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Green gains were offset by monstrosities and curiosities. (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/in-the-news/t-2007-la-auto-show-wrap-up-7338.html#post55048)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/2008_Chevrolet_Tahoe_Green_Car_of_the_Year.jpgWayne Gerdes – CleanMPG (http://www.cleanmpg.com) – Nov. 17, 2007

2008 Chevrolet Tahoe 2-Mode Hybrid – Green Car Journal’s “Green Car of the Year”. Can anything rated at just 21 mpg combined be green?

The Los Angeles Auto Show has a long and illustrious history with the first show occurring over 100 years ago. That first show represented 46 manufacturers including Maxwell, Peerless, Overland, Pope-Toledo and White as well as the more familiar names that have survived into the present era such as Ford and Cadillac. Of the 99 automobiles on display that first year, 2 were electric, the rest gasoline-powered.

The quote best summing up the Los Angeles area during the 1907 event follows:

“There are towns in the East that boast an automobile to every one hundred of the population… Los Angeles, with a quarter of a million people, has an automobile for every eighty persons. It is without exception the banner automobile city of the world.” – Los Angeles Times - January 23, 1907

Fast forward to the present. The LA Auto Show is becoming known as one of the premiere Green Auto Shows in the world. Located in the heart of downtown Los Angeles in what could be considered the largest automobile market in the world -- one rivaling that of most countries -- this year’s event saw more than 40 new North American and World automobile debuts.

Although the show was to highlight the greening of the American Automobile, what was seen was a mixture of semi-green hybrids and alternative fuel vehicles as well as some of the most obscene gas guzzling vehicles available anywhere at any price.

Some of the highlights …

Honda

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/Honda_FCX_Clarity.jpghttp://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/Honda_FCX_Clarity_-_FCD.jpg
2009 Honda FCX Clarity FCV----------------------------------------------Honda Clarity’s instrument cluster

Honda introduced the world’s first limited availability FCV called the Clarity. With a 3-year, unlimited mileage lease estimated at $600/month including maintenance and collision insurance, the Clarity includes a number of features never before seen in the retail marketplace. It has the ability to travel 270 miles on a single 5,000 psi H2 fill, is capable of achieving a gasoline equivalent 68 mpg in a true mid-sized sedan format and the cost to fill the tank appears to be ~ $3.50 per gallon equivalent of Hydrogen. These basic facts reveal an outstanding economic argument for the FCV on fuel cost and range basis alone. Unfortunately, that H2 comes from reformulated home or commercial supplies of natural gas which is itself a fossil fuel with all the same limited quantity issues we are currently experiencing with petroleum. The real question mark pertains to the true cost of the Clarity without the massive subsidies Honda will cover for the limited few who receive this vehicle during the summer of 2008? Because the Clarity’s production is supposed to be performed in Honda’s low volume Takanezawa Plant in the Tochigi Prefecture, rumors of a $1,000,000 cost per one-off vehicle abound. With a 10 + year lead time before FCV’s have even the remotest possibility of becoming main stream, the Clarity is largely a niche testing product with extremely limited availability.

GM

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/2009_Chevrolet_Aveo5.jpghttp://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/2009_Chevy_Silverado_Hybrid.jpg
2009 Chevrolet Aveo5 – 5-door hatch-----------------------------------------2009 Chevrolet Silverado 2-Mode Hybrid

The 2009 Chevrolet Aveo5 is best described as a refresh. A vehicle that weighs less than 2,400 pounds and includes a more refined 1.6L ICE and a 5-speed stick should allow far more than the 26/34 mpg (08 EPA specs) advertised.

The 2008 Chevrolet Tahoe 2-Mode with an MSRP of $50,490 for the 2WD model compares favorably with the Tahoe LT3 in features and amenities. A quick look over the std. features included with each reveals that the LT3 needs the touch screen Navigation system, rear view camera and third row seat to make an apples to apples comparison. The 6.0L ICE included with the 2-Mode can tow more and is proportionately more powerful. Considering the LT3 costs just $41,060 without the Navigation unit (since that package adds a sun roof and rear DVD entertainment system), I would estimate the Hybrid price premium approaches a hefty $8,000. Although there will be a large tax credit for the 2-Mode, those who can afford a $55,000 vehicle after TTL will be highly unlikely to qualify due to AMT exclusion. I was hoping for a lot lower MSRP than $50,490 myself.

