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"back in the day" in the 90s i used to take 3 week driving trips out west. i don't know if it's my age catching up to me, or if i really drove differently then, or if others now drive so much faster and more recklessly. but my weekend trip forced me to drive like the others out there, and i found it really tiring and difficult.

i took a weekend (3 day) trip to lacrosse for a photo job. getting to the minneapolis area wasn't bad, but from there on to wisconsin, i really hated it. i got a later start than i had hoped and hit 494 around minneapolis from the west a little after midday friday. first it was a speed contest, until a certain point it slowed to a crawl to I35 south (i did not have to go near the area of the bridge collapse on the north side of the city).

i finally had to give in and use the A/C and cruise, or i never would have made it. so many factors were involved including high heat and humidity, headwinds, high speed and the traffic noise. i had to be able to relax my body, and cool myself off. and everything felt SO fast........i swung east to the outskirts of rochester to I90 into wisconsin. even thought the limit was 70, i went 60.

for the trip there and all my running around, i showed 54.1 for 295.7 miles. when i filled, it was actually 52.5, the worst i have seen since last winter. and unfortunately (we shall see how much) i didn't notice i was filling with 10% ethanol until it was too late.

i took the scenic route home, on the wisconsin side of the mississippi, hoping for a nice, relaxing drive. ya know, i don't think there's any place you can do that any more. examples: driving the limit of 35 through a small town, winding road with double yellow, some convertible passed me about 50 and then flipped me off when i honked at him;

after struggling to climb up one of the 3 or 4 really steep grades on the bluff, the line of traffic with me in the front and 3-4 cars behind me. the car right behind me was not tailing me the whole time, so i don't think it was a problem too much with me holding up traffic, although it was hard to get to even 40MPH in a couple places in 3rd or 4th. was that the gas or just the car?).....

anyhow, we were all back to 55 coming to a town, in a no passing double line on a curve with an uphill which ended up with a 25MPH limit. suddenly 2 motorcycles (with passengers no less) came from the very back of the line and passed all of us, then played duck and dive with a pickup about 1/4 ahead at the base of a hill, and went into the 25 zone doing at least 75. and you wonder why i don't like to drive any more???

came back through the mpls area sunday evening, and it's still fast and loose. the freeway was my best option, so i bit the bullet and did my best not to keep up. i couldn't relax or open the windows until i was about an hour away from home.....somehow even with a/c and cruise about 2/3 of the way home, i ended up with 59.8 for 260.5 miles. i think the lack of head wind had a lot to do with it.

so.....i really don't like traveling so much any more, because it just isn't fun to deal with all the speed being forced on you, and the reckless and rude people i share the road with.......

ok, done whining for now.:o

I can definitely identify with your experiences, Laurie. I grew up in the wooded, country area of the Piedmont in SC and the pace of life there is considerably different. It has sped up over the years but not like here.

I've been watching the traffic patterns get steadily worse here over the 7 years I've lived in this area, and just about every time I head out I start to wonder if I'm actually in Chicago now?

I'm at the point where I no longer even flinch when someone approaches my bumper at 75+mph when I'm doing 50-55mph. I'm much more stressed by the stupid driving that jolts me out of the nice smooth transitions I'm fond of using when behind the wheel. Most of the time I can avoid that but when someone almost takes my bumper off pulling in front of me and then slams on the brakes... :mad:

I'm sorry you had such a bad time of it -- it is definitely tiring to deal with this sort of thing. Especially when you know the car is capable of so much more -- if those people would just drive reasonably or get off the road!!

People speed because they can. They have this car with all this hp, so why not? They can't see any benefit to not using it.

And it feels good when you pass people. When you pass slower people, you feel you got ahead, you saved time, it feels like somehow you drove better than they did. It's hard not to pass another car and somehow feel superior.

This benefits are too ingrained in the present culture to change. That's because wanting to demonstrate we're stronger, smarter, faster than someone else --is in our animal genes.

Marketers understand this. Why else would you name a Hummer line "Alpha" ?

