Honda’s New Diesel Initiative To Spark Death Rattle For Accord Hybrid.

[xcel]

Out goes the AH and in comes Honda’s mighty Tier II/Bin5 iCDTi super diesel.

Winding Road - Jan 5, 2007

Current World Records held by iCDTi in the Euro Accord (the smaller US Acura TSX here in the States) can be found at the following: Honda Diesel Sets New World Records – May 6, 2004. Of keen interest was the 76 mpg US gallons achievement bringing them home.

Honda president Takeo Fukui has been quoted in the Japanese press as saying that a next generation V-6 diesel will be commercialized by Honda, and is set to slot into the Ridgeline along with other unspecified models.

First, though, Honda will kick off with its 2.2-2.4-litre class, four-cylinder “super clean” turbodiesel that’ll run in the next Stateside Accord, appearing around 2009. This is expected be a breakthrough engine, with emissions as clean as clean as a modern gasoline powerplant, able to meet even the toughest regulations in the world (i.e. the EPA’s Tier II Bin 5 regulations).

Once this Accord diesel goes on sale, the Accord hybrid will be quietly retired. Honda’s basic eco strategy going forward will be to keep hybrids for Civic-class and below offerings, with diesels for Accord-class models and over.

Or so it would seem, except that Fukui was also recently quoted as saying that Honda will consider a small diesel for the future, too. Presumably, however, if such a drivetrain is produced at all, it’ll be earmarked for Europe, where diesels make up more than half of the new-car market.

[TonyPSchaefer]

I don't understand why they can't marry the diesel with the hybrid tech. At least do the auto shutoff thing at the stoplights.

Okay sure, the diesel gets great mileage and has emissions as good as the gas power plants. But why not make it even better? I don't care what the fuel is, that fuel will last longer and the car will go farther if it's tied to a hybrid system.

I just think that it's a step back if the car is idling at a stoplight (assuming the driver isn't doing a FAS).

[xcel]

Hi Tony:

___My only hope for this right now is Toyota to install a smallish 30 - 50 HP Tier II/Bin5 capable turbo diesel into a PHEV based - HSD equipped Prius III. You would maintain the same acceleration capabilities but vastly improve its all-highway numbers well into the 80 - 100 mpg range and the city numbers would get absolutely stupid given the PHEV capabilities. I know this just has to be on Toyota’s radar screens and I have no doubt Honda wishes it had the tech to do the same. A smallish .6 - 1.0L diesel with outrageous highway FE capability attached to a large pack w/ high performance MG/Set(s) for the around town driving stints simply makes to much sense for them no too have already built the prototypes. GM, Ford, and DCX have already had vehicles on the road w/ this capability 10 + years ago in fact! The real question is who will be the first to up the ante? With GM puffing out its chest about the upcoming PHEV based Saturn VUE DualMode hybrid, I can only imagine Honda and Toyota have their labs cranked up and ready to go for something of this nature and it will be a race to see who saves the planet first … I like your sig by the way

___Good Luck

___Wayne

[hobbit]

If there's *anything* today's generic drivers need, it's braking
energy recapture to mitigate the way they get overused. To not
continue including hybrid drivelines along with these other
developments is madness, unless they're coming up with some other
way to deal with that. Hydraulic hybrid regen and idle-stop?
Still needs a bunch of electronics and studly batteries, especially
if one is restarting a *diesel* on the fly.
.
_H*

[AshenGrey]

An Accord that gets 70+ MPG? Say goodbye to GM!

[Delta Flyer]

It seems Honda is playing catchup with the clean diesel card. They probably feel they need to get the a clean diesel Accord ASAP before the Camery hybrid beats them up. My guess is it would be followed by a clean diesel/hybrid - I hope so.

Honda knows that they have to go back to the drawing board on their hybrid plans. The IMA in it's present form is not a player as a plug-in hybrid - that's going to hurt. Hopefully they fix that. Meanwhile, Civic hybrid sales are strong.

[xcel]

Hi Chuck:

___Actually, HCH-II sales are almost pathetic. Honda is not making a profit on IMA with less then 35,000 units being sold per MY although for the price, they are probably making it up on the margins. Think of a $20,000 FEH vs. a $20,000 HCH-II after the tax credits. We know the capability of Ford’s eCVT and the sheer size of its build vs. the HCH-II yet they basically cost the same from the manufacturers perspective nowadays. I have heard Ford say time and time again they need to sell 70,000 units per year before the HEV program goes into the black. Right now, they aren’t even close and we are already 3 years in. Add up Honda’s entire hybrid sales and they aren’t close either unfortunately

___I am sure they have a BEV like solution being readied as the FCX itself is basically a BEV w/ a FCV as its main propulsion component vs. an ICE like everything else they build.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

[AshenGrey]

The only problem with making a diesel/hybrid is that the resultant vehicle would be pretty expensive. The fuel economy would be awesome, of course, but the up-front cost would be a hard sell.

Personally, I'd give a Civic hybrid/diesel a shot. But if it cost $30k, I wouldn't be able to afford it.

[Delta Flyer]

The other issue with diesel is will the price consistently remain a lot higher than gas? I'd hope not.