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xcel
07-02-2007, 01:56 AM
CleanMPG drives the 2007 Honda Civic Turbo-Diesel.

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/2/European_Union_Flag.jpg Anticipation is making us wait … (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/reviews/t-cleanmpg-previews-the-2007-honda-civic-icdti-s-22l-turbo-diesel-5269.html)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/523/Honda_Civic_iCDTi_Turbo_Diesel_Side.jpgWayne Gerdes - CleanMPG (www.CleanMPG.com) - July 2, 2007

Does anyone remember a particular toy or gadget from years past that they simply had to own as soon as possible? I remember more then a few yet as an adult, what could possibly create the same yearning? I cannot say if the following falls into the same category but if it does, it may also satisfy the need.

It has been a long 3-year wait for the chance to drive one of the premiere Turbo-Diesel’s of our time available only to those currently residing on the European continent. That being Honda’s 2.2L iCDTi in a European sourced 2007 Honda Civic 5-door hatch. Although only a pre-view, this sneak peek should demonstrate the turbo-diesels capabilities long before they actually arrive to our shores.

Past Honda 2.2L iCDTi achievements: Honda Diesel Sets New World Records. (http://world.honda.com/news/2004/4040506.html) - US based mpg of 78 mpg.

From the Civic 5-door’s sleek external silhouette to the interiors magic rear seats similar to those found in the 2007 Honda Fit, this automobile is not only a good looking and utilitarian people hauler but is also a relatively high performance fuel miser courtesy of its famous 2.2L Honda turbo-diesel. Let us take a closer look.

2007 Honda Civic 5-door hatch - 2.2L iCDTi - S basic specifications:

Engine|
Type|Diesel
Valve Train|DOHC
Transmission|6-speed manual
Max Power|138.1 HP@4,000 RPM
Max Torque|251 ft.-lb’s@2,000 RPM
|
Emissions|
Smog|Euro IV
GHG - CO2 (g/km)|135
|
Fuel Economy - Euro based|
Urban (mpg US)|35.6 mpg
Extra Urban (mpg US)|54.7 mpg
|
Basic Performance|
0 – 60 mph|8.5 seconds
Top Speed|127 mph
|
Weights and Capacities
Curb Weight|2,960 pounds
Fuel Tank (US gallons)|13.2 gallons
|
Wheels and Tires|
205/55 R16 Z-Rated|16” Steel Wheels

2007 Honda Civic 5-door hatch - 2.2L iCDTi - Impressions:

Since the instrumentation was somewhat European centric, it took some time to find what tools were available and how to enable/disable them to our liking. In other words, it took a few blocks to find and then reset the Trip aFCD’s. Rear seat headroom and legroom were compromised with the 5-door hatch design but the magic seats and various storage areas underneath the rear floor more then made up for it. The lack of CC (Cruise Control) is something that will be remedied before we would see a similar equipped Civic released here in the states. Air vents and dash/appointment plastic had a less expensive texture and feel then the US sourced 8th gen Civic’s many own today. During a NICE-On, the iFCD pegs to max fuel consumption which was a bit unnerving at first but I am not sure it registered on the aFCD as the same? There is a std. fobbed key to boot the European Civic up but to actually turn her over; you have to press a Start button ala Prius. This is yet another sequence to get used to? Also, you have to hold the START button down for a period of time similar to holding a standard key in the Ignition III position in order to ignite the ICE. If you let go too quickly, she will not pick up the RPM’s necessary to light off.

As far as driving a diesel is concerned, the latest Common Rails do not smoke upon acceleration nor clatter while sitting at a light under idle conditions which made our short drive in the Honda Civic iCDTi all that much more enjoyable.

