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http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/2/AmericanFlag.jpg According to CR’s, the Insight's 38_mpg overall fuel economy is one of its few highpoints. (cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=218845)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/2010_Honda_Insight_EX.jpgWayne Gerdes - CleanMPG (cleanmpg.com) - June 29, 2009

2010 Honda Insight - $19,800 to start and 41 mpgUS combined scores poorly whereas the Fit it is based off of scored well previously?

Yonkers, NY. -- As reported by Matthew William’s yesterday in the thread entitled CU (consumers union) Says FU to Insight II (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23132), CR's did a number to the Honda Insight. Some of it deserved... Today even more details were released.

According to CR’s, the new Honda Insight posted an average "Good" overall road-test score in CRs' testing for the August issue. The Insight achieved an excellent 38 mpg overall in CR's tests but fell short in ride quality, handling, interior noise, acceleration, rear-seat, access and visibility.

"The Insight is the most disappointing Honda CR's has tested in a long time," said David Champion, senior director of CR's Auto Test Center. "The Insight is a noisy, stiff-riding car with clumsy handling that is nothing like the Fit on which it is based. Also, Electronic Stability Control is only available on the highline EX version."

In a ratings chart of small hatchbacks and wagons, the Insight was rated 21st out of 22 vehicles, with a road test score of 54 points. It was followed by the Dodge Caliber, which scored 49.

Two new wagons, spin-offs of popular sedans -- the Volkswagen Jetta Sportwagen and Hyundai Elantra Touring scored within a point of each other and received Very Good ratings, 80 and 79 respectively.

The Sportwagen, a new addition to the Jetta line, combines sound driving dynamics and more cargo and versatility than the sedan. It also imparts the feeling of a much more expensive vehicle. The Elantra Touring, also an extension to its line, is an affordable and practical vehicle with good fuel economy (26 mpg in CR's own fuel economy tests.)

CRs tested a total of six wagons and hatchbacks in the August issue including the improved Chevrolet HHR and the Pontiac Vibe (the virtual twin of the Toyota Matrix.) The Vibe will be discontinued this August given GM's decision to discontinue the Pontiac brand. Both the Vibe and the HHR received Very Good ratings. The test group also included the sporty Mazda3 hatchback, freshened with a new four-cylinder engine and new styling was also rated Very Good.

Prices ranged from $19,085 for the Pontiac to $24,730 for the Chevy HHR. All vehicles in the test proved to have average of better reliability in CR.

CR also tested the Kia Soul. The Soul shares several of the same attributes of the small, boxy Scion xB, and was also rated Very Good. This is a new model so CR does not have any reliability data and cannot yet recommend the Soul.

All vehicles in the test group are recommended by CRs except for the Insight, which scored too low in CRs tests to be recommended and the Soul, which does not have any reliability data yet. CRs only recommends vehicles that have performed well in its tests, have at least average predicted reliability based on CRs Annual Car Reliability Survey of its more than seven million print and web subscribers, and performed at least adequately if crash-tested or included in a government rollover test.

Full tests and ratings of the test group appear in the August issue of CRs, which goes on sale June 30. The reports are also available to subscribers of Consumer Reports (www.ConsumerReports.org).

The Honda Insight seats five and gets excellent fuel economy, but it's a noisy car with a stiff ride and clumsy handling. At its cornering limits, the Insight plows straight ahead early on in tight turns and the tail can slide out too quickly for stability control to completely prevent it. The Insight EX, ($21,790 Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price as tested), is powered by a 1.3-liter four-cylinder engine with a 13-hp electric motor combined for 98 hp that delivers 38 mpg overall. The continuously variable transmission performs smoothly. Unlike a full hybrid, the Insight requires the gas engine to turn whenever the car is moving. Braking is Very Good. Cargo space behind the rear seats is adequate.

The wagon version of the Volkswagen Jetta combines good driving dynamics and versatility with excellent fit and finish. The Jetta SE, ($24,324, MSRP as tested), is powered by a 170-hp, 2.5-liter, five-cylinder engine that delivers average performance but got only 23 mpg overall in CR's fuel economy tests. The six-speed automatic transmission shifts smoothly and has a manual-override feature. Braking is Very Good. The cargo area is very spacious and you can fold down one or both sections of the rear seatbacks.

The Elantra Touring wagon is fairly roomy and versatile, with a nicely finished interior and lots of amenities for the money. The Touring's ride is noticeably stiffer than the sedan's ride, with some sharp impacts. The Elantra Touring wagon, ($19,475, MSRP as tested), is powered by a 138-hp, 2.0-liter four-cylinder engine that delivers average performance and a respectable 26-mpg overall. The four-speed automatic transmission shifts smoothly and responsively. Braking is Excellent. Folding down the 60/40 seatback makes for a fairly commodious load volume.

