groar
08-28-2010, 02:49 PM
Here is how I build a kill switch on my old Renault turbo diesel. It may not be applicable to a lot of other engines, but may permit to test other diesels...
To do my kill switch I decided to put a switch on a cable connected to the stop solenoid.
On a diesel the stop solenoid permits to stop the diesel flow else the engine would continue to run... That happened to me a few months ago when the stop solenoid got blocked so I had to make the engine stall to stop it. It's strange to hear the engine to continue to run while your car is switched off without any key in it. Sadly the solenoid is inside an anti-thief box which have to be broken to be able to repair the solenoid : cost, cost, cost...
First I took a revue for my car :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueCouverture_o.jpg
I found the electric diagram :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueDiagramme_o.jpg
Damned, why did I never took any electricity/electronic option at school ?
I located the stop solenoid on it (#22 on the center of the photo) :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueDiagrammeDetail_o.jpg
So decided to put the switch on cables #384, #382 or #383.
So first step is to open the engine compartment :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_Moteur_o.jpg
Damned, why did I never took any mechanical option at school ?
then open the fuse compartment :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_Fusibles_o.jpg
Damned, going through all these cables is like going "through a fractal on a breaking wall"... (Seal (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Seal_%28musician%29) in Crazy (http://www.lyrics007.com/Seal%20Lyrics/Crazy%20Lyrics.html))
Sadly I couldn't identify any of the cables I was talking about :-( so I decided to use another method : deport a fuse and put a switch in series...
First find the description of the engine compartment fuse box in the revue :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueFusibles_o.jpg
Here it's the #A
From the description on the left the more interesting one is the #4 as it's about the stop solenoid and not about the ECU.
I tried to remove each #4 fuse and tried to start to the engine hoping that the ECU will start but not the engine. Sadly for all of them the ECU and the engine started...
The description of #2 fuse is about solenoids and the ECU, so logically it was not the correct one, but I tried it anyway... I removed the #2 fuse. The ECU started when I turned the key to II but the engine didn't start when I turned the key to III :) At least I identified an anti-thief mechanism ;)
The idea was then to deport the fuse. I tried to search on web sites for a "false" fuse permitting to connect cables on it, so to build a fuse deport and put a switch in series. In fact I quickly found that the electric connectors have the same size as the fuse :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_FusiblesVSCosses_o.jpg
so the solution was easy :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_FusiblesKillSwitch_o.jpg
And you just have to connect a fuse holder and a switch :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_KillSwitch_o.jpg
A static test shows that it works : the engine stops while nor the ECU nor the accessories are reset : mov00011.mp4 (http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/mov00011.mp4) (2.8MB).
You can see :
the RPM on the right,
the heat plugs light at the upper right,
the airbag light at the upper left,
the low fuel light at the lower left.
Time line :
00:03 : the engine starts
00:07 : the kill switch kills the engine
00:10 : the kill switch is put back on
So finally I installed the switch on the DashBoard :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_KillSwitchOnDashBoard_o.jpg
Currently it's temporary. To use the switch I push it down with the forefinger and the middle finger then push the button with the thumb. The place is much more convenient than the key for 2 reasons. First it's much more closed to the horizon so the eyes doesn't have to move as much. Second my right hand can go very easily from the steering wheel to the switch, while it's more difficult to go to the key hidden under the steering wheel.
The last mystery... will I be able to use this switch to FAS ? The stop solenoid is coded, so the solenoid and the ECU must be able to dialog for the solenoid to accept to start, or the ECU to accept to start the solenoid (I don't know the detail). Concretely I may be able to switch the engine off with the switch, but may not be able to restart the engine by bump starting if the solenoid isn't restarted...
While rolling in neutral when the switch is pushed to off then the engine stops, then when the switch is pushed back to on then the heat plugs are switched on and the airbag resets. After a while, a bump start restarts the engine as usually when I was using the key :cool:
From my tests this is what I can say about using the FAS kill switch against using the key :
Positive :
The place I put the switch is more convenient than where is the key
The steering wheel assistance doesn't disappear suddenly now, much better at home
The accessories aren't stopped, noticeably the rear view camera used as the passenger mirror
The ECU isn't stopped and reset so the odometer counts every meter, but over all I feel safer
The switch can be used as an anti-thief mechanism ;)
Negative :
When I Fas to a stop, the key have to be back to I before being able to start the engine, but not a real annoyance.
The switch used is a regular one, so I have to push one side to stop then the other side to stop. It's noisy, it will not disturb me but may disturb passengers. I may change it if I can find a simple push button.
The electric windows aren't reset so the driver window stay in automatic mode and is much more difficult to move precisely.