And the real kicker. At a relatively steady state 90 - 95 km/hour (55 - 59 mph) while DWL over very small undulations, I was viewing a steady 2 L/100 Km (117.6 mpg US) as displayed on the dash located iFCD. Whether or not the displayed 2 was 2.2, 2.5 or 2.9 L/100 Km actual or not, who knows just yet? I have not seen an iFCD camped at that level while at a somewhat steady state speed since driving the Insight and even then you did not see it at that high a speed or for any type of extended period! That somewhat steady state result has me pondering what this performance oriented Turbo-diesel actually has in store for us with regards to her actual FE capabilities?

2007 Honda Civic 5-door hatch - 2.2L iCDTi - Ride:

Typical Honda/Acura sporty ride with larger road imperfections being absorbed with a solid but not harsh impact as well as great road feel over any number of varying paved surfaces.

2007 Honda Civic 5-door hatch - 2.2L iCDTi - Handling:

With 3 in the vehicle and not being at all familiar with downtown Detroit, we were coming up on a right hander which I thought was yet a block away. We were moving at an approximate 20 mph clip when I was instructed by both Rich (Pravus Prime) and another Auto Journalist in the back seat to “Turn Right - Now!” I swung the wheel hard to the right and with the low profile, 16” Z-Rated tires, she clung to that piece of pavement far better then any domestic Civic or Accord that I have ever driven could have. There is something to be said for performance rubber. On a side note with regard to these tires, there are some negatives. While in downtown Detroit maybe 3 blocks from the parking garage where we had to turn her in, I shut down the ICE to wait out a light. When it turned green, there was enough of a slope that she should have picked up speed to the next light ahead ICE-Off without issue in the 70 + degree temps we were experiencing. In this Civic’s case, she simply sat there waiting for an ICE-Start and tranny engagement in order to get her to move. I honestly believe the FE capabilities of this iCDTi were hampered to the tune of at least 3 - 5% while shod with the Z-Rated 16’s given the poor down slope glide experience.

2007 Honda Civic 5-door hatch - 2.2L iCDTi - Short term results:

Although the ride and drive consisted of just 28 miles round trip from downtown Detroit to a local suburb and back, it was long enough to show that this little beauty has more potential then most would have previously suspected. From downtown Detroit to a gas station to do a quick press up of the tires in relatively light early afternoon traffic, she allowed 3.1 L/Km or 75.87 mpg US. After attempting to press up the Z-Rated tires, resetting the Trip B aFCD and in far heavier and congested traffic heading back into downtown Detroit, she offered even better FE performance.

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/523/3_0_L_per_100_Km_-_22_6_km.jpg
3.0L/100 Km over 22.6 Km or 78.4 mpg over 14.0 miles

The above was achieved in an automobile with just 529 miles on the odometer, on a road course of our choosing but out of and back into a heavily congested downtown Detroit on a weekday afternoon, 3 people possibly weighing in at over 550 #’s in total, not even close to being set up properly and using less then half the techniques available to us. On the plus side, the highway portion of this drive was almost optimal w/ temps in the mid 70’s and just enough traffic to hold speeds down. CleanMPG is currently trying to acquire this iCDTi for a full review so as to discover a little more about how she ticks as well as what she is capable of in the real world. With the right driver and commute, this little diesel powered beast may just be the new Sheriff in town? Stay tuned …

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/523/Honda_Civic_iCDTi_Turbo_Diesel_Front.jpg
2007 Honda Civic 5-door hatch - 2.2L iCDTi

I would like to thank Honeywell for their turbo-diesel presentation as well as supplying the European based turbo-diesels for the ride and drive. I would also like to thank the APA for hosting the Turbo-Diesel event. Without either, this pre-view would not have been possible.

Wayne

To view the final installment, you can read the following: CleanMPG reviews the 2007 Honda Civic 2.2L iCDTi Turbo Diesel. (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/reviews/t-cleanmpg-reviews-the-2007-honda-civic-22l-icdti-turbo-diesel-6526.html)

tbaleno
07-02-2007, 04:11 AM
VERY nice write-up Wayne.

