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View Full Version : Questions Loom as the Industry Vows to Boost poor fuel economy, 'Flex-Fuel' Vehicles.


xcel
05-10-2007, 06:40 PM
''Corn-based ethanol is not sustainable at levels that would support widespread use of E85.'' (http://www.forbesautos.com/news/headlines/2007/may/ap05082007-ethanol-concerns.html)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/2008_E85_based_Ford_Escape_Hybrid.jpgKen Thomas - AP - May 10, 2007

2008 E85 capable Ford Escape Hybrid fueling outside of Dearborn. Ford is producing 20 demonstration Escape Hybrid E85 vehicles for use in fleets in six different states this spring.

WASHINGTON - Whenever the leaders of Detroit's auto industry visit the White House or Congress these days, a flexible-fuel vehicle emblazoned with images of corn and America's heartland is never far behind.

General Motors Corp., Ford Motor Co. and the Chrysler Group have vowed to ramp up production of vehicles that can run on either gasoline or ethanol blends at a time when energy security and global warming concerns are top issues for policy makers.

But the auto industry's ability to successfully bring the so-called ''flex-fuel'' vehicles to market faces a number of obstacles, including a limited distribution system, a small number of gas stations and low consumer awareness.

Leaders of GM, Ford and DaimlerChrysler AG's Chrysler Group met with President Bush recently to discuss ways of getting more motorists to buy vehicles powered by E85, which is 85 percent ethanol and 15 percent gasoline.

The Detroit automakers, which have produced about 6 million flex-fuel vehicles (FFVs) since the mid-1990s, reissued a pledge to double production to about 2 million a year by 2010 - 20 percent of their expected production.

Automakers, in fact, say they could make half of all cars and trucks capable of running on alternative fuels by 2012 if enough E85 is available. For GM, the world's largest automaker, that would mean boosting production from 400,000 FFVs each year to 800,000.

Infrastructure remains a crucial consideration: Less than 1 percent of the nation's gas stations offer E85, or about 1,100 out of 170,000 stations, according to the National Ethanol Vehicle Coalition, and the vast majority are in the Midwest.

About half of all gasoline currently sold contains some ethanol. But for all gas to contain even a 10 percent ethanol blend, ethanol production would have to triple, oil companies say.

There's not enough ethanol or flexible-fuel vehicles available to economically justify widespread installation of E85 pumps, said Red Cavaney, president of the American Petroleum Institute, the oil company's trade group … http://www.forbesautos.com/news/headlines/2007/may/ap05082007-ethanol-concerns.html

Pravus Prime
05-11-2007, 05:31 AM
I wouldn't mind testing one of those for Ford, but I doubt this will ever see that big of a production run anytime soon.

c0da
05-11-2007, 08:51 AM
Mexico is gonna be really mad if the price of corn skyrockets because of a shortage. Corn is used for so many things and using it for fuel could create an increase in price of many food products. Using ethanol to make corn has been a big mistake from the start. It was ok initially, but should have changed to another product that isn't used as frequently in other food products and to feed livestock.

I really don't like ethanol and they should really stop pursuing it. It doesn't look like they're going to stop anytime soon though. Brazil uses sugar to make their ethanol, maybe we should try that?

Earthling
05-11-2007, 09:31 AM
Mexico is gonna be really mad if the price of corn skyrockets because of a shortage. Corn is used for so many things and using it for fuel could create an increase in price of many food products. Using ethanol to make corn has been a big mistake from the start. It was ok initially, but should have changed to another product that isn't used as frequently in other food products and to feed livestock.



I agree, and will add that it won't be just Mexico that is mad. Our grocery bills have already increased. The price of corn has doubled, and as you accurately point out, this has raised the price of feed. The price of chickens, for example, is up because of this.

We have a situation where Americans insist on driving gas hog vehicles which raises the price of gasoline for all of us. But wait, with this push for ethanol, now our gas-hog buddies are raising our grocery bills as well!

Hopefully ethanol will be made from some form of biomass other than corn. But the main point is, fuel economy is the key, not a substitute fuel! Ethanol is just an excuse to keep driving gas hogs (while raising the price of hogs!)

Harry



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