Sometimes (if we have to) the rational part takes over.....thank goodness the survival urge takes precedence. But most of the time, the rational part just 'rationalizes'. :(

Driving back from the Illinois alternative energy fair on Sunday driving 60mph in a 65 zone on open interstate with no one around a guy passed me, passenger rolled down his window and spit right at and hit my windshield.

I guess I was driving too slow for his liking.

Driving back from the Illinois alternative energy fair on Sunday driving 60mph in a 65 zone on open interstate with no one around a guy passed me, passenger rolled down his window and spit right at and hit my windshield.

I guess I was driving too slow for his liking.

something like this kind of proves to me that it's not just the driving thing, but the fact that courtesy, manners and civility are long gone. i used to feel at least some trust in the general population, but not any longer. people are just plain mean.

This morning a F350 pickup truck passing me in the lane just to the left of me made sure to fart plenty of diesel. (????)

I got 90mpg on the commute, and at his speed of 80-something he was probably doing 9mpg...does he have anger issues or what?

I just follow the advice someone posted here: smile and wave. And try to look senile (one of the advantages of gray hair!) so maybe they will just leave me alone. That's all I want, civility is too much to expect. Occasionally someone actually IS civil and that's a pleasent surprise.

I had the same experience as Laurie on a trip to Maine two weeks ago. Seems like the trip has gotten far less pleasant over the past two years, mainly due to sheer traffic volume on the interstates. Once I got onto the back roads in Maine things were much much more relaxed.

i took a weekend (3 day) trip to lacrosse for a photo job.

I'll be pulling into LaCrosse, Onalaska more precisely, sometime Saturday afternoon.:)

Home sweet home with my Mom and 4 brothers and families for the first time in 6 years.:woot:

My youngest brother is up in Minneapolis and has a 2005 Prius I'll be checking out. I don't think he's caught the hyperbug, he reluctantly reports low 40s. He may be one of those that bought it for appearances.;)

In the past I'd have locked the CC in at 80 through CO and NE (75 limit) and dropped to 75 in IA (65 limit) and then 78 in MN (70 limit) on into WI. One thing I've observed is the majority in 75 limit states are at 5 over or less, and 65 limit states like IA and WI push 10+ over the limit.

I've given myself more time to travel this time and will probably just hold the posted speed maybe 70 in 75 land and dwl and maybe some distance drafting. There are usually more Semis than passenger vehicles on my route.

Unfortunately it will be the Element, need more room for beer, golf clubs, guitars, etc. than the truck can hold inside. The Element takes a severe dive in mpg, like 25-28 at 65, or 19-20 at 80.:mad:

Not driving "normal" is the call we've all made, my own driving happiness and comfort is ruled by my priorities. I hope you aren't letting other peoples priorities ruin your driving Laurie. I'd go crazy if my expectation of others behavior was set very high, I'm much happier focusing on my behavior, and ignoring the jerks around me.

Feel free to ignore me.;)

Just to add another story:

Going to work this morning, and school has started. I pass a SUV sitting at the end of a driveway with the engine running and the windows fogged up from the A/C. Mom and little Billy sitting in their cool SUV wasting fuel, waiting for the school bus.
Further down the road and a school bus is making pickups on a curvy rural 2 lane road. There is a line of vehicles stacked up behind the bus.
I just relax and try to maintain a steady speed, which is about 40 mph. I'm keeping up but I leave about a 2-3 car gap ahead of me. The person behind me decides to pass me in a curve just to leapfrog ahead. Hurry up to go nowhere.
Temps have been breaking records and we've had 3 ozone alert days in a row. Driving home I pass a new subdivision development where they have bulldozed all the trees into a big pile and they are smoldering, not really burning. Lots of smoke and zero wind. I wanted to call the fire department, but they can't respond to it, no law against it.

I am depressed reading all that you have written. It is sad, that things are this way. Will they ever change? I doubt it! Depressing for sure.

I'll be pulling into LaCrosse, Onalaska more precisely, sometime Saturday afternoon.:)

Not driving "normal" is the call we've all made, my own driving happiness and comfort is ruled by my priorities. I hope you aren't letting other peoples priorities ruin your driving Laurie. I'd go crazy if my expectation of others behavior was set very high, I'm much happier focusing on my behavior, and ignoring the jerks around me.