HCHCIN
07-02-2007, 09:01 AM
Wayne--

Were any details given about possible arrival Stateside? I know the wife would be very interested. Also, did you have a chance to take any interior photos? --RN

diamondlarry
07-02-2007, 09:10 AM
Nice writeup and very nice driving Wayne! Is a FAS doable in a diesel?

brick
07-02-2007, 10:07 AM
Man, that sounds like a nice little car! That little Civic may do for the highways what the Prius has done for back roads and cities.

c0da
07-02-2007, 10:36 AM
I would totally pick that one up if it came stateside. I've always been a fan of the European models of many brands, even the Big 3 has nice models that they never bring here. Have you guys seen the Euro Focus? It's diesel, looks good, and I hear it runs very well.

I don't understand why we get the ugly versions.

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/05/31/rendered-speculation-euro-focus-hatches-coupe/

Right Lane Cruiser
07-02-2007, 01:59 PM
Wow! I'd seriously consider one these if the price was reasonable. :D

I second Larry's question; does it FAS ok or is that a no-no in a diesel?

xcel
07-02-2007, 02:32 PM
Hi Tom:

___Thank you! It was a long weekend to get out there and do the preview drive but well worth it. I hope Rich will do a Pre-view on the 3.0L Jeep Grand Cherokee CRD we drove (he was the individual driving that monster powerful Turbo-Diesel ;)) as well?

___From the E-Mails I received this morning, it sounds like Rich and I may have worn out our welcome a touch given the amount of time we had the (2) vehicles for. We were the last out of the presentation room in order for the journalists that had deadlines to take their cut first yet the Honda was still sitting there while everybody was out in the more performance oriented diesels available to us? I will post more comments on that situation after doing the Honeywell/APA Turbo-Diesel ride and drive presentation article hopefully later on this week.

___HCHCIN, I have read that Honda wants to bring the 2.2 iCDTi to us in late 08, early 09 but I am not sure if the new CAT tech and DPF’s will be able to hold Tier II/Bin 5 for the required time frame or not yet? There will be a lot more info wrt diesels and their ability to meet the US’ latest stringent emissions requirements if we can source the iCDTi for a full review later this month or summer. WRT the interior photos, Rich took some pics from the back seat looking forward and out of the wind screen but none of the actual interior. I can pass along the link to Honda’s UK site which has the Civic 5-doors interior photos available if you would like?

___Larry and Sean, during Honeywell’s Q&A period after their presentation, I asked a question wrt keying off before letting the turbo spool down while at idle. The presenter said he and his wife as well as 15 + million other turbo drivers in Europe shut them off when the come to a stop day in and day out. Honeywell has not seen any type of warranty issues with their turbo’s being cooked under that scenario. The reason I asked was I remember reading in an 04 Jetta TDI’s owners manual that the TDI’s should be left idling for 15 + seconds or some other such time after running boost up to protect that turbo. This Honda did not have a turbo-boost gauge although as light as I was driving it, I doubt she ever saw more then 3 #’s anyway. As long as she was not recently spooled up and you let her drop down to idle for a second or two, I would say it appears to be OK. Remember however that this CI-ICE idles at a consumption rate as little as .3 L/hr (1/4 that of a Si-ICE) so NICE-On’s may be the proper way to handle the turbo’s lubrication requirements while not getting killed on the glide? Secondly, it takes a lot of 12V current or glide power to spin up these higher compression turbo-diesels and performing that with the clutch or the key may not lead to a satisfactorily long life for the 12V, the starter, clutch or ICE? Honda’s iCDTi uses one of the lowest compression ratios I have ever read about in a Diesel so maybe this issue will not be a big deal as say a 20 + : 1 ratio CI-ICE in many of the others? I will cover some more on the techniques that could and possibly should not be used in a full review later as well.