Pricing of the other three 2-Mode models are as follows: Chevy Tahoe 4WD at $53,295, GMC Yukon 2WD at $50,945 and the Yukon 4WD at $53,755.

The 2009 Chevrolet Silverado P/U – 2-Mode Hybrid is quite possibly the surprise of the show! Using the Tahoe 2-Modes underpinnings, it will be interesting to see this Silverado’s MSRP by comparison to the ¾ or 1-Ton Silverado’s with the Duramax diesel. Although the Diesel Duramax will be able to tow more, because its GVWR is above the EPA imposed 8,000lb cutoff, FE does not need to be calculated or listed for this vehicle. The Silverado 2-Mode should however achieve a 22/22 mpg rating per the 08 EPA specs given the 800 or so fewer pounds when compared to the 2-Mode Tahoe and Yukon.

Toyota

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/2008_Toyota_Sequoia.jpghttp://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/2009_Toyota_Corolla_S.jpg
2008 Toyota Sequoia Full size SUV-----------------------------------------------2009 Toyota Corolla S

The new 2008 Toyota Sequoia was officially introduced with 13/16 and 13/18 EPA FE estimates from the 4.7 and 5.7L ICE’s respectively. With such low mileage ratings, this vehicle based on the all new Tundra CrewMax chassis undoes all the good that the Yaris, Corolla and Prius have done over the years in one fell swoop :ccry:

The new 2009 Toyota Corolla appears to be little more than a refresh. From the underpinnings, the ICE, its FE ratings and size, everything matches the previous generation almost item for item. One thing Toyota did fix was the strange ergonomic relationship between the steering wheel and seating position for just about every driver regardless of size with an all-new Tilt and Telescopic steering wheel. The refreshed interior has a more comfortable appearance although the HVAC controls were downgraded to the look and feel of the Yaris. The final negative has to do with the NAVI unit available on the higher end models. It is neither flush with the dash nor any more polished than a Best Buy add-on. On a positive note, it is still the most fuel efficient compact non-hybrid automobile available on the US market other than its sibling the Yaris and the upcoming mini SMART Fortwo.

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/2009_VW_Jetta_TDI_News.jpgVolkswagen

One of the highlights of the 2007 LA Autoshow included the soon to arrive, 2009 VW Jetta TDI. Powered by the all new 2.0-liter I4 making 140 hp and 236 lb-ft of torque with either a six-speed manual or a DSG automated MT, the 2009 Jetta TDI will be a great option for anyone in the market for a far more fuel efficient automobile.

The 2.0L diesel is the same CI-ICE that will be sold world wide, though the emissions package will be much different for US Tier II/Bin 5 compliance. The compression ratio has been reduced to 16.5:1 while injector pressures have been increased to 2,000 BAR (a touch under 30,000 psi) with the new and much faster reacting Piezo injectors controlling up to 5 injections per intake event. NVH and emissions have been reduced while power output has been improved over a wider RPM range. The first pilot injection is only for light off while the final is used only for burning off the PM buildup on the DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter). There are two fast light glow plugs per cylinder that help with cold starts.

The best news is that the new Jetta should achieve low to mid 40’s in the city and mid 40’s to low 50’s on the highway per the new 08 EPA estimates. All of this with an 8 second to 60 performance. Another positive is that the premium for this diesel over an equivalent gasoline only model should be no more than $2,000.

Negatives for this great vehicle include inability to use Bio-diesel over B5 and the need for a low ash synthetic oil in the crank case.

The Side Show

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/Freedom_From_Oil_with_PHEVs.jpghttp://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/573/Prius_PHEV_Conversions.jpg
Freedom from Oil-----------------------------------------------------------------The PHEV’s

What good would a show be without a little controversy? Across the street from the LA Auto Show during the Schwarzenegger Alternative Fuel Press Conference (as seen in the background behind the 2 PHEVs), Felix Kramer and his friends staged an impromptu conference of their own. Although little attention was paid, I thought it was worthy of my time.