Feel free to ignore me.;)

no, you make a valid point. and for quite some time during my trip i tried my best to tell myself to relax and drive my own drive, and let the others go around. but it got so fast and frantic, especially the 3-4 lanes wide in the cities, that it gets hard to even change lanes. then i got hot and cranky, and starting the internal complaining, which i really should have just gotten over instead of sitting and letting it stew.......

i guess my leisurely drive to work this morning, in which i really didn't have interaction with any other vehicles until i was 5 miles from work, helped reduce the crabby level a bit.

thanks :)

I am depressed reading all that you have written. It is sad, that things are this way. Will they ever change? I doubt it! Depressing for sure.

i'm sorry. i didn't mean to depress everybody, but i know we all feel the same frustration.....nobody gets it, and nobody cares. they have their heads in the ground and won't even notice what's happening. as i came home sunday night, there was almost a constant stream of headlights going back to the cities, the weekly migration to and from "da lake" with assorted toys being towed behind.

I have always driven slowly-- maybe it is more planned now-- as I have always been the cautious sort of nervous driver. Anyway, I don't know how much things have actually changed. People have honked at me since I started driving.

I find they are different depending on where you are. The drivers here are fairly rude imo, but now that I am here awhile I don't think worse than Chicago (though they seem to get ticked at different things-- here it is a cardinal sin to not go up to exactly the stop line at a light. I don't know what the big deal is, esp when there is no traffic). I think St. Louis drivers are somewhat nicer. (OTOH, I don't think St. Louisans are any nicer.) Key West drivers are wonderful. I think it is that everyone is having a good time and relaxed and on vacation. You commonly drive next to tricycles.

We also have an element in our culture here towards what I used to call "souped up"-- pulled up cars, small wheels, big mufflers, huge stereo systems, etc. They are really loud and noisy.
They act like they own the road.

I agree with greater lack of civility but the lack of civility in driving goes back a ways. I would guess that when greater horsepower has been here it started. If a car can go faster and faster and so on people tend to want to use it. I have gotten some rude nasty stuff that I could say has been going on awhile. Nothing quite as bad as being spat at though.

I dont' like driving that much. Actually I like hypermiling more as it is kind of a game to me. Now I think about how they are getting about 8 mpg while I am getting (at the moment say, glance at the SG, 70). I also think it is very strange how often people who have looked at me rudely, honked, given me the finger, etc. end up being ahead of me as a light just turns green. I can't even begin to think how often that has happened.

--des

I can't believe how impatient people are now. I think it is our society, the internet etc people demand instant gratification. They cannot stand to go slow if it is possible to be going faster.

Some of my favorite examples are when approaching a red, the SUV owner tailgating me will get in the turn lane early and pass me just to watch me pull up next to them at the light seconds later.

Also, when driving in heavy highway congestion (typical here in Detroit), with a steady stop and go averaging low speeds, I always keep distant from the car in front, avoiding the brakes every a few seconds. Of course, nobody else likes this very much, and will ride my rear close enough that I cant even see any thing out my rearview mirror except and giant GMC or Dodge grille.

Worse is that this type of driving is what causes the congestion in the first place. By driving slower, they would actually get there faster.

It is, to me, a steady trend toward selfishness that gets worse by the day. I heard a coworker say he thought society's becoming narcissistic. I don't know. People are growing ever more self important and rude. I sure notice it in the customers.

Nashville drivers aren't so bad as some other places, but there are still a lot that do the hurry up to go nowhere thing. I've been passed on the interstate by a car that was just getting ahead of me. It always makes me wonder what if they feel they accomplished anything. Sometimes I'll pass them on the two lane offramp coming into work, while coasting in neutral. Lot of good it did to go by me. I've figured out if I am travelling at the right speed, I can coast down the offramp and almost all the way to the parking lot at work and I'll sometimes go by people that hurried to get ahead of me. What a waste.