___Tim, that is exactly what I was thinking while driving the iCDTi! She won’t take down a Prius in the inner city or the occasional stop and crawls but viewing an iFCD stuck in the low 100’s at 55 + mph? I really want to know how accurate the OEM instrumentation really is now ;)

___C0da, the neat item about this turbo-diesel is it is not only fuel efficient as can possibly be imagined, it propels this somewhat heavy Civic to 60 in under 9 seconds. Not that any of us would ever use that capability but most of the Euro Turbo-diesels that are also fuel efficient to the degree this 2.2L iCDTi is have 0 - 60 times in the 13 + second range :rolleyes: Can you imagine if Honda would have stuck a 1.5 iCDTi in this Civic instead? I can almost guarantee we would have seen 100 + mpg at 50 + mph while still receiving somewhat satisfactory performance in the 0 - 60 game if they had :D

___Good Luck

___Wayne

-mr. bill
07-02-2007, 02:37 PM
September 2006 - "Honda plans to introduce its next-generation diesel engine in the U.S. within three years." (http://corporate.honda.com/press/article.aspx?id=2006092536380)

While you probably will not see the Euro-hatch on this continent, you probably will see a variant of that engine. Something for the Civic? A replacement for the HAH?

(Did the Scangauge II work?)

-mr. bill

c0da
07-02-2007, 02:43 PM
I definately remember the diesel introduction for Hondas in the next few years, but all they ever show is the Accord as their flagship. I'm not looking for a sedan and I would love to see a civic diesel or maybe even a Fit diesel. My girlfriend already has her sights on a MiniCooper, but I convinced her to wait till the diesel version comes out.

Late 2008 to the end of 2009 will hopefully be an exciting time for diesels and hybrids.

xcel
07-02-2007, 02:53 PM
Hi Mr. Bill:

___I am glad you asked. I had my ScanGauge II in hand but did not locate an OBD-II port under the drivers or passenger side dash at first glance. The Grand Cherokee CRD did so I bet the iCDTi did as well. I just did not find it is all? When the diesels arrive state side, they will all have an OBD-II port and will be CAN-Bus equipped for the 08 model year forward. You are probably right on the hatch being a European only Civic variant. Nobody buys them here (I mean nobody except for Prius and other fuel efficient automobile purchasers/drivers ;)) for some reason?

___C0da, great point! It will indeed be an exciting time when the EPA compliant diesels arrive in force as well as the new PHEV/HEV both at the same time. Do you want a PHEV Volt or an iCDTi equipped Civic :D

___I highly doubt this iCDTi will ever make it into an American sourced Accord over here. They are just too big and heavy for that limited performance of an ICE in a 3,200 # + automobile let alone the performance hit to drive a torque capable and heavy Auto tranny on top of it all?

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Chuck
07-02-2007, 02:55 PM
There are not too many cars I'd go out of the way to test drive, but this one would be. :)

They would probably put the Acura badge on this if sold in the US?

c0da
07-02-2007, 03:14 PM
Wayne,

I have no idea what I want now. I was set on the next gen-prius because Honda discontinued the Insight. But then they announce a new hybrid taking its place and then diesels side swipe the hybrids with promises of higher mpg and conversion to biodiesels and WHOA!

I'm getting the car with the highest combined mpg mid 2009 with the best quality. I'm leaning toward the diesels of Honda or the Volt right now.

What about you Wayne?

Right Lane Cruiser
07-02-2007, 04:22 PM
Thanks for the info, Wayne! Sounds like the entire toolkit is available on these things. :D I'm looking forward to your full review whenever you get the chance to finish testing it. ;)

lightfoot
07-02-2007, 08:40 PM
Have you guys seen the Euro Focus? It's diesel, looks good, and I hear it runs very well.
I rented one in Italy last fall and liked it a LOT. Quite, nice smooth power, quality finish. Forgive me, but my reaction was, "This is FAR too nice to be a Ford. I bet someone else actually builds it and they rebadge it."

aca2983
07-02-2007, 09:59 PM
This is the car that would make me buy a Honda again.

I hope someday I have the opportunity to agonize over the choice of this vs.. a Mazda3 2.0 diesel.

