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Toyota is offering $750 cash back on the 2009 Prius (http://www.courierpress.com/news/2009/jan/23/do-the-math/)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/2009_Toyota_Prius_Touring1.jpgJoshua Duval – Automobile Magazine – Jan. 21, 2009

How does this affect the "hybrid premium" arguments? --Ed.

If you're in the market to buy a new or used Toyota Prius, now is the time to do it. Quick to follow up its debut of the redesigned 2010 model, Toyota has announced rebates on its 2009 models and introduced a new certified used hybrid program.

Undoubtedly working to win over consumers who might have been considering waiting for 2010 Honda Insights or 2010 Ford Fusion hybrids, Toyota is now offering $750 cash back on all 2009 Prius models. Toyota is switching gears from its tactics in the last three months: 0 percent financing, low interest rates and lease programs failed to jump start the auto giant's sales in the North American market. Sales plunged 36.7 percent in December, below the market average, despite the incentives.

"We're going to keep our dealers competitive in the marketplace," Jim Lentz, Toyota's president of sales in the U.S, said last week at the 2009 North American International Auto Show. "Down payment and negative equity is more important for customers, so they want more cash rebates." The incentives will run through February 2nd.

http://rumors.automobilemag.com/6407621/news/toyota-offers-incentives-on-2009-prius/index.html

$750 will buy an awful lot of (fuel) miles in a Prius!

Well, it takes the 'premium' down to $5-$6k, which will buy 6 or 7 times an awful lot of fuel.

Can you buy them for invoice then?

Only up to $500 cash back in my area. **On select models** I guess only money back depending on what package upgrades you take with the car?


Doesn't seem like much when the Corolla has a $1500 cash back offer and the Matrix takes $1250. Even the Yaris caries a $500 cash bonus.

Seems like all Toyota did was knock the price down on everything but a little more so on the compact gas cars. The hybrid premium hasn't been lowered any.

Well, it takes the 'premium' down to $5-$6k, which will buy 6 or 7 times an awful lot of fuel.

$6k? Compared to what?

$6k? Compared to what?

A $25,000 Prius compared to a $19,000 Fit both w/navigation?

I don't know anyone who compares bare bones cars since that doesn't seem to be what the average buyer is after. After adding in options and packages the price tag tends to jump a lot.

Search of local dealers:
Civic EX-L w/Nav - $20,889
Prius w/Nav & Leather - $27,574

I did a quick compare: $5 gas: 40 mpg average in the Civic and 60 mpg average in the Prius. Assumed 12,000 miles per year. It would take 15 years to makeup the near $7500 price difference.


Not saying a hybrid is any less of a great buy but for someone shopping on just price points along with select options in mind there still exists a hefty premium.

But the Prius is not comparable to a Civic... Not in size, not in cargo capacity, etc. The batteries and hybrid tech have a cost/benefit to them, but unfair to compare to a compact sedan. May as well compare to a Seville: different size, luxury features, etc, but my that Prius is a bargain. It is what it is. If a Yaris meets your needs, avoid the Prius premium unless you drive high miles or just want it.

Hi All:

___Now go compare the resale of the Prius at 5-years and 75,000 miles vs. the whatever... Also comparing the Prius vs. the Fit is comparing a sub-compact vs. a mid-sized. Not in the same league.

___HCH-II’s are running at a touch over invoice and I suspect there is some Honda to dealer incentives to lower that number even further. I do not know about the Prius-II but the 2010 Prius-III will run into the same issues as the -II is now depending on how long the economy is FUBAR. Not on initial release of course but there have been two periods in time when Prius-II’s were selling for near invoice and now is another one.

___Now if the Fit came with the HCH-II’s ICE and gearing (at least the Europeans and Asian’s receive the ICE), the Fit with a tall 6-speed MT would be the bomb ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

___Now if the Fit came with the HCH-II’s ICE and gearing (at least the Europeans and Asian’s receive the ICE), the Fit with a tall 6-speed MT would be the bomb ;)

That's one gaping hole in the US market that I don't understand...

GreenVTEC did use the Civic EX-L for his cost comparison - certainly more fit for the comparison.

The Prius was alone in the market but that is rapidly changing and old models will not retain the 'pioneer' premium resale, so it's highly unlikely that today's clearance Prius-IIs will be as market attractive against the car offerings in 5 years.

On a cost basis, it makes sense to take the $5-$6k home today and make a good bet that we have more economical cars in the future.

- Charlie

A $25,000 Prius compared to a $19,000 Fit both w/navigation?

I don't know anyone who compares bare bones cars since that doesn't seem to be what the average buyer is after. After adding in options and packages the price tag tends to jump a lot.

Search of local dealers:
Civic EX-L w/Nav - $20,889
Prius w/Nav & Leather - $27,574

I did a quick compare: $5 gas: 40 mpg average in the Civic and 60 mpg average in the Prius. Assumed 12,000 miles per year. It would take 15 years to makeup the near $7500 price difference.


Not saying a hybrid is any less of a great buy but for someone shopping on just price points along with select options in mind there still exists a hefty premium.

An HCHII Leather & Navi is $27,420 and a fair comparison, the EX-L is not.

Hi All:

___Now go compare the resale of the Prius at 5-years and 75,000 miles vs. the whatever... Also comparing the Prius vs. the Fit is comparing a sub-compact vs. a mid-sized. Not in the same league.



Right. Also when you remember the concept that resale value exists at all the previous cost comparison favoring the Civic is flawed and oversimplified. I was just recently comparing monthly parking space rentals for my wife and noticed I would have gotten a discount if I had a hybird. My Credit Union is offering .5% apr reduction on loans for hybrids. There's lots of things that factor into cost but people love to oversimplify and make posts that only factor in initial price, fuel economy and a guess at fuel costs. The biggest thing people leave out is that in a few years their vehicle hasn't depreciated 100%.

An HCHII Leather & Navi is $27,420 and a fair comparison, the EX-L is not.

Well then with a similar price difference between the EX-L and the Hybrid-L the result is the same. As it was said earlier, from just a cost based view buying a fuel efficient gas car might make more sense for many people.

And to be fair and honest many gas cars have great resale values: Toyota/Honda cars in the lead.

In the $7500 over 15 year difference example: The hybrid would have to drop by only a couple thousand over ten years of ownership to make it a clearly better deal. I simply don't believe that in 2018 a ten year old Prius will depreciate only 25% or less....

I was pointing out that the comparison of a Prius to any conventionally powered vehicle isn't a fair comparison, Toyota has done that on purpose. There is nothing non-hybrid that is comparable.

The Civics are a better case, but the HCHII is still more lux than the EX-L, automatic climate control, lighter materials, better CD. More displays, and a hybrid AC compressor, and turn signal mirrors. OK yes they are very close, but I prefer to compare the Hybrid with the Si, both are performance cars, (one speed and handling and the other FE and well... handling) Though you can't get an SI with leather or climate control.

I get the feeling manufacturers don't want their hybrids compared to regular cars, there isn't a car out there where the only difference between trims is +hybrid or delete high voltage system.

Both the Civic and the Prius have good resale values. One can argue about which vehicle will hold what % resale value but that isn't the point. When you buy either car and drive it home it doesn't depreciate 100% day 1. When you leave resale value and other factors completely out of a cost comparison it isn't a realistic comparison. To further confuse the subject, hybrids get a lot of breaks here and there but they differ by state and even municipality. In the Civic EX-L vs. Prius comparison I'd get on the Prius a $1500 OR tax credit, $15 per month off parking (by law), HOV lane use on I-5 (time is money too) and soon will pay less for registration every time that is up.