I used to drive like that, too, although more for entertainment. I had an Altima with Nissan's mighty V6 and enjoyed being pushed back in my seat by the car. I typically cruised down the interstate at 80-85 mph (speed limit's 70) and accelerated hard from stoplights. I averaged between 22 and 23 mpg. I filled up one night and paid $52, and that did it. Before I had to gas up again, I'd traded for a new Civic. It's surprising how much my driving changed - on the interstate I do about 60 and I cruise away from lights. It's opened my eyes a lot to how bad other people drive.

Hi Laurie:

___I feel so badly for you right now. Your story was not depressing but simply reality the way most of us see it. I am a bit more thick skinned I guess but see the same thing as you day after day after day :( Keep your chin up and your mind engaged to the task at hand. Given the direction we are headed, 95% of the public will be learning a harsh lesson in the not so distant future if they keep to their 20th century ways and ideals in the 21st century. You are the one in the right, not 95 + % of those at 10 – 15 over no matter how it appears to them.

___EvlMinion, welcome to the club. If its $’s, Environmental or geo-political, the reasons all lead to the same conclusions. From the sounds of it, you are doing a great job for all of us!

___Good Luck

___Wayne

It is, to me, a steady trend toward selfishness that gets worse by the day. I heard a coworker say he thought society's becoming narcissistic. I don't know. People are growing ever more self important and rude. I sure notice it in the customers.I'm afraid it's true. Got a confession - when there is a car weaving like a jackrabbit - speeding, I sometimes within my lane start weaving and do the low-speed version of him.

It was too public to do this at HybridFest, but what I wanted to do is in my NASCAR jacket and cap do as a pedestrian what I see on the roads, but better yet, a professional comedian try this:

Sprint then screach to a halt stomping their feet behind someone, then whip around screaming about either making an appointment or the need to kick a$$
Make an abrupt 90-degree turn to a side door the same way people jump three lanes 20 yards from a freeway exit....have the pants halfway drop as they do it. :p
In general, just screaming when other pedestrians are even slightly in the way for no apparent reason.
Bumping into other pedestrians while on a phone, shaving, or putting on makeup
Guys strutting like they do while driving, actually thinking they are God's Gift http://www.spencerthelion.com/images/fullofit01.jpgI really wish a prominent comedian would do something like this and maybe a few people would start driving friendly.

I'm afraid it's true. Got a confession - when there is a car I really wish a prominent comedian would do something like this and maybe a few people would start driving friendly.
I'll get right on it. Oops, I missed that you wanted a prominent comedian. ;)

[LIST]
Sprint then screach to a halt stomping their feet behind someone, then whip around screaming about either making an appointment or the need to kick a$$
Make an abrupt 90-degree turn to a side door the same way people jump three lanes 20 yards from a freeway exit....have the pants halfway drop as they do it. :p
In general, just screaming when other pedestrians are even slightly in the way for no apparent reason.
Bumping into other pedestrians while on a phone, shaving, or putting on makeup
Guys strutting like they do while driving, actually thinking they are God's Gift

omigod, chuck, i am laughing here at work. i LOVE the idea, however, it might scare the crap out of little old ladies on the sidewalk. it needs to be applied to those who drive so badly. unfortunately, i don't think any of us can catch them and thus follow them after they exit their shrines.



:driveby1:

I was going to add something to the hybridfest trip-log thread,
but this one seems more appropriate... I've been having these
thoughts about the hypermiling/ecodriving mindset and how we
expect various objects in motion to behave. We tend to think much
farther ahead than most -- taking action based on where the car
will be in the next 10-15 seconds, not where it is right now.
Often an even longer timeframe, such as discussed in the other
thread about planning for offramps. Most people think like the
stock market -- acting immediately and impulsively on very short-term
events. So in a way, ecodriving is all about living the longer
time-constant events.
.
One example is the way I find myself steering, especially in a
Prius. Its rack with electric assist does not provide much road
feedback [something that a lot of people gripe about], so the
mechanism becomes entirely visual. For a lane change, I'll focus
on a point fairly far ahead in the target lane, still taking
nearby traffic into account, light the signal and begin turning
the wheel at a particular rate for a particular duration that will
start angling the car toward that point. Correct back to straight
with an equally "damped" response, and then simply wait for the
drift to happen until the right point, and as I get near the
center of the new lane, apply the same control syntax to straighten
out into it. This is even more fun to plan while on a curve,
since you now have to take that into account too.
.
Or I'll be cranking up a hill at my carefully-regulated 2300
RPM and as I crest, begin backing off the pedal at a rate selected
to match how sharply the hill curves over toward the backside,
with the long-term target either being my lower limit of 1700
or 1800 when the pedal motion stops. With the option of a more
abrupt backoff to zero to go into warp-stealth in case the low
end of the torquing range is too much. Naturally all this also
always takes other externals into account, such as on-ramps with
entering traffic that I might have to zipper in with, etc.
.
In other words, I've always pretty much thought down to the level
of d(control)/dt, i.e. not at the level of speed or acceleration
but right down to the "jerk" derivative and then simply knowing
how long it takes for those control changes to have the desired
effect. Contrast with most people, who only seem able to think
about short-term *position* changes and try desperately to control
that with abrupt actions on the controls available to them.
.
So, X, V, A, or J versus T and M -- what's your favorite set of
mental realtime-calculation variables? And for the real problem,
how do we re-teach basic physics to the common redneck?
.
_H*

You make a great point, Chuck. Most people would not treat others the same way without the protection of their vehicle. And I don't mean protection in the sense that they have air bags, seat belts, etc. I'm talking about ego protection. It is easy to hide one's true self behind the persona one wants to display with their vehicle. Likewise, it is easy to see others on the road as just a vehicle, rather than a person in a vehicle. "That SUV just cut off that Buick", instead of "the dumba$$ driving that SUV just cut off the little old lady in the Buick" or whatever. Road rage is so much easier when it is machine vs machine. It alows a lot of emotional detachment.

I don't care if the comedian is famous already...I wish they would become famous doing a skit like this.

Maybe it could be called: EgoDriving. :p

Another part of the skit: The poseur driver compsating for his...you know...maybe fake bulging biceps, tatoos, leather jacket, going around with a frown asking everyone: "Wanna piece of me!!??"



I forgot about charging behind a pedestrian, stomping thier feet about five seconds, then as they race by, fart a black cloud (diesel trucks).

There's a commercial I've seen on TV of a supermarket where people do exactly this --fuming, tailgating, passing, etc with their shopping carts and is very funny. Can't remember the product. Of course what's funny is knowing we'd never dare to do such thing without a 4000 lb car keeping us from getting slugged.

...you know...maybe fake bulging biceps, tatoos, leather jacket, going around with a frown asking everyone: "Wanna piece of me!!??"Something like this?
http://www.carstickers.com/prodimages/216.gif
I don't know if it happens elsewhere but probably 1 in 20 male drivers in Houston have this very decal on their car/truck/suv. I won't share what is hanging from the trailer hitch.

11011011

http://www.carstickers.com/prodimages/216.gif
I haven't seen that since I was a kid. You mean guys still put this kind of crap on their cars today?! :o

Living in Canada it's hard for me to relate to this thread although driving in a million+ city. Speeding fines for 20 to 30 mph over the limit are progressively from about $200 to $350, are often done remotely by camera and are tied into the vehicle registration so the fines do get payed. Over 30 mph is considered a criminal 'dangerous driving' offense, will involve a court appearance and with inner-city freeways and highways being camera monitored and response times fairly quick, some guy doing 30 over will be picked up usually within 5 minutes or less often with 2 or more police units attending. On top of a $500 or more fine the court appearance will likely remove half or more of the 15 licence points, and a second occurance will involve loss of licence and double the insurance rate for 3 years or more. If the speeding happens in a 'construction zone' or the licence plate has a plastic 'anti-camera' covering everything above doubles so +30 guy is screwed.

