in the V given the weight disparity, the highway may belong to the C-MAX ??

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Hi All:

The OP has been corrected. The C-MAX is reported as using the all-new 2013 Fusion hybrids drivetrain with its 62 mph glide capability. This is a big deal on the highway.

The C-MAX is based off the Focus platform but its interior volume is larger. 99.7 vs the v's 97.2 cu. ft.

Andrew, 3-rows will not work. If it did, you could install 3-rows in a the v like Europe and Japan receiving but there is not enough room.

Wayne

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

So the C-Max hybrid starts at $ 25.9 http://www.freep.com/article/2012051...sey=nav%7Chead and the 2013 Fusion hybrid starts at $ 27.9 https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B_v...GlDT251SW1DTjQ
is that right ? (thought it would be the other way around)

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

4k lbs for the Energi, where do they put the extra batteries?

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Maybe: http://www.fuelly.com/car/toyota/prius

The reported averages are better, but there were other changes between the generations.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Here's your answer, from the Ford spec sheet:

Cargo volume behind first row/second row:

• C-Max Hybrid: 54.3cf/24.5cf.
• C-Max Energi: 43.4cf/19.2cf.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

These will be great additions to the San Francisco hybrid taxi fleet.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Thanks. You, too, Larry.

I'm happy with my '07 and feel no need to trade up to a newer Prius.

When I see those Gen III's flying past me on the open road, there's no doubt I'm way ahead of them in mpg's.

Harry

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

True, with improved rear passenger room.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

I was thinking that the increase MPG might be due to using lithium instead of nimh batteries.. lithium ion cells are about 10% more efficient at cycling energy (less heat generated), besides being lighter. Ford might be using a higher voltage also, without the need for an up-converter.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

The hands free liftgate has to be the smartest thing in ages. All cars should have that.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

I hope not. It'd be an unnecessary expense for us. We're simply not encumbered by things we're carrying in the rain enough.

I can see how it'd be useful for some people as long as the back opens fast enough not to be annoying (think of slow automatic doors that make you break stride).

This vehicle is all about the mileage and price. The new Ford hybrids will add new hybrid sales, take sales from the v and Camry Hybrid and some from the regular Prius.

Importantly, they'll put pressure on Toyota to improve their hybrids: improved engine technology, lithium batteries and, short of a dramatic currency shift, the next generation assembled in Mississippi. US manufacturing and assembly of the majority of hybrids sold in the USA would dramatically shift the economics.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Having owned both. The Gen 2 is way better slow speed. Which makes sense. It is smaller and has a smaller engine.

On the highway, they are close to equal. The Gen 3 has different modes and if you get it into the "magic " it will sing.

I have not driven the c, but all indications are it may be the best yet.

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Yes. Toyota really needs to get a c into Wayne's hands for a week. I want to see the OMFG effect.

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

I second the notion that the battery tech is key to the impressive estimated MPG. A key element mentioned related to the Li-Ion battery is the much faster and greater braking regen capability. The 95% claimed energy recapture is huge as I believe the Prius is closer to the 30 to 40% range. Even with Li-ion, I wonder if there is some sort of capacitor bank to get to such a high regen capture, which then slowly trickles charge into the batteries...

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Like INATM, I hope not too. Another feature that adds weight, complexity and potential future maintenance, and which I can get along without. Despite the fact that I live in a rainy climate and yes, there are times when it's raining, I'm carrying several grocery bags and I suppose it would be nice if the tailgate opened and closed itself.

So I can see where it would be nice to have, but I'll assume that for quite a few years it will be optional and/or bundled with other things like leather, Nav, HID headlights, Bluetooth, parking assist, adaptive cruise and other extra cost/complexity things that might be nice to have but I can do without. Options which generate high profits for the automakers and subsidize the base models that I buy. :D

Nor would I. As much as I like the P-III's styling and slightly larger cargo room, I'm concerned that the flying-buttress center console might drive me insane.

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

Ford HAD originally made mention of giving us the "Grand C-MAX" with three rows...but then they axed it for NA release. :(

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

Beyond the extra weight, GenIII have more aerodynamic surface than the GenII to overcome.
The GenIII onboard computer tries to modulate the throttle to save gas in Eco mode which helps most nonhypermilers achieve higher fuel efficient but this interference can get in the way of an expert hypermiler who can modulate the throttle more precisely with a scangaugeII - this can be somewhat mitigated by switching the GenIII to Normal or Power Mode.

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

The Lithium Ion batteries should give Ford C-Max hybrids a performance edge over the NiMh Prius V hybrids but it will make them more costly to make - hopefully not too much more expensive. The other design trade off will be whether Ford will focus on extending the Lithium Ion battery lifespan and increase its reliability by restricting the battery SoC levels or allow for longer all electric range with a shorter battery lifespan ( and make money replacing the batteries after a couple of years).

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

with proper cooling (active) and SOC control they can get 15 years out of a lithium battery.. thats plenty. You need to keep long term storage and bricking in mind.

Does the Sonata Hybrid use air cooling or AC on the batteries?

Re: Ford C-Max to Smack the MPG out of the Prius
 

dang that's heavy for a little bitty car - my Big Blue Pilot is "only" 4400lbs.

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

Hi Herm:

The Sonata Hybrid uses air cooling with its Li-Po solution as the chemistry is inherently a low heat generating storage solution. Not sure what the new C-MAX and Fuson Hybrids will use regarding cooling.

Wayne

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

Question ... does this function distinguish between the fob being in the vehicle versus by the tailgate?

IF NOT ... wouldn't this reduce occupant security inside a "locked" stationary vehicle?

Just curious ...

Agreed.

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

Toyota's smartkey can distinguish between a key that is inside the car and a key that's outside, so there is no reason why Ford's shouldn't be able to do it.

Re: Ford C-Max set to best the MPG of Prius v
 

Thanks....