Have fun,
Denis.
To do my kill switch I decided to put a switch on a cable connected to the stop solenoid.
On a diesel the stop solenoid permits to stop the diesel flow else the engine would continue to run... That happened to me a few months ago when the stop solenoid got blocked so I had to make the engine stall to stop it. It's strange to hear the engine to continue to run while your car is switched off without any key in it. Sadly the solenoid is inside an anti-thief box which have to be broken to be able to repair the solenoid : cost, cost, cost...
First I took a revue for my car :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueCouverture_o.jpg
I found the electric diagram :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueDiagramme_o.jpg
Damned, why did I never took any electricity/electronic option at school ?
I located the stop solenoid on it (#22 on the center of the photo) :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueDiagrammeDetail_o.jpg
So decided to put the switch on cables #384, #382 or #383.
So first step is to open the engine compartment :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_Moteur_o.jpg
Damned, why did I never took any mechanical option at school ?
then open the fuse compartment :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_Fusibles_o.jpg
Damned, going through all these cables is like going "through a fractal on a breaking wall"... (Seal (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Seal_%28musician%29) in Crazy (http://www.lyrics007.com/Seal%20Lyrics/Crazy%20Lyrics.html))
Sadly I couldn't identify any of the cables I was talking about :-( so I decided to use another method : deport a fuse and put a switch in series...
First find the description of the engine compartment fuse box in the revue :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_RevueFusibles_o.jpg
Here it's the #A
From the description on the left the more interesting one is the #4 as it's about the stop solenoid and not about the ECU.
I tried to remove each #4 fuse and tried to start to the engine hoping that the ECU will start but not the engine. Sadly for all of them the ECU and the engine started...
The description of #2 fuse is about solenoids and the ECU, so logically it was not the correct one, but I tried it anyway... I removed the #2 fuse. The ECU started when I turned the key to II but the engine didn't start when I turned the key to III :) At least I identified an anti-thief mechanism ;)
The idea was then to deport the fuse. I tried to search on web sites for a "false" fuse permitting to connect cables on it, so to build a fuse deport and put a switch in series. In fact I quickly found that the electric connectors have the same size as the fuse :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_FusiblesVSCosses_o.jpg
so the solution was easy :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_FusiblesKillSwitch_o.jpg
And you just have to connect a fuse holder and a switch :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_KillSwitch_o.jpg
A static test shows that it works : the engine stops while nor the ECU nor the accessories are reset : mov00011.mp4 (http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/mov00011.mp4) (2.8MB).
You can see :
the RPM on the right,
the heat plugs light at the upper right,
the airbag light at the upper left,
the low fuel light at the lower left.
Time line :
00:03 : the engine starts
00:07 : the kill switch kills the engine
00:10 : the kill switch is put back on
So finally I installed the switch on the DashBoard :
http://www.groar.org/EcoModder/Megane_201008_KillSwitchOnDashBoard_o.jpg
Currently it's temporary. To use the switch I push it down with the forefinger and the middle finger then push the button with the thumb. The place is much more convenient than the key for 2 reasons. First it's much more closed to the horizon so the eyes doesn't have to move as much. Second my right hand can go very easily from the steering wheel to the switch, while it's more difficult to go to the key hidden under the steering wheel.
The last mystery... will I be able to use this switch to FAS ? The stop solenoid is coded, so the solenoid and the ECU must be able to dialog for the solenoid to accept to start, or the ECU to accept to start the solenoid (I don't know the detail). Concretely I may be able to switch the engine off with the switch, but may not be able to restart the engine by bump starting if the solenoid isn't restarted...
While rolling in neutral when the switch is pushed to off then the engine stops, then when the switch is pushed back to on then the heat plugs are switched on and the airbag resets. After a while, a bump start restarts the engine as usually when I was using the key :cool:
From my tests this is what I can say about using the FAS kill switch against using the key :
Positive :
The place I put the switch is more convenient than where is the key
The steering wheel assistance doesn't disappear suddenly now, much better at home
The accessories aren't stopped, noticeably the rear view camera used as the passenger mirror
The ECU isn't stopped and reset so the odometer counts every meter, but over all I feel safer
The switch can be used as an anti-thief mechanism ;)
Negative :
When I Fas to a stop, the key have to be back to I before being able to start the engine, but not a real annoyance.
The switch used is a regular one, so I have to push one side to stop then the other side to stop. It's noisy, it will not disturb me but may disturb passengers. I may change it if I can find a simple push button.
The electric windows aren't reset so the driver window stay in automatic mode and is much more difficult to move precisely.
Have fun,
Denis.