For some years children here have been given 'Life skills' highschool courses which include defensive and seasonal driving instruction; Nascar and other road and track racing sports aren't heavily promoted, and talking with the three or so 'performance' shops in town the majority of their business involves safety and efficiency mods rather than speed. If I'm doing the limit down a 50 mph freeway I'll often see dozens of vehicles following for miles and the odd guy out who gets the weird looks and sometimes the finger is the retard doing 15 mph over, or maybe someone will phone his licence number in for creating a road hazard. All of this from the province about the size of Texas that supplies all of Canada's fuel needs and about 1/4 or more of the US. Unfortunately it sounds to me like you folks have a few anti-social issues to work on but maybe more so in some regions, as I haven't seen the problems described when driving in most of the western US states and cities. :)

Cheers from Canada.

So, X, V, A, or J versus T and M -- what's your favorite set of
mental realtime-calculation variables? And for the real problem,
how do we re-teach basic physics to the common redneck?
.
_H*

Hobbit, I'm also solidly in the J camp. As for reteaching... that IS a tough one. That's on a level with teaching someone chess first, then making them practice with a specifically weighted ball with different targets on a contoured board. That's how I would go about getting it started, but the real kicker is that will only work for people who are already motivated.

When we start getting into the motivation that is where it gets sticky. Humans have an innate and deeply ingrained hatred of being forced to do anything. Forcing people to go to courses for this sort of thing when caught speeding/rage driving/etc is unlikely to really help. The reason Canada's setup works is because it is supported as a positive thing at the societal level. We just don't have that here.

I would say that the best chance at a lasting change is through careful training of new drivers -- with a view toward simply outlasting and replacing all of the bad drivers on the road. I really think that in a lot of cases "retraining" just isn't going to stick. You and I, along with the rest of the people who frequent this site are unfortunately a rather small contingent of the drivers on the road.

I don't intend to be gloomy about this -- it is just a large and daunting task -- not insurmountable! If we all do our best to educate and lead by example those around us (when possible!), we will eventually do a LOT of good. Better than calling the government in to "fix" the situation.

By the way, I noticed in an old posting that you are using lynx and it prevents you from having blank lines. Give the newer (still text) browser "links" a shot -- it can handle some Javascript and when I tried entering a reply it did not prevent me from putting blank lines in. Unless it takes them out when you actually submit (which I don't think it would) it may be a better choice for you?

Living in Canada it's hard for me to relate to this thread although driving in a million+ city. Speeding fines for 20 to 30 mph over the limit are progressively from about $200 to $350, are often done remotely by camera and are tied into the vehicle registration so the fines do get payed. Over 30 mph is considered a criminal 'dangerous driving' offense, will involve a court appearance and with inner-city freeways and highways being camera monitored and response times fairly quick, some guy doing 30 over will be picked up usually within 5 minutes or less often with 2 or more police units attending. On top of a $500 or more fine the court appearance will likely remove half or more of the 15 licence points, and a second occurance will involve loss of licence and double the insurance rate for 3 years or more. If the speeding happens in a 'construction zone' or the licence plate has a plastic 'anti-camera' covering everything above doubles so +30 guy is screwed.



Cheers from Canada.

it sounds like our neighbors to the north are way ahead of us as far as social skills and dealing with road crazies.....hmmm, it's not that far from minnesota ;)

Dangerous driving and big speeding needs to be punished hard. How about taking the car off the owner and crushing it. The powers that be can perfectly well deal with problems if they want to. If everybody hypermiled, the tax generated from fuel would drop a lot. I dont think a government anywhere would like that. But they do have to look 'green' so i imagine its a tricky problem for them.

Dangerous driving and big speeding needs to be punished hard. How about taking the car off the owner and crushing it.

You mean like this (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19339955/)?

Hi all--

A little late to this thread, but I wanted to share my experiences. Here in Cincinnati, a heavily German city, I believe we still maintain a little of the German courtesy and bashfulness. I like to think we're a pretty friendly town for being 2+ million.

That said, it is deteriorating at an alarming rate. I used to be one of them and it still comes to me on occasion. I see someone driving like an idiot and I feel I have to teach them a lesson. I have calmed dramatically since buying the HCHII, and it helps that there is not a stitch of highway driving on my commute. Most is four-lane surface road with a fair stretch of two-lane.