ILAveo
07-02-2007, 10:52 PM
Hi Mr. Bill:


___I highly doubt this iCDTi will ever make it into an American sourced Accord over here. They are just too big and heavy for that limited performance of an ICE in a 3,200 # + automobile let alone the performance hit to drive a torque capable and heavy Auto tranny on top of it all?

___Good Luck

___Wayne

From the specs I've seen, this engine is livelier in the RPM range where most people drive most of the time than the V6 that is going in the Accord now:

current Accord engine: 3.0 V6 Max Torque: 211 ft-lbs @ 5000rpm

vs 2.2 iCDTi's spec of 251 ft.-lb’s @2,000 RPM .

Drivers would have to get used to doing their occasional hardest pulling at lower revs closer to where they usually drive instead of downshifting to reach the higher RPM's needed to squeeze the max torque out of a gas engine.

Diesels rev a little differently, but the modern V-8's I have driven are way nicer at low RPM's where I do most of my driving than comparably sized gas engines (our fleet at work is a mixture of gas and diesels). The only drawbacks I've noticed is winter performance in the fuel system and cabin heating.

I want one.

xcel
07-03-2007, 12:35 AM
Hi HCHCIN:

___Here is Honda’s UK site and navigate to the 5-door Civic. This is all flash so it’s a pain to wait for everything but you can see the interior if you can stand the wait and the small flash boxes to see the details :(

http://www.honda.co.uk/car/

___C0da, I have no idea what I am going to purchase? If Honda pulls the usual $2 - $5K above MSRP non-sense, it will not be an iCDTi. The problem Honda is probably having is they do not have an Auto tranny small enough to fit in a Civic that can take the 2.2’s output? If Toyota improves upon the Prius’ highway FE, it may just be one of those? With the Prius III’s new independent rear end, it will handle and ride much better and that alone makes me wonder if one of those will sit in the drive :) The new HSD-2 tech whatever it includes should be ready to take on all comers as the diesels begin to arrive in force. The Volt is on my target selection list but GM has quite a few hurdles to overcome before they get my $’s?

___Lightfoot, too bad Ford appears not to be thinking about one of its PSA/Ford diesels in the Fiesta or Focus for North America? At least it would deal them back into the Fuel Economy game?

___ILAveo, it is not all about a diesels torque specs. The Accords I4 at 166/160 can take the 300 # heavier Accord to 60 in ~ 9 seconds with an Auto and ~ 8 with a stick. This much lower torque spec’ed 2.4L SI-ICE in the Accord I4 is already .5 seconds quicker in a 10% heavier vehicle. Add an Auto that can take 250 Ft-Lbs to the current Civic with the iCDTi and it drops it to maybe 9.5 - 10. Add 300 more #’s and it drops it again to maybe 10.5 - 11.0 as a guess? It would still do great on the highway but I do not see Honda using the 2.2 in the larger Accord any time soon let alone redesigning the current Auto tranny’s to take on that diesels monster torque down low. Just another opinion but I think they will bring it over in the Acura TSX (Honda Accord overseas) or the Civic just as they are currently offering in Europe. It is the stick that will make this a tough sell over here given the lack of stick drivers? The upcoming 3.0 iCDTi will provide the Accord, TL, RL and RSX with a nice improvement in FE and possibly performance if they run it with twin turbo’s possibly? And yes, I want one of the 2.2 iCDTi’s too ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

ILAveo
07-03-2007, 06:01 PM
Hi HCHCIN:

...
___ILAveo, it is not all about a diesels torque specs. The Accords I4 at 166/160 can take the 300 # heavier Accord to 60 in ~ 9 seconds with an Auto and ~ 8 with a stick. This much lower torque spec’ed 2.4L SI-ICE in the Accord I4 is already .5 seconds quicker in a 10% heavier vehicle. Add an Auto that can take 250 Ft-Lbs to the current Civic with the iCDTi and it drops it to maybe 9.5 - 10. Add 300 more #’s and it drops it again to maybe 10.5 - 11.0 as a guess?.... And yes, I want one of the 2.2 iCDTi’s too ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne


