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A performance oriented V6 full-hybrid instead of a fuel sipping I4. (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8078)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/2009_Saturn_VUE_FWD_2-Mode.jpgWayne Gerdes – CleanMPG (www.cleanmpg.com) – Jan. 5, 2007

Saturn’s 2-Mode chases max performance instead of fuel economy. Will GM ever learn?

DETROIT - The all-new 2009 Saturn Vue Green Line 2-Mode FWD compact SUV will be shown for the first time at the 2008 NAIAS (North American International Auto Show).

The Saturn Vue 2-Mode is expected to deliver 28 mpg combined vs. its non-hybrid V6 siblings 19 mpg combined with a driving range greater than 500 miles. Besides the increased fuel economy, the Vue 2-Mode achieves California’s AT-PZEV (Advanced Technology - Partial Zero Emission Vehicle) classification.

The Vue 2-Mode’s 3.6L VVT V-6 engine uses direct injection ensuring good performance, low emissions and excellent fuel economy for an SUV of its size and weight. A 0 - 60 time of 7.3 seconds and the maximum towing load of 3,500 pounds will be the Vue 2-Modes claim to fame.

How the Vue 2-Mode Hybrid works

GM’s Hybrid system in the Vue 2-Mode improves fuel economy in the same fashion as found in the larger Chevrolet Tahoe and GMC Yukon 2-Mode hybrids. For an overview, see the following as a refresher: CleanMPG Previews the 2008 GMC Yukon 2-Mode Hybrid (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7448)

Unlike the larger 2-Mode SUV’s with (2) actively cooled 60kW motors, the Vue 2-Mode system uses (2) actively cooled 55-kW electric motors integrated into the 2MT70 automatic transmission. The pack is a 300V NiMH unit with a total cap of 1.8kWh placed below the cargo floor behind the second row of seats.

Regenerative Braking

The Vue 2-Mode is equipped with a “fully blended” electro-hydraulic brake system that enables 100-percent regenerative braking, 100-percent friction braking (traditional four-wheel disc braking) or a combination of the two. During regenerative braking, the system converts kinetic energy to electrical power, then stores the power in the Energy Storage System (battery pack).

EPS

A 12V Electric Power Steering system replaces a conventional column-mounted hydraulic system and saves fuel - gaining up to a ½ mpg. It also gives the Vue 2-Mode more precise steering inputs and better overall on-center feel.

Suspension tuning

Because the hybrid system changes the weight distribution on the Vue 2-Mode, special chassis refinements were needed including revised front and rear spring rates; revised diameter front and rear stabilizer bars and recalibrated front struts and rear shock absorbers to help ensure a smooth ride.

MFD’s

The Saturn Vue 2-Mode has a basic iFCD replacing the tachometer and allowing the driver to know whether the vehicle is in EV mode, ICE-On mode or a combination of the two; and, because of the silent start as the key is turned, a telltale indicates when the vehicle is on and ready to drive.

In the center console, a power-flow graphic integrated into an available navigation system displays the vehicles power flow similar to that in Toyota’s Prius.

Safety

In addition to the Vue 2-Modes hybrid drivetrain, the Vue boasts a number of standard safety features including four-wheel ABS, electronic stability control, rollover detection system, pedestrian impact protection, tire pressure monitoring system, Pedal Release System, front active head restraints, and six air bags (driver and front, side and side curtains for both front and rear.

Production is slated for late 2008.

2009 Saturn VUE 2-MODE at a glance

Engine|
Type|3.6 V-6 VVT, direct injection (DI)
Displacement|3.564 L
Bore & stroke (in/mm)|3.7 x 3.37/94 x 85.6
Valvetrain|DOHC - 4 valves per cylinder, variable valve timing (VVT)
Fuel delivery|direct high-pressure fuel injection
Compression ratio|11.3:1
Recommended fuel| unleaded regular
Emissions|CARB AT-PZEV
|
Hybrid System|
Transmission type|2-Mode continuous ratio with four fixed gears
Gear ratios|
First|3.26
Second|1.88
Third|1.0
Fourth|.64
Reverse|EV only - 2.2
EVT1|Infinite – 1.70
EVT2|1.70 - .4
Final drive ratio|3.02
|
Motors (2)|55 KW ea.
Battery Type|NiMH
V - CAP|300V - 1.8 kWh
|
Curb weight (lb)|4265

11.3:1, isn't that getting a little high for regular?

Yeah, thats high. However, if the engine is well designed that shouldn't be a problem for regular gas.

with proper engine design and careful monitoring by electronics coupled with direct injection of the fuel allows for some amazing compression ratios. This is what the direct injection crowd has been saying all along, finally manufacturers are starting to produce more and more of them.