That said, there is one behavior that absolutely still gets me fired up every time -- tailgating. Nothing makes me more upset when driving. When did it become okay to crowd up on someone's bumper to tell them you're not going fast enough? It's against the law, it's dangerous, and it is terribly rude.

This mostly occurs on the two-lane portions, and I'm generally doing the speed limit or very slightly above. There are stop lights at each end of the two-lane stretches, so no one is really gaining anything. But nevertheless, about once or twice a week someone's following me close enough that I can't see their headlights. I just wish there was a method less confrontational than a hard brake tap to get the message across... --RN

Wow, that's just more confirmation that it really is a societal
and training problem, not anything to do with the vehicles.
.
Another level of subtlety I re-noticed the other day is the effects
from *lack* of taking any action, or re-timing it. Example:
someone passes me on the left and goes to pull in front, in
a reasonable [albeit just a little closer than I'd like] fashion.
Just before their bulk eclipses my view of the car in front of
*them*, I see a little butt-wiggle and a few milliseconds of
blinker flash from that other car ahead. From that I know that
someone else is also moving over ahead of this guy and that's
going to affect what he does. Since I just WSed my way to near
the bottom of a slope and was about to start my burn for the
up, I simply stay in the WS for about five more seconds. That
adapts to the re-positioning of the two cars now ahead, puts
me at equal speed with the one ahead and then slowly starting
to drop back to my normal following distance, and then I've got
all kinds of road ahead of me when I finally start the burn.
No overt correction needed, just a slightly different slope on
the timing.
.
I *love* this stuff. There must be things on the order of
complexity as the orbital mechanics of getting to the moon going
on in my head, which I could never come up with the math for,
and of course on a much shorter timeframe and with a few less-
predictable variables. [If the moon pulled a sudden lane swap,
we'd be kinda screwed.] But see, it *is* rocket science!
.
I see the same disparity going on in the pedestrian world, too.
I'm pretty good at predicting a walk speed that will put me
well after a car's passing rear bumper, except that when the
drivers see me starting to trace that path they *slow down*
because they think I'm gonna be in front of them! Duh. But
you've seen my rants about the upgefukt-ness of crosswalk laws
and their relation to energy usage. First thing to do, of course,
is send all the lawyers to the moon.
.
_H*

Maybe I just ignore the bad stuff, but I doesn't seem like I have to deal with as much of the bad stuff as most of the other people here. Maybe I'm just in situations where the other drivers are stressed less often.

Just today I was driving home on a four-lane at about 53 MPH (PSL=55) when a truck (another black Ranger ) came up behind me and followed me closely for a little while. The driver looked like another guy who works for a living. Some people on this forum would call both of us "rednecks" by looking at us. When he passed me we flashed each other the peace sign. It doesn't work like that other places, I guess.

... But nevertheless, about once or twice a week someone's following me close enough that I can't see their headlights. I just wish there was a method less confrontational than a hard brake tap to get the message across... --RN


Hmmm. Have you heard of the idea that law enforcement has been considering, where they would launch a ball of some sticky substance containing a tracking chip onto the back of a fleeing car? Then instead of a dangerous high speed chase, they back off and just track and follow the vehicle from a distance until it stops, and then converge on it.

We could design the same sort of thing, only it would mount in the trunk of your car. Then you could fire the sticky projectile behind you onto the tailgater's grill. Attached would be a note saying, "Stop tailgating, it's dangerous and illegal!" They probably wouldn't even notice it until they got home.

Not driving "normal" is the call we've all made, my own driving happiness and comfort is ruled by my priorities. I hope you aren't letting other peoples priorities ruin your driving Laurie. I'd go crazy if my expectation of others behavior was set very high, I'm much happier focusing on my behavior, and ignoring the jerks around me.


Well said. Over the years I've come to take some positions and engage in some activities that aren't those of the majority, and I don't let the majority make me feel bad about it. I don't try to be different just to be different, but rather because I've considered the particular issue and believe I've come to the right conclusion using the facts as I understand them. For example:

I'm an atheist in a country of people who overwhelmingly believe in god.

I'm (mostly) liberal in an area, and in a job, where most of the people are conservative.