The Mazda3 has been one of CR's top-scoring small cars for several years, distinguished by agile handling and a good-quality interior that is laid out well. The Mazda3 had a firm, compliant ride that provided good isolation from everyday road bumps. The Mazda3 Sport, ($20,700, MSRP as tested), is powered by a 167-hp, 2.5-liter four-cylinder engine that feels smooth and refined and delivers 25 mpg overall in mixed driving. The five-speed automatic transmission shifts quickly and smoothly. Braking is Very Good. Cargo space is good behind the rear seats, and when the seatbacks are lowered the hatch encloses a good-sized cargo area.

The Pontiac Vibe is versatile, fuel-efficient, and reasonably priced. The Vibe's ride is compliant but not very steady and bumps create side-to-side rocking and even the highway ride can feel choppy. The Pontiac Vibe 1.8L, ($19,085, MSRP as tested), is powered by a 132-hp, 1.8-liter 4-cylinder engine that provides good performance and 24 mpg overall. The four-speed automatic transmission shifts smoothly. Braking is Very Good. The rear is quite spacious. The cargo area is lined with hard plastic and small items slide around on it.

The Chevrolet HHR plays to 1950s design nostalgia but one drawback to its retro styling is the small and short windows, which inhibit the view out. Bumps are absorbed quite well, but the deep ruts and ridges come through as rubbery kicks. The Chevrolet HHR LT, ($24,730 MSRP), as tested is powered by a 172-hp, 2.4-liter four-cylinder engine that provides good performance and 24 mpg overall. The four-speed automatic transmission shifts smoothly. Braking is Very Good. The seatbacks fold down for generous cargo space.

This review just shows how disconnected from reality CR is. This review really says more about the reviewers than about the car being reviewed.

I let my subscription to CR lapse in 2006 after I got my Insight-I. I didn't buy an Insight-I in 2003 because CR panned it in their review. After I got my Insight-I, I realized how far off base the CR review was, so I figured there was no point in reading CR reviews any more.

Hi John:

___Indeed!

___I found that Honda's Chris Naughton out of NY is defending the 2010 Insight-II against CRs write-up.

"Initial feedback from most customers and automotive media regarding the all-new Honda Insight has been very positive," said Chris Naughton. "In fact, the Insight has won several hybrid comparison tests completed independently by automotive media outlets."

___Maybe a bit too expensive but far better in many areas than the competition which CRs is touting as "Recommended".

___Good Luck

___Wayne

CR has gotten a lot of cars just wrong over the past 10 years, ever since they practically married the Civic.

And, if the review is so negative about the Insight, what does that say about the Fit, which shares many components with the Insight? It says the Fit isn't as good as they say it is (they deservedly gave the Fit kudos), or their testing is flawed.

I test drove an Insight II several weeks ago. It wasn't a long ride, I was hypermiling it, and I didn't notice any noise or handling problems. I thought it was more fun to drive than my Prius and handled better.

Harry

Yikes-rated almost as badly as a Dodge Caliber, and rated well below the Chevy?
I've always liked that HHR- it has road trip potential.

Hard to believe it is soooo bad. Normally CR loves Hondas. The original Insight was one of the very few Hondas that CR didn't recommend.

Charlie

One evening, I was headed home and knowing the local Honda dealer's lot was empty, decided to drop by Joe Davis baseball stadium to learn that just about every car dealer had relocated there for a "tent sale." So I thought, go take a look at the Honda Insight.

The first surprise ... no customers ... it was cars, sales critters, tents and some inoperable smokers ... but no customers. The only other vehicle I saw was a Hummer coming the other way along a two lane road with some cars parked. I pulled in to let the Hummer pass and continued looking for the Honda dealer.

Eventually, I found the Honda inventory and asked a young lady, "Is there a sales critter?" and with the enthusiasm of someone relieved at finally being asked to help, she pointed to a good ol' boy with a cowboy hat about 50 yards down the row. So I pulled up to him and asked,

"Do you have any Honda Insights?" and he said they had six at the end of the row.

I parked my Prius and went over to look at them and boy, those are some small cars. I drive an NHW11 but these are really small cars. These Honda Insights are much shorter than my wife's Echo. I would have to go to a Scion xA to find something that tiny.

Now I looked over the Insights while the salesman when to get the key and sure enough the invoice price was $21,360 ... then with dealer freight and stuff added brought it up to $22,780 and I was aghast. It truly is a small, 4-seater car. At least the rear seats fold down but they don't really 'lay flat.' I could see no way the passenger seat could fold down and provide firewall-to-hatch length. I'm sorry but this is really a small car.

