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Jack Kelly Post-Gazette (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08202/897959-373.stm)

So another self center little bugger who doesn't care beyond their own lifetime, and would rather we take unnessary chances other than exercise a little personal self control. They forget to mention that the latest models do show the current temperary lowering of temps due to a regular flux, but then will continue back up quickly. They also seem to forget about knee jerk reactions...once we are a week or month the "good news" of more US oil prodction, the prices will climb back up unless we do actually see more production at a very significant level. The one good thing about this is that we American's can finally start polluting our own lands and waters instead of having other do it to their lands in our name.

And beside everybody knows why gas prices are high....hypermilers. I think AAA said something about this...due to all the delays caused by hypermilers, we are burning more gas than ever. On top of that, the hypermiling craze was misinterpeted by oil producers as a mandate for everyone to use 10/20/ even 50+ percent less gas, so they cut production accordingly. Since very people have joined in (yet), they continue to produce too little oil for actual demand. ;)

It is true and I honestly believe that there is a "Global Warming" Hoax. The only reason global warming theory was started when R12 Refrigerant turned out to be eating a hole in our atmosphere. The US banned CFCs, but what about the rest of the world? Last year Baghdad saw its first snow...That's not global warming to me. I live in Texas where it was 112 F in the summer not too long ago. Now, I havent really seen Tripple digits consistently, and the summer is almost over...

I was listening to a talk radio station when a trucker called in from up near the northern part of Yellowstone. He woke up to several inches of snow on his truck. He make a comment of seeing a couple guys off loading snowmobiles. You see parts of Yellowstone still had over 6 ft on snow on the ground. This was July 1st at the higher elevations over 5000 ft.

I noticed on my electric bill that I have used 2/3 of the electricity that I used up to this point over last year. The last three months the AC has not run as much since the temperatures are lower than last year. People don't realize that global temperatures peaked in 1999 and have been slowly dropping. In 2007 we dropped .6 degrees. This is the same .6 degrees that we climbed in all of the 20th century. That same .6 degrees that confirms we are all going to die when the planet over heats according to Al Gore.

As they say guys follow the money. The same so called experts that are calling for major changes in our lifestyle to prevent global warming are same ones getting their funding from the same people who are screaming the sky is falling. If you could become a billionaire by selling carbon credits, wouldn't you lie your butt off to convince everyone to buy your carbon credits. To offset your carbon usage you need to buy Al Gore's genuine snake oil carbon credits.

The same guy who uses 20 times the average families energy usage. The same guy that flies around in a chartered Gulf-stream 2. One of the dirties and least fuel efficient private jets flying. And last week they busted him arriving at a speech with two stretched limos and a Suburban. Oh they also busted the one Limo driver for idling the engine for close to 30 minutes so Tipper and his daughter could come back to a nice A/C cooled car.

I'd be panicking too if I knew the 24th minimum has started and the S hasn't hit the fan yet. If we don't see a change in our sun in short order Al Gore global warming jokes will as common as Bill Clinton, Monica Lewinsky jokes were in the late 1990's.

All I can say if things are as bad as these so called experts are telling us, then why all the smoke and mirrors and all the hypocrisy by those who know so much more than us.

Last year Baghdad saw its first snow...That's not global warming to me.

I don't claim to completely understand global warming, but I don't think this is a good case against it, as unusual/freaky weather is part and parcel of the package. Snow in Baghdad would seem to fit.

I don't understand how anyone can look at the incredible shrinking polar ice caps and still resist the idea that something is alarmingly amiss.

For myself, as a lifelong Coloradoan, one thing I have noticed increasingly over the past fifteen or twenty years is how rarely I need to don a heavy coat in the winter. As a kid, that was unthinkable! It was too #@$@$@ cold out there! Now I see countless people shorts and tanks in December, January, February, and I don't think it's just because people are gettin' "tougher."

AnnA

It is true and I honestly believe that there is a "Global Warming" Hoax. The only reason global warming theory was started when R12 Refrigerant turned out to be eating a hole in our atmosphere. The US banned CFCs, but what about the rest of the world?

Um, CFCs were only investigated heavily since the 1970s and were started to be phased out in the mid-to-late 1990s (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorofluorocarbon). Several countries are on board with a wide-scale CFC phaseout. Greenhouse gasses and their effects have been studied since the late 1800s (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorofluorocarbon and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svante_Arrhenius). It appears that your premises are incorrect.

Last year Baghdad saw its first snow...That's not global warming to me. I live in Texas where it was 112 F in the summer not too long ago. Now, I havent really seen Tripple digits consistently, and the summer is almost over...

Would you care to show some broad-scale data, analysis or studies to support your observations? Moreover, global warming/global climate change refers to a wide-scale, long-term, and well, global changes in climate. It does not refer to the short-term nor is it restricted to one region as you would define it. Year-to-year or seasonal variances are still allowed in GW/GCC theory, because climate is subject to several factors, greenhouse gases being only one of them. Besides, ecology is one of those things where small, subtle changes can have drastic effects (like bioaccumulation).

Personally, I don't care if Global Warming is real or hype. Doesn't matter. All I care about is that it's one of hundreds of reasons to use less energy, less oil in particular, and develop sustainable resources. It takes troops out of harm's way, keeps our money away from unfriendly powers, insulates us from supply uncertainty, creates US jobs, cleans up the air and water, and may well keep us out of WWIII among many other things.

We shouldn't be wasting our time arguing over the few reasons to disagree when there are so many reasons to work together and get moving.

Oh please, not the old extreme or moderate weather argument. You need world averages to look at true climate changes. Since arriving in Chicago I have already seen both very moderate and very extreme summers and winters, but when you look at the yearly average since 1999, you get the following averages 50,54,50,52,52,53,52,51)...so despite having both extreme and moderate windows/summers, we have only seen 4 degrees of difference in the yearly average.