I run long distances while most people avoid exercise.

And now I also drive so that I conserve fuel. If the majority of drivers out there don't like it, too bad, I'm not doing anything wrong. In fact I like to think it's another thing I'm doing right.

:Banane09:

Well said. Over the years I've come to take some positions and engage in some activities that aren't those of the majority, and I don't let the majority make me feel bad about it. I don't try to be different just to be different, but rather because I've considered the particular issue and believe I've come to the right conclusion using the facts as I understand them,

I'm an atheist in a country of people who overwhelmingly believe in god.

I'm (mostly) liberal in an area, and in a job, where most of the people are conservative.

I run long distances while most people avoid exercise.

And now I also drive so that I conserve fuel. If the majority of drivers out there don't like it, too bad, I'm not doing anything wrong. In fact I like to think it's another thing I'm doing right.

:Banane09:

very interesting, it sounds like we are a lot alike. the only difference is i no longer run since my knees gave out. i live in a town in which one of the main employers is a camp that trains for the army, national guard, etc. my position would not be popular if i chose to discuss it.

i don't go along with what is considered to be trendy, i guess we both (and probably a lot of us on here) tend to march to our own drummer and like it that way.

thanks for putting it in perspective :)

BTW, RLC -- I do use "links" occasionally and went back for
another look at its documentation. The problem with it is that
there's no way to manage cookies at all, specifically to preload
a file with cookies for a particular site like I do with "lynx"
to autologin to most of the forums I read. If "links" had
a --cookie-file=... switch or whatever, it might be an
alternative. Oh, and I don't *want* a javascript interpreter.
Website designers have to start learning that people can turn
off dangerous functionality in any browser, and often do, and
to not RELY on using it in their site content.
.
But I guess that's for a different thread, i.e. browsing like
"normal" people (long) ...
.
_H*

BTW, RLC -- I do use "links" occasionally and went back for
another look at its documentation. The problem with it is that
there's no way to manage cookies at all, specifically to preload
a file with cookies for a particular site like I do with "lynx"
to autologin to most of the forums I read. If "links" had
a --cookie-file=... switch or whatever, it might be an
alternative. Oh, and I don't *want* a javascript interpreter.
Website designers have to start learning that people can turn
off dangerous functionality in any browser, and often do, and
to not RELY on using it in their site content.
.
But I guess that's for a different thread, i.e. browsing like
"normal" people (long) ...
.
_H*

Ah. Then perhaps elinks instead? Have a look here (http://webscripts.softpedia.com/script/Internet-Browsers-C-C/ELinks-28793.html) -- I see it supports "persistent cookies." Would this fit the bill?

I know what you mean about the "browsing like normal people" -- I use Firefox and Opera quite a bit, but I'm just as fond of text only browsing. I use FreeBSD on pretty much all my machines. ;)

... the only difference is i no longer run since my knees gave out.

Sorry to hear about your knees. Hope you still stay active. I've been lucky, in 15+ years of running I've only been sidelined for a total of two months. That was to recover from a stress fracture in my lower tibia. I may not be the fastest one out there, but I'm always out there!

very interesting, it sounds like we are a lot alike. the only difference is i no longer run since my knees gave out. i live in a town in which one of the main employers is a camp that trains for the army, national guard, etc. my position would not be popular if i chose to discuss it.

i don't go along with what is considered to be trendy, i guess we both (and probably a lot of us on here) tend to march to our own drummer and like it that way.

thanks for putting it in perspective :)

Well, that makes three atheist, ecodriving, distance-running enjoying liberals in "red" regions...I always really appreciate it when someone speaks up about being atheist, because it just doesn't always seem to be a welcome perspective. :p

Sorry to hear about your knees. Hope you still stay active. I've been lucky, in 15+ years of running I've only been sidelined for a total of two months. That was to recover from a stress fracture in my lower tibia. I may not be the fastest one out there, but I'm always out there!

i actually had a knee replacement just over a year ago. it slowed me down for a while, though i worked out a lot during rehab. now i ride horse 4-5 times a week and that's a good workout too. not to mention the mental relaxation.