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Wayne has a 2003 Ranger (4 cylinder) that acheives great mpg. I think he turns the engine off alot (FAS) then starts it again using the 12 volt battery & starter. Therefore, he is discharging the battery and later while driving, is charging the battery. Maybe in a sense, he's driving a gas - electric hybrid. With electricity providing no direct assist to the drivetrain, maybe this could be termed an indirect hybrid?

LOL! Maybe he should patent the technology.

Very interesting thought Billy. Never really thought of it in that exact way. ;)

Terry

:In that case, I also have a hybrid. Not bad for a 93.:D

Hi Bill:

___I wonder if I were to place one of the brand new high tech - Valance Li-Ion 12V’s in her if I could then really call her a hybrid ;) There are many of us that do wish Ford would release the Ranger XLT with the Escape HEV’s components as that would be an excellent around town pure utility vehicle imho.

___Dan, make sure you take a look at those new Valance U-Charge Li-ION 12V’s ( http://www.valence.com/ucharge.asp). They appear to have remote monitoring capability! Wouldn’t that be fun to play with ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

could you start a car with a Li-ION? Or would it drain them too fast.

I want to build an EV with the Valence U Charge batteries. :eek:

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a303/Sledge454/ohhellsyeah6mj.gif

Hi Tom:

___Those Li-Ion’s are the next killer app for future Hybrid’s and non-hybrid’s alike imho. Here is a blog by Bill Moore of EVWorld discussing batteries including Li-Ion’s for future transportation implementation as well as a pic and short description of the Toyota Vitz w/ Li-Ion’s w/ Start-Stop sold only in Japan IIRC.

The Hybrid Battery Race Is On (http://www.evworld.com/view.cfm?section=article&storyid=703)

http://www.evworld.com/images/toyota_vitz.jpg
The only production vehicle, to date, to incorporate lithium batteries is the Toyota Vitz, a subcompact vehicle available Japan, which, according to Toyota's Dave Hermance, isn't a true power-assist hybrid like the Prius or even a mild-Hybrid like the Crown. Depicted above, the car incorporates lithium ion as part of its automatic stop/start system.___Now look at the following Valance Sapphire’s linked above for a taste of what is possibly to come for non-hybrid Li-Ion application possibly?

http://www.valence.com/images/U-Charge_Graph.jpg

___Notice the discharge rates? The following has some interesting data points as well …

Valence U-Charge Power System (http://www.valence.com/ucharge.asp)

Cycle Life (80% DOD)
Li-Ion: 2,000
Pb-Acid: 300

Nominal Weight (kg)
Li-Ion: 7
Pb-Acid: 11

___And beyond that, if you look at any of the A123Systems (http://www.a123systems.com/html/tech/life.html) Nano-Tech based Li-Ion 3.7V cel’s. Wow! Although these cel’s are just now being scaled up for industrial use, the future looks bright. The number one data point out of A123 is the following:
A unique feature of A123Systems’ M1 cells is their ability to charge to high capacity in 5 minutes or less. That’s a significant improvement over traditional Li Ion, which typically requires more than 90 minutes to reach a similar level of charge. This unique capability offers a new level of convenience for users of cordless products. Fast charge will be a key enabler of practical electric drive vehicles; by combining fast charge with high energy, high power and safety A123Systems M1 batteries are the ideal solution for next generation electric motorcycles, PHEV and electric drive vehicles.
http://www.a123systems.com/images/charts/chargeProfile.gif

___A good basic write up on what these things are capable of as well as their market potential …

New Type of Battery Offers Voltage Aplenty (http://webreprints.djreprints.com/1340890151936.html)
A new generation of rechargeable batteries—delivering far more power than their predecessors—is energizing the power-tool industry and generating widespread interest in applications in everything from vacuum cleaners to ride-on lawn mowers to hybrid cars … The technology driving A123 is based on discoveries by MIT professor Yet-Ming Chiang, a materials scientist. Dr. Chiang, who co-founded A123, says "research in batteries is very seductive," because it initially looks easy to boost power, but many variations turn out to shorten battery life or make batteries so unstable that runaway oxidation explosions occur. "They are chemically complex, electrically complex and mechanically complex," he says.

A123 says it coats an aluminum electrode inside the battery with nano-scale particles, a few hundred atoms in size, of lithium metal phosphate. It declines to disclose more detail, but Dr. Chiang says the phosphate is safer than the oxide-based chemistry used in lithium-ion batteries today. He says that when compared with the same weight of larger particles, the nano-scale particles release more ions, thereby freeing electrons to create an electric current.___A123’s Li-Ion’s appear to be so far beyond anything available other then possibly Toshiba’s own internal Li-Ion’s that I cannot fathom all of the possibilities. I wish they were public because someone is going to make a lot of money using this technology ;)

___I should have made an article out of this one :)

___Good Luck

___Wayne