I agree with you that is not all about torque specs, but time to 60 and 1/4 mile speeds are not very good representations of the power demands of the typical driver because they are measurements of tire smoking, red line performance which you rarely see anyplace other than the track. In my experience most "heavy" acceleration by normal drivers happens around 50 percent of redline in current cars and trucks (anything much more and your spouse is likely to yell at you for trying to break the car). I guess you wouldn't see the iCDTi used much by guys doing the Tokyo Drift (but that's Civic's market), but coupled to the right tranny it could pull around a boat or small camper very well while getting good FE. I would really like to see it in my next small/midsize truck.

Edit : For comparison purposes the 6 cyl 4.2l engine in the F150 gets a max torque of 260 ft/#'s (vs. the iCDTi's 251 ft/#'s ) and from personal experience that is strong enough to tow with. This engine would be a champ in a midsize pickup.

psyshack
07-03-2007, 10:50 PM
The only thing I like about this car is the engine. Sorry..... I have no use or love for a 5 door hatch. A 3 door hatch is fine.

This car is nothing new to 8th gen Civic owners. Many Si, DX, LX and Ex folks would have bought the car here in the states. And many bought the Mazda because of that car.

A 5 door hatch is the original cross over. A low slung SUV.

What we need in the USA is for Honda to get in the game. IMA is great! But lets face it. Its half arse compared to Yota. Sure IMA may whoop it on pure hwy. But thats because there ICE is better.

Honda has the marketing fools driving the company right now. R-18 is a lean burn in devils cloths. Then there is the oil burner. What gives? Then the 1.5l ans 1.3L

Wayne did the oilie have a exhaust manifold or did it have a single port like the R-18? What was its intake tract. Was it a two stage like the R-18? Could it have used a taller gear set? You should have got on the darn thing. LMAO

Honda is playing a game with our pocket books. And giving bones to there marketing folks. And making standard options and creature comforts the battle grounds for the platforms. And it all comes back tooo,,, Americans are stupid.

psy

xcel
07-04-2007, 01:49 AM
Hi Jeff:

___Let me first say that if there was ever a vehicle made to meet your requirements, this one is possibly it.

___I believe the Insight 5-speed would have offered you the FE you have always wished for but its somewhat delicate nature would have proven to be too much of a burden imho. The HCH-I’s and II’s acceleration and braking performance(s) would have left you asking why again and again? I see your frustrations with the 8th Gen Civic EX yet it keeps asking for more. If only that 1.8 was a lean-burn … And then we have the European iCDTi equipped Civic. With its 6-speed stick, discs all-around, a truly thrashable and always leanburn running CI-ICE capable of FE to die for in a semi-lightweight Civic with performance Z’s underneath, I know you would absolutely enjoy it for years to come. Whether the build quality and total capability would meet your needs, only you would know but reading about your wants and needs this past year and a half, I can honestly say this is a machine built just for you.

___The 5-door hatch is a bit small to say it would be the platform of choice for the NA market place but in a std. LX/EX sedan, this thing would turn out to be pretty slick by all appearances.

___And to try and answer your questions? The intake uses two tuned ports with a swirl-vane in one to control the low, medium and high output modes this thing can run in. The all-in-one exhaust manifold into the variable vane turbo is probably a necessity so as to light off the Oxidation CAT and the De-NOx CAT after that just a few inches beyond the turbo as fast as humanly possible.

