US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

The Obama administration has imposed tariffs of up to 4.73 per cent on Chinese manufacturers of solar panel cells

James Politi In Washington And Jeremy Lemer In New York - FT - March 20, 2012

Too late for Solyndra --Ed.

The Obama administration has imposed tariffs of up to 4.73 per cent on Chinese manufacturers of solar panel cells, judging that they benefited from unfair export subsidies after a review that split the US solar industry.

The level of tariffs set by the commerce department on Tuesday was lower than expected, but the move still marks the latest chapter in the Obama administration’s efforts to beef up trade enforcement against China.

A lobbying frenzy preceded the ruling on so-called “countervailing duties”, with some US solar companies arguing forcefully in favour of the tariffs to level the playing field with China. Others feared the punitive measures would lead to higher prices on the roughly $3.1bn in annual solar cell imports from China and damage the American solar sector.

In the end, the commerce department’s decision to apply tariffs but at a relatively low rate allowed both sides to claim a win. Jigar Shah, the founder of Sun Edison and chairman of the coalition that opposed the tariffs, said: “This is an initial victory for the American solar industry and its 100,000 employees ... With these low tariffs, they basically came out and said China is not over subsidising solar.”

But Steve Ostrenga, chief executive officer of Helios Solar Works and a member of the coalition that led the charge in favour of the duties, said: “Today’s announcement affirms what US manufacturers have long known: Chinese manufacturers have received unfair and WTO-illegal subsidies.”... [Read More]

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

I think we need steep tariffs on ALL cheap foreign junk. A very high tarff on imports is the only thing that will ever bring jobs back to America.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

I'm going to give you a big amen on that. American workers having to compete with rural Chinese labor is bad for all Americans.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

but what if the price advantage on solar cells is not cheap labor?.. it is a high tech item made largely on automated lines. Same with lithium-ion batteries.

Perhaps is a bloated bureaucratic mess of rules and regulations that makes business in the US expensive. I think Steve Jobs (before he died, not after) complained about the expense of setting up a new factory in the US compared to China.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Tariffs are more like shooting yourself in the foot to try and hurt the other guy.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

I would think it evens the playing field a bit with all the things we import from China. We are heavily indebted to that country and as long as there is poverty in the US, we can benefit from the increased productivity we would have here at home.

This will force the goods to be made here by Americans who are able to work for a living, yet do so by depending on welfare etc. Put those able bodied people to work. Set up programs to teach them how to do stuff (which many programs I'm sure are already in place), and do a student loan sort of thing, and collect the money as a percentage of their paychecks. giving them at least minimum wage. That's what minimum wage is there for. Once they paid whatever amount is sufficient to cover a reasonable cost, taxpayers debt can be reduced.

The tariff on the chinese goods is sort of like paying the "true" price. How clean is the technology used to make these parts? what's the true cost of transporting all those goods to the US? These are things we need to think about.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Cheap goods from China, specifically everything sold at walmart, has proven to be a large economic stimulus, helping Americans buy more, have a higher quality of life, etc... That by far offsets the economic decline caused by the loss of manufacturing jobs in the US. I would be willing to say that the economic prosperity Americans felt in the 90s and early 00s was because of these cheap goods, coupled with loose lending policies to get us all in homes.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

...and into a recession

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Fix the bad Regulations, High Taxes, etc... I bet we could compete just fine.
Tariffs like it was said earlier just shoots us in the foot.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

American cost of living is not cheap. That would require an infrastructure overhaul. It's not impossible, but the likelihood is negligible.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

If the cost of being able to go to Walmart, walk around and fill a cart with a bunch of cheap stuff, a lot of which is unnecessary junk, is to lose American manufacturing job, you can, to quote John Lennon "count me out".
I'm more than willing to have less stuff in my house to help my fellow countrymen get decent jobs.