The vehicle that attracted my eye was the Nilar NiMH equipped Prius-II PHEV from Plug-In Conversions (http://www.pluginconversions.com/index.html). Although still priced out of practical reach for the everyday enthusiast at $7K for a PHEV-7 or 8 conversion, the installer told me these NiMH packs are Chevron patent free. Another item of interest is that they are supposedly monitored by pressure build as well as stack parameters. Most packs today are monitored with a cell or stack algorithm. This technology is still somewhat heavy but from the specs, it could eventually make a dent.

As for the rest, here goes. Audi is looking forward to the launch of their urea injected, SCR equipped 3.0L diesel in the A4 by late 2008.

Acura had nothing new to show that I saw?

BMW is readying the 3.0L V6 diesel for one of their more expensive offerings w/ the 2.0L no where in sight. Urea injection will be its forte.

Cadillac was showing off the Escalade 2-Mode. Again, did someone miss the memo that oil supplies are not keeping up with demand?

Chrysler has slated the Durango Hybrid for next year. Their diesels? Yeah right.

Daimler was showing a diesel-hybrid concept though when asked about the details, they almost appeared embarrassed by the need to offer such technology?

Ford was pushing their Mustang Bullitt and SYNC in the Focus. At least the Focus receives a 24/35 08 EPA estimate w/ a stick?

Hummer? Another yeah right :rolleyes:

Lexus is offering the new RXh -- about the only offering that deserved mention. I hope to do a bit more with that vehicle in Detroit.

Mazda reps did not want to even discuss the 2, treating the subject like it was a three headed stepchild.

Mini had the 2009 Mini Cooper Clubman launch but scant details other than the slightly increased length and width, and the addition of a small third door to the passenger side.

Mitsubishi was showing its EVO but the MiEV was nowhere to be found?

Nissan had the journalists going gaga over the new GT-R and they released the new Murano but nothing worth talking to them about from a FE perspective was seen.

SMART was there so I would ask that you read the preview of the SMART Fortwo (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/reviews/t-cleanmpg-previews-the-2008-smart-fortwo-7133.html) in the review section for more information.

Subaru was doing the WRX dance and offered up little to attract my attention.

Volvo had their idea of a PHEV-60 mockup called the ReCharge on the floor but it will be years before we see that one in the flesh.

There were of course the jet set vehicles including a few Ferrari’s, Maybach’s, Jaguar’s, Lamborghini’s and Porsche’s launched at the show. Who in their right minds would purchase one of those nowadays? Hopefully just collectors for an ancient history museum or something ;)

Good Luck

Wayne

Where are the hybrid diesels, better yet where a the 1/2 ton and small chassis with small Duramax diesels, or even better the 1/2 ton and small chassis vehicles with the small Duramax diesels and hybrid systems.

..or even better yet the announcement that production of current full size trucks and SUVs is stoppping because they can't meet new (in my dreams) fuel economy standards.

Hi TheTonka:

___While doing some final research for the wrap-up, I came across the following.

Silverado 2500HD – Diesel engine option: Engine, , Duramax 6.6L Turbo Diesel V8, B5-Diesel compatible (365 hp [271.7 kW] @ 3200 rpm, 660 lb-ft of torque [894.6 N-m] @ 1600 rpm) (LMM) - MSRP $7,195 over the std. 6.0L V8.

___The Duramax in the Silverado, the International in the F250’s on up or the Cummins in the Dodge Ram’s pricing is so far out of whack with the actual costs of a diesel upgrade it is beyond ridiculous. The 2.3L I4 from Mazda costs all of $1,200 in total wrapped up and shipped to MN for placement into a Ranger P/U. The 4 cyl. diesels in Europe have all of a $1,000 - $2,000 premium over and above their non-diesel counterparts and this includes a VVT, 2,000 BAR Common rail pressures, piezo injectors, and 6-speed MT’s included.