More power and better fuel economy. The more power means you could use a smaller engine to get the same power requirements in a car... unfortunately it seems that GM went the other route with this one. Regardless, its still a step in the right direction, lets hope they keep it up and we'll get some decent cars out of the big 3.

While I disagree with the "performance hybrid" philosophy, a 9 MPG gain is nothing to sneer at. Since it also has a true EV mode at low speeds, a hypermiler will probably be able to get much more that n MPG in savings. I hope GM sells a bunch of them!

Hi All:

___DI can perform magic (high compression, low emissions and a nice up-tick in performance) and GM is showing its prowess with it. That being said however, the VUE 2-Mode is barely more efficient than the BAS equipped VUE all because GM had to make it go 0 – 60 in a touch over 7 seconds. They did not learn from either Toyota or Honda about their own performance hybrid missteps? The FWD VUE 2-Mode weighs 250 #’s less than the 4WD HiHy with an ~ 2 mpg advantage (2WD vs. 4WD duh!) and the same towing cap. Who the hell is going to be towing anything of note with a hybrid in the first place? Honda’s AH experiment went sour 6 months after it was launched. The HiHy w/ the V6 has never burned down any sales records yet many I personally know would have purchased an I4 equipped HiHy (right out of the Camry TCH) sight unseen with 30 + combined.

___We knew the 3.6 was coming and ~ FE but it disappoints none the less seeing fuel rise by 200 + % the last 3 years and GM playing around with a 50% improvement when there was another 20 + % sitting there?

___We do not know the premium but if it is anything like that of the Tahoe/Yukon twins at ~ $8K, there is not a chance in hell this will sell? Only time will tell …

___Ashen, 2-Mode is not like a Prius’ HSD or FEH’s eCVT. There is no predictability as to when the ICE will run and when it will not given there is no SoC instrumentation so you are shooting in the dark so to speak :(

___Good Luck

___Wayne

There is no predictability as to when the ICE will run and when it will not given there is no SoC instrumentation so you are shooting in the dark so to speak :(


Thats a big shame :( They have a huge opportunity here to make something great. One can only wonder why they continue to fail to produce something that will be great. Maybe they will wake up one day and realize to really penetrate into the market, they need something that will be better than what their competition is producing, until then they will continue to loose sales. They are most certainly still playing catch up.

So many opportunities - that seem to have been lost.

I guess they are only doing what market research is telling them - instead of the right thing?

Thanks,

Bob

The Vue is roughly the same size as my wife's 07 non-hybrid CR-V EXL and she gets 22-29mpg. However, if it lures some buyers away from their less economical SUVs I'm all for it. Further, the price of hybrid technogy will hopefully fall as more manufacturers continue to develop hybrid technology including battery development.

GM is playing with 3 year old realities.It built/planned this one with $1.60 gasoline in mind.Very nice vehicle,good FE-considering the preformance- but a clean miss with $3.50 gasoline.
Yesterday I drove by two local Chevy dealers.I went by slowly so I could get a good look.It broke my heart-I'm really pulling for GM.At the 1st one there was row upon row(30 vehicles wide) of Trailblazers/1/2 ton pickups.I was specifically looking for Aveo/Cobalt/.I didn't see one. The second dealer had two 4 door large pickups prominently displayed-looked like they had been aftermarket raised a bit.The prices on the windshield-$50,000 and $49000.I'm not sure that these were 3/4 ton Duramaxes-I think they were just jacked up 1/2 tons-4x4-loaded with aftermarket BS.The beds looked short-like the 4 door 5.5' bed. There was ONE-ONE-Aveo in front, but no price displayed.They weren't making much effort to sell it.(I didn't see one customer at either dealer)
GM has a HUGE backlog of unsold 1/2 tons.Their money makers in the USA were 1/2 ton vehicles.
It sure looks like they don't have anything they can make and sell here in the USA that can turn a profit.Many 1/2 tons are Mexican of course.
Nice vehicle, but too much motor for $3.50 and climbing gasoline.There isn't a non commercial vehicle sold in the USA that couldn't be adequately driven by a well designed 4 cyl spark ign motor.This includes all the pickups/big SUVs(not that there will be a big market for either one).Smallish TDIs-4 cyl under 2 liters could work fine for many light duty 1/2 tons. Really small TDIs- 1-1.5 liter-would work for most 3000 lb cars.
It looks bad for GM.
Charlie

Seems like a have-your-cake-and-eat-it-too vehicle. That's in line with human nature. People get performance with a "hybrid" badge on one of the fenders. It isn't perfect, but what is?