Almost all climate models (both for and against warming) show how areas go through periods of both extremes and moderations. Just because someone experienced some freaky weather doesn't mean anything one way or the other. The problem is that while our short and medium term models are getting better (and can be quickly proved as such), the only way to prove a long term model is to wait for that time to pass. Without personally dedicating my life to studying this, I'm going with the scientic concenus, but I'll happily listen to new ideas, just so long as there is good data to back it up.

Would you care to show some broad-scale data, analysis or studies to support your observations?

Such items are unnecessary if ones intent is solely to "muddy the waters".

"Doubt is our product, since it is the best means of competing with the 'body
of fact' that exists in the mind of the general public. It is also the means of establishing a controversy."

I don't much care if global warming is fact or fiction. The only reason I hypermile is to have a little extra money in my pocket. I don't care about the "Save the environment" mumbojumbo. The Planet was alot hotter than it is now when the dinosaurs roamed the earth. We are expieriencing global warming, or as I'd like to call it: Summer.

Since we are on the topic of "Jack Kelly".....

http://www.postgazette.com/pg/08181/893193-373.stm

"'Green' energy is a pipe dream. So is the notion that we can conserve our way out of dependence on foreign oil."

Jack Kelly says you hypermilers are wasting your time.

It is true and I honestly believe that there is a "Global Warming" Hoax. The only reason global warming theory was started when R12 Refrigerant turned out to be eating a hole in our atmosphere. The US banned CFCs, but what about the rest of the world? Last year Baghdad saw its first snow...That's not global warming to me. I live in Texas where it was 112 F in the summer not too long ago. Now, I havent really seen Tripple digits consistently, and the summer is almost over...

The ban on CFC's due to ozone layer degradation and greenhouse gas emissions (climate change) are two totally separate issues. Take an airplane ride and look out the window and try to argue that we haven't impacted this planet.

And short term weather patterns aren't evidence of long-term climate change. I remember watching a football game on tv at Lambeau Field in Green Bay, WI. It was -X degrees F and the reporters were making some idiotic comment about global warming. However it was in the 30's F at the north pole on that same day. Climate change is a complicated issue that gets even more complicated by politics (i.e. right wingers backed by big oil/coal companies to challenge scientific facts.)

http://co2science.org/ is a good website for information based upon peer-reviewed scientific studies. I suggest some people here look into it further.

I agree that we need to be more self sustaining, but a small group of hypermilers won't achieve that. Gas prices more, or less need to go up so it will hit people where it hurts, in their pockets. Nobody likes high prices, that's why it will work.

Since we are on the topic of "Jack Kelly".....

http://www.postgazette.com/pg/08181/893193-373.stm

"'Green' energy is a pipe dream. So is the notion that we can conserve our way out of dependence on foreign oil."

Jack Kelly says you hypermilers are wasting your time.

If we can't drill, can't use coal, can't build Nuclear plants, then you tell me how we are going to cut 70% of our energy use in this country by conservation? So Jack is right on that one. Sorry we don't have enough land available for the solar panels and wind turbines to produce the power we need.

Ted Kennedy fought the wind turbines by his house because it would spoil the view.

I have to disagree with Jack on the second statement. Someone needs to give Jack a Hypermiling lesson.

http://co2science.org/ is a good website for information based upon peer-reviewed scientific studies. I suggest some people here look into it further.

How about we look to where the scientific debate is showing both sides:
http://www.aps.org/units/fps/newsletters/200807/editor.cfm

"With this issue of Physics & Society, we kick off a debate concerning one of the main conclusions of the International Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), the UN body which, together with Al Gore, recently won the Nobel Prize for its work concerning climate change research. There is a considerable presence within the scientific community of people who do not agree with the IPCC conclusion that anthropogenic CO2 emissions are very probably likely to be primarily responsible for the global warming that has occurred since the Industrial Revolution"

Here is the issue in PDF: http://www.aps.org/units/fps/newsletters/200807/upload/july08.pdf

Seems as many things it is not as clear cut and the consensus not as complete as we have been led to believe.

If we can't drill, can't use coal, can't build Nuclear plants, then you tell me how we are going to cut 70% of our energy use in this country by conservation? So Jack is right on that one. Sorry we don't have enough land available for the solar panels and wind turbines to produce the power we need.

Ted Kennedy fought the wind turbines by his house because it would spoil the view.

I have to disagree with Jack on the second statement. Someone needs to give Jack a Hypermiling lesson.

There is little oil left to be found. All the easy oil is gone. It's no more. Nada. We've peaked. You are talking hundreds of thousands of barrels a day. That's it. The solutions are trying to figure out how to replace oil, and replacing oil with oil is no longer an option.

Coal will continue to be a necessity, and can hopefully be curbed over time with other options.

Liberals are wrong to oppose nuclear.

Big Bend National Park in my home state of Texas is all the land we need to provide enough solar electricity to run the country. It's a cost issue, not geography.

I just don't understand why people think "Ted Kennedy is an idiot" is an actual argument. It is a good argument if you are trying to argue that "Ted Kennedy is an idiot." Was that your intent?

Conservation is the most important tool, obviously.

We are going to drill anywhere and everywhere. The important thing is that we realize that's not a solution, but rather a way to buy us 12 months of time for real solutions.

One thing remains true from this whole debate: pollution exists, and it matters little whether it creates global warming or not (personally, i don't believe it does). however, it does create smog, acid rain, and may accelerate the development of some cancers.

so the democrats have it right in that we have to stop being dependent on technologies that are killing us. the only one they have wrong is nuclear power which is both safe and clean.