___What Honda does once it arrives is anybodies guess? I would like to see a Civic EX equipped with the iCDTi vs. a yet released loaded up EX-L w/ all the bells and whistles or whatever comes out of Marysville in years to come but you know Honda. Max profits and MSRP + in the first few months only to tick off their multi-generation owners until the vehicles begin to stack up like cord-wood. That is when the real behind the scenes and under the table fire sales begin. I still see Honda having a problem with installing an Auto capable of the iCDTi’s torque in a Civic and the US’ distaste for sticks boxing them in somewhat wrt this excellent turbo-diesel. Either way, it will make for an excellent platform to stave off the Toyota juggernaut for a few short years until the PHEV’s truly arrive in quantity. At least for a few that do not mind driving sticks anyway?

___Good Luck

___Wayne

psyshack
07-04-2007, 12:16 PM
Thanks for the answers. So it does have a two stage intake manifold along the same design vein as the R-18's. It makes good since to have the single port exhaust like the R-18. Many R-18 folks want to turbo them. And the single port is like custom made for those folks. :) Fact remains they will have to deck out the top of the block to get the R-18 to hold any true boost. I wonder if the oilier
Has a decked out block or is it open topped like the R-18? Hummm

Im going to have to look into this engine some more. It maybe nothing more than a heavy duty R-18.

psy

tigerhonaker
07-05-2007, 09:10 AM
Wayne,

I bet You and Rich had a Great time driving those FE Vehicles.

You did a Bang up job on the Review of the Diesel Honda Civic. I wish Honda would have a 6-Speed Auto available like VW in their Diesels. The 6-Speed DSG Trans. that I drove in the VW Bug did a great job and was a pure delight in City Traffic.

I like the looks and the Performance of the Honda Diesel that is almost 3-Seconds quicker than my HCH II.

Thanks for the Excellent write-Up and Sharing of Info.

Terry (tigerhonaker)

psyshack
07-05-2007, 11:54 PM
This is a interesting mill.

http://world.honda.com/HDTV/news/2003-4030226_1a/

psy

xcel
07-06-2007, 12:10 AM
Hi Jeff:

___There is a lot more besides the iCDTi vid including the new CAT tech chemistry coming as well. I am saving the internal structure (ceramic glow plug to help the 16.x:1 Compression ratio light off), costs and Tier II/Bin5 tech for a full blown review.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

psyshack
07-06-2007, 12:22 AM
OOOO Ok I'll stop digging and not comment until your done. :)

c0da
07-06-2007, 09:20 AM
But but, I keep learning more everytime you dig. :D

I had a dream they actually made a diesel hybrid, but then I woke up. :(

xcel
07-09-2007, 05:38 PM
Hi All:

___It looks like we may actually be able to test drive this vehicle for some real world distances and on our own daily commutes for a week plus starting either August 13 or August 21. This information came about through my contact, Ryan Eichler of Weber Shandwick, the Company in charge of the many Turbo-Diesels we saw and experienced two weeks ago in Detroit. I also asked if we could take the BMW 330d out prior to those dates but I have not received nor expect a response wrt that question so soon after firing off the “Yes, we will take it” E-Mail yet :D

___Jeff, I wish you and Randall lived closer as this would be a heck of a review with your commentary added afterward ;) If either of you would have any business to be in the Chicago area about that time, fly in and I will provide the accommodations.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

c0da
07-09-2007, 05:51 PM
I think you should make a podcast of your commute and experience with this car. Pretty please xcel! :D

Right Lane Cruiser
07-09-2007, 06:45 PM
I think you should make a podcast of your commute and experience with this car. Pretty please xcel! :D

I second that request! With video footage, please!

xcel
07-09-2007, 06:59 PM
Hi C0da and Sean:

___Interesting idea ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

psyshack
07-09-2007, 09:03 PM
Hi All:

___It looks like we may actually be able to test drive this vehicle for some real world distances and on our own daily commutes for a week plus starting either August 13 or August 21. This information came about through my contact, Ryan Eichler of Weber Shandwick, the Company in charge of the many Turbo-Diesels we saw and experienced two weeks ago in Detroit. I also asked if we could take the BMW 330d out prior to those dates but I have not received nor expect a response wrt that question so soon after firing off the “Yes, we will take it” E-Mail yet :D

___Jeff, I wish you and Randall lived closer as this would be a heck of a review with your commentary added afterward ;) If either of you would have any business to be in the Chicago area about that time, fly in and I will provide the accommodations.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

OMG!!!!