This video describes my thoughts about mindless consumption.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GorqroigqM

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Cost of living can be cheap... The government just gets in the way.
When I mean cheap, I mean you won't sacrifice much if anything for the same amount of goods/services.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Personally, I'd like to see tariffs placed on all Chinese goods. Their government exploits their people for cheap labor so they can sell cheap junk below market value to us.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Whether the tariff's are good or whether they're bad, I'm really not a good enough economist to know. But what I do know is that Big Oil has got to be liking the price of solar panels going up.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

If you want a great example of how "wonderful" tariffs are, just look at the cost of tires. Our president, as a gift to the United steelworkers union, pushed through a 35% tariff on tires from China. What was the result of this?
The price of lower end tires increased for all of us. Personally, i watched the price of the exact same tires increase over 30% in 2 years time. Obama claimed the tariff would increase jobs for American workers in the tire industry. So what happened? In 2009 there were 55,000 employed in the industry. By 2011, there were 51,700. The end result is WE pay more for our tires, and for what?
Thanks President Obama. Nice job.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
Punitive tariffs rarely work, and are usually counterproductive.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

I bet a lot of oil goes into making tires..

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

If people are driving less and tires are improving fewer tires should be needed. The question is not what happened, but what would have happened and what's going to happen.

I'm sure the actual desire was to keep cheap tires out. As we know, bad tires means more gasoline consumed so are an economic double whammy.

Punitive tariffs rarely work for the same reason that there are punitive tariffs: people cheat.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

No, what happened is the same set of domestic tires increased in price from $59 each to $89 each. Why? Because the competition was eliminated because of the tariff, that's why. The actual desire was to give a gift to the union that gave Obama a lot of money in campaign contributions. This is not complicated. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

What was the profit margin on the tires for the US manufacturer before the tariffs were put in place?

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

As Herm already pointed out, the cost of raw materials to manufacture that tire went up a lot in the past few years.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

An awful lot of buy American going on here while likely being typed on a Made in China keyboard, and so on.........

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

I didn't think there were any options.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

The prices increased 20% the month the tariffs were instituted.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

The tariffs were 35% yet the price increases were 20%.. finally the domestic manufacturers were able to pay the workers a living wage. At your expense :)

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Tire deal
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoz...-tire-tariffs/

I just bought what I consider a expensive purchase of lithium batteries. I sure wish they were made somewhere closer to home. But so far there isn't a USA manufacturer putting out a significant liFePo product that they are willing to sell to consumers.

I don't think you can even buy a light bulb or TV made in the US anymore.

Solar
The tariff on the PV panels was small enough that it is a political win for the administration and a win for the consumer as it won't change the price of PV panels much. China companies can absorb the cost.

What is humorous about the panel business is that the entire movement needs subsidies to make headway. Subsidies indirectly paid for by the bonds being sold to China to support the federal budget.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

US manufacturers dont want to sell lithium batteries to the consumer directly to avoid headaches.

How much did you pay per kWh?

The only halfway decent solution to imported goods is a VAT tax, as much as it pains me to say.. still would increase the cost of US made goods but at least we could capture some of the taxes lost to foreign production.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Unfortunately, however, sales tax multiplies cost disparity.

Personally, I prefer a reasonable level of tariffs to reduce the ability for small price and currency fluctuations to cause dramatic shifts in price-sensitive markets and generally to favor local production over imports. Truly free trade requires free movement of labor, but you can have freedom of trade and competition with tariffs.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Tire manufacturer employees were averaging over $50K/year before the tire tariffs. How much do you think they are entitled to earn? :rolleyes:
Plus, the tires increased %20% immediately. They increased further the year after.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGL-E...e3RVAAAAAAAABQ

Please watch Peter Schiff and keep attention to the fact in the 1950's we paid our workers the most and our products were some of the cheapest in the world.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

Does that include the value of the benefits? That's pretty common tactic for corporations to get the public on their side when they want to paint workers as greedy.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

People are always so greedy. Its such an overused word I hardly know what it means.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

No, the average hourly wage was $26/hour, not including any fringes.

Re: US sets tariffs for Chinese solar cells
 

This whole thread reminds me of the recent insourcing thread we had.. So the news for 2012 was a minor solar panel tariff, the collapse of Solyndra and sale of A123 to the Chinese?... Good job Obama.

Other interesting things about 2012 is the increasing availability of $20-$30 home lighting LED bulbs at common everyday places such as Home Depot and Wally World, they used to be $60-$70 not too long ago. Lets not forget the flood of electrics and hybrids..