Now my wife is not a small person and her back and knees limit her mobility. Still, I tried to sit in the car and bumped my head on the door frame. I didn't see 'stars' like I did three years ago trying to sit in a Honda Civic but I'm about 6" too tall to fit in this car. As a Halloween joke, I once laid down in a coffin and the Honda Insight felt the same. Worse, all of the instruments had to be viewed through the steering wheel!

Please understand that there are smaller sized (less fat) people for whom the Honda Insight would be a great car. But neither I nor my wife fit.

Now I don't believe in 'jerking a salesman around,' so as politely and quietly as possible, I got 'outta Dodge.' Seldom have I ever felt more sympathy for the dealers who with their staffs tried to bring in customers by setting up around the baseball stadium. I was there not because I have any sympathy for their products but because I really felt sad when so many people have such a horrible job. Never have I felt such sympathy.

Please understand that I bear no ill-will for the sales critters and even the dealer staff but I really felt sorry for them. But seriously, if someone thinks the Honda Insight is Prius competition ... they don't weight over 220 lbs and 6 ft. tall.

I'm short 5'5", but oldish, and I have lots of problems squeezing myself in and out of Civics. The front and back seats just require too much squat for older people to get in and out of. The seats sit too low, and the rooflines are too low-even for a short adult.
Civics are for fit younger folks, or fit, flexible older non gimps with good knees.

Charlie

..
Civics are for fit younger folks, or fit, flexible older non gimps with good knees.

Charlie

But I think that those who aren't fit might fit a Fit?:)

Interesting complaint as I'm 6'5" and over 240lbs and fit just fine in the driver's seat of the new Insight.

Interesting complaint as I'm 6'5" and over 240lbs and fit just fine in the driver's seat of the new Insight.

6' 2"+ here and I got in and out of them ok.

It isn't so much a question of height, as it is being able to push up with the knee fairly flexed.If you are older, or have diminished thigh strength, it is hard to push yourself upright with a heavily flexed knee.

Any folks out there older than 55 that find it easy to get in and out of a Civic??

The Fit with its nice upright seating is much easier to get in/out than any Civic. The Prius is easier to get in and out than any Civic.

Honda has always gone for low rooflines(for good mpg, less drag) which means low seatsbwhich are hard for older folks to get in and out of.Toyota always gave up a tiny bit of mpg vs Honda -Corollas,Camrys vs Civic Accord-- to make them more comfortable for gimps and oldsters and generally largish/heavy USA drivers.

Charlie

It isn't so much a question of height, as it is being able to push up with the knee fairly flexed.If you are older, or have diminished thigh strength, it is hard to push yourself upright with a heavily flexed knee.

It also depends on how long it's been since you've gotten into and out of vehicles that low.

After getting into and out of trucks for years, getting into and out of short vehicles causes me problems.

If I had one, I would get used to it again (and did not all that long ago when I had a Crossfire), but initially it's rather awkward.

Maybe most of the CR Auto Evaluation Staff are in their late 50's.

I haven't trusted CU/CR's test reports since they routinely top-rated every Chrysler Corp. product. That lasted for decades - about the 1960s to the 1980s. Then it was every Toyota model getting top ratings.

It didn't help that objective tests existed for, for instance, camera lenses. Modern Photography would rate the Olympus 50 mm. f/1.8 lens at 55 lines/mm resolution at f/8, center of field, and CU/CR would say the lens was "good," or "excellent," with no explanation as to why, or how it made that determination.

CR did give glowing reviews to the fit. I immediately went out and test drove one and didn't buy it. Don't get me wrong it's okay and being a Honda it will probably last 20+ yrs but it's still a BOTL commuter car for 17k. For me there are just too many similar commuter cars out there used for 7k that will last for many years too. These days it's much more important to me to have an extra 10k in the bank.

CR not bowing and praying to a Honda????
Say it aint so joe...say it aint so!!!:);)

I'm short 5'5", but oldish, and I have lots of problems squeezing myself in and out of Civics. The front and back seats just require too much squat for older people to get in and out of. The seats sit too low, and the rooflines are too low-even for a short adult.
Civics are for fit younger folks, or fit, flexible older non gimps with good knees.

Charlie

Interesting.

My 2003 Civic has had nothing but good comments from my friends and family, all 5'7"-6'-0" and most 180~260lb. Including my mom and her bum knee and my octogenarian grandpa who has trouble sitting in a recliner.

The only bumped head has been my 5'11" frame when I have the seat straight up and I brush the moonroof.

The only compact I've ever fit 4 adults in comfortably.

Interesting.


The only compact I've ever fit 4 adults in comfortably.

Try a first gen xB;)