Let me check vacation time. Maybe a suicide run to the windy city is in order. It would be nice to have the R-18 on hand.

God that would be fun. :woot:

psy

vtec-e
08-01-2007, 02:51 PM
Here in europe the 1.5D has become a popular engine. We get taxed on engine size in ireland at the moment so the 2.2D deters a lot of potential buyers. At the end of the day people just want to go to work, not qualify for pole position!

brick
08-01-2007, 03:00 PM
I wish we had that attitude in the US! Getting to work is secondary to getting to work faster than everybody else.

xcel
08-01-2007, 05:17 PM
Hi Vtec-e:

___Excellent reply! Like Tim mentioned, it sure would be nice if most of us thought similarly here in the US. Unfortunately, there needs to be blood in the streets before we start to get it and even then, there are holdouts. 9/11 comes to mind wrt that last analogy :ccry:

___If Honda ever did design and build a 1.5 iCDTi for the next generation Fit or some other such B- or compact sized vehicle, that thing would be on top of my A list yesterday! Add a 10 – 20 mile PHEV capability and our problems are over :D If the price was right that is?

___Good Luck

___Wayne

bear15
08-01-2007, 08:28 PM
We would love to have a look at this car. Wayne, please keep us updated.

jcp123
08-12-2007, 07:27 PM
More diesel! More diesel!

Yes, even HonDUH's.

EvlMinion
08-14-2007, 11:10 PM
I'm gonna be a good little minion and save my money. If a Civic diesel shows up over here in the next couple years, it's mine. 251 lb-ft of torque would cure the only ill my Civic has.

jcp123
01-20-2008, 12:33 PM
Hideous car...but I'm liking the diesel. If they manage to get it here, I might actually start liking Hondas...

phoebeisis
01-20-2008, 01:53 PM
Great review!I like the looks, but I love hatchbacks,so no surprise there.It looks like it would have more "height" room toward the back than the Prius;this would allow it to carry bulkier items.The Prius's roofline drops toward the back,and it has that battery pack which makes the floor height high.
It brings to mind the Porche 924 944 928 from the 80's.It is actually quicker than the 924,and maybe the 944(they had very modest acceleration for sports cars)
If I ruled the world all cars would be hatchbacks.
Wayne,what would you predict its mpg at 65 mph would be? It looks roomy enough to be a USA road trip vehicle,and a decent Home Depot vehicle.The Prius gets maybe -45-47 mpg-sea level-at 65mph.I use 65mph because many western interstates are 75mph (I-10 is 80 mph in West Texas).If this vehicle got an honest 55mpg at 65mph it would be spectacular.
Thanks,
Charlie

Andy.nic
09-16-2008, 06:07 PM
I have just spent a day in a friends Civic Ictd-i, with four guys in driven at around the Bitish speed limit, it was fast and comfortable and returned 57mpg overall. Sp very impressed, lots of toys, dual zone climate, glass roof auto lights and wipers, back seats that fold up to fit a bicycle in without having to move stuff in the boot, this should be a car for sale around the world.....in the UK it was £18000. Over here we use the expression 'Rip off Britian'

xcel
09-18-2008, 02:46 PM
Hi Andy:

___If you only knew how much us American's and Canadian's would love to have this exact car available to us :ccry: It is less expensive than the HCH-II in the UK so would be less expensive than the HCH-II here with more Fuel Economy capability and far more performance too.

___Have you read our full review of this vehicle yet?

CleanMPG reviews the 2007 Honda Civic 2.2L iCDTi Turbo Diesel - Shot across the bow. The Diesel invasion of America is about to begin. (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6526)

___Good Luck

___Wayne



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