GM stands for "General Mediocrity."

They just don't get it, and never will.

Harry

I don't feel sorry for them at all, they dug their own grave. They lobbyed for unbalanced laws to help them sell vehicles. Now those same things they've lobbyed for have made them weak. Its going to get bad for the auto industry for a while. Lets just hope the government actually does something good, and helps us establish a new hydrogen and electric vehicle industry.

GM's has plenty of smart folks working for it,but they have insurmountable problems.The current vehicle mix-and this new Hybrid VUE was designed with $1.50-$2.00 gasoline in mind.To some extent the HH was the same story, but different because it was built to cater to "rich" Lexus buyers as the RX400.It isn't a sales hit,and the VUE will be an even lesser hit.
Their main problem(all the Big 3) is they can't build small vehicles for a little as the Japanese based USA/Canada plants.GM has to use UAW labor,and they have huge labor/retirement/medical expenses.The Japanese plants are young,and non union,and in anti-union states. They have very, very few retirees,and they pay less than 1/2 UAW wages.This is why GM stayed with the 1/2 ton SUVs/pickups etc.They could make a profit making them in NA.They can't make a Cobalt with $35 labor for as little as Toyota can make a Corolla.They have to cut costs by using cheaper components,lower tech less complicated engines/trans/electronic controls-everything.
If GM builds the VOLT with expensive labor, what will stop Toyota/HONDA/Nissan from building a plug in vehicle,and undercutting their price?Nothing.
They aren't stupid.GM and the UAW know exactly what is happening.They are trying to cut labor costs while hoping the Japanese USA plants have increased costs.Their "plan" must be to hold on manufacturing in the USA-NA-until their costs meets the Japanese USA plants costs.
I don't see a solution,and it isn't exactly anyones "fault.".It is just a lesson in economics.GM is tired to the UAW-the UAW folks can't tell their current members,"you need to take a 50% pay/benefits cut ,so future workers will have jobs."
No good solution,and no real faultEventually GM will close most of the USA plants-then they will go bankrupt-and the contracts will be voided.The new workers and the post bankrupt USA GM will work for the same money as the Japanese USA plant workers..
Shame,sad, but...
Charlie
Charlie

Yet the same crappy cars coming out of the mexican factories with much lower wages, and no unions, still cost the same, and perform just as bad. The blame belongs on management and not on the union. Its poor leadership and not employee costs, where the blame lies.

I'm not blaming the unions.The GM UAW plants have extremely high productivity-.The workers put out more cars(and car value) per hour than the Japanese USA plants.One of them is the most productive in the auto industry.Unfortunately this is hours worked per car value built(the lower the better-but call it high productivity anyway).When you look at wages/pensions/benefits per car value built it isn't as good.
It just isn't possible to build a competitive car if your cost is close to 2X your competition.High end manufacturers can occasionally charge huge markups, but you just can't sell a lot of them.
GM is doing fine in Europe,and Asia with European plants etc.I suspect the Euros enforce some sort of level playing field in respect to wages,so you can't just build a plant in a EU country with low labor costs and automatically have a HUGE advantage.
In the USA we are effectively outsourcing those jobs to low wage states,and outsourcing the profits to whomever owns Toyota/Honda/Nissan.If the Japanese thought they could outsourse them to China,they would.
Textiles used to provide a fair number of OK manufacturing jobs all up and down the east coast.They are all gone to low wage countries.
One of the few advantages of higher energy costs is that it might make it more sense to make and build things in the USA-not 10,000 miles away.
It won't be very good if we end up a country with two classes-one getting low wages in service industries,and the other being technocrats-lawyers, business managers.MDs etc getting much much higher wages.If all the middle ground-manufacturing jobs are gone, it could happen.
GM is in serious trouble-no obvious solution.Their problem is unchanged the last 15 years;this is why they eventually squash all the high FE mpg small vehicle concepts they have come up with the last 20 years.They can't make and sell them for less than Toyota etc,so why build it?.
Charlie

Why should GM (or any of the big 3) compete with their own sales by producing more energy efficient cars? The longer they can make band-aid hybrids the more profit they (and their co-conspirators, the oil cartel), will make. They just can't see the forest for the trees.

And profit IS the bottom line in a capitalistic society, right?

So, then the big 3 are on the right track!

WRONG!

Geez, 0-60 in 7.3??! I won't deny the fun in that (having once driven a sub-5 second car), but honestly I've never needed performance better than 10-12 seconds or so. Any time I see a car faster than that I always wonder how much better mpg it could get if they would just apply the same technology to a smaller powerplant.