___The 2-Mode is not worth anywhere near $8,000 either given Toyota’s HSD is coming down to the $1,500 range all-in for the lightweight vehicles but at least GM’s numbers are out. GM propulsion managers actually told me they pay more than $2K for just the PanasonicEV battery and that in and of itself is a tragedy given I doubt it has any more cap than that in the Prius given my short time behind the wheel of one :ccry:

___With the Tahoe and Yukon 2-Mode sales over the upcoming year as a guide (I do not believe GM will sell many at the premium announced), I believe the Silverado will see pricing more in line with the rest of the industry. Maybe a $4 to $5K upgrade cost. Even a $4K premium will be hard to justify on a $’s saved basis with 15,000 miles traveled at either 17 or 21 mpg respectively with gasoline at $3.50 per gallon.

___I cannot wait to see the light P/U and SUV diesel’s hit the market place. I have the feeling the domestics are not prepared to go there although GM is working on the 4.5L with all the bells and whistles just in case. $7K premiums however are to onerous for someone used to paying less than $25K for their ride.

___Am I a pessimist or what ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Good Morning, Wayne;

Thanks for the great info on our green selection and the specs at the L.A. show.

I have a question on the VW Jetta TDI. You say
"The best news is that the new Jetta should achieve low to mid 40’s in the city and mid 40’s to low 50’s on the highway per the new 08 EPA estimates".

My question:


Those EPA MPG estimates. What transmission was used to achieve those MPG ratings and, most important question, could a hypermiler driving that car with the 6 speed manual transmission achieve SIGNIFICANTLY better MPG?? Any idea how much better?

As always, thanks Wayne for all your good stuff!

Bob.

Hi Robert:

___The VW engineers I was speaking with would not release that information but with the efficiency of the DSG, I bet both are pretty close to one another in terms of city and highway FE.

___WRT what a hypermiler can do with a world class diesel, take a good look at the numbers achieved from a Euro sourced 2007 Honda Civic ICDTi with a generation back VVT, solenoid operated injectors and far less injection pressure(s) as a guide.

CleanMPG reviews the 2007 Honda Civic 2.2L iCDTi Turbo Diesel (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/reviews/t-cleanmpg-reviews-the-2007-honda-civic-22l-icdti-turbo-diesel-6526.html)

___I believe the VW 2.0L TDI is going to impress many of us here at CleanMPG once it is in the right hands but we will not know until late summer what this thing can actually achieve …

___Good Luck

___Wayne

The 2009 Toyota Corolla is not a minor model change. It's 2.4" wider, 0.4" longer, though 0.8 inches shorter. The only major dimension that didn't change is the wheelbase, still at a short 102.4" (Which doesn't mean good things for passenger cabin volume.) It's now bigger than a 2006-2008 Civic, and comes with an optional 2.4L engine from the Camry. The 1.8L is still mated to a 5 speed manual or 4 speed automatic.

Did you get confirmation that the 1.8L EPA-08 estimates are for both the manual *and* automatic? Or did they go all vague on you again. (Given the Matrix numbers released, I won't be surprised at the answer in the spring.)


On Mazda, in all fairness, as far as I know the Mazda 2 hasn't been announced in the US, and if you were wearing your press badge (and even if you weren't) questions on an unannounced model would be deflected.

On Honda, best report I've seen from LA. (http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=722888) Disclaimer - I have no connections to ToV, just a member there, no different than here. I just like Hondas.

-mr. bill

Hi Mr. Bill:

___When you get the chance to sit in the new 09 Corolla as well as look at its specs, you will see exactly what I did. The same McPherson strut front and torsion beam rear on the same wheelbase. When you look into the interior, it is also very similar to the 03 Corolla I own. Make no mistake, this was not a total redesign even though it is described as being just that. When considering the mechanicals under the hood, the EPA estimates Toyota released coming from both the Auto and Stick are exactly the same as those from the 03 - 08 with only a slight increase in torque and HP.

___WRT the Mazda2, they were far less helpful than Honda or Toyota even though we gather info on Honda and Toyota releases from alternate sources. The Honda reps on the show floor would not discuss anything on the diesel yet we are 75% sure what it will be in and what it will be given the European reports.

___Everything shown in the TOV video’s was revealed at the Press Event itself and nothing more was added :( The FCV stack Honda has designed appears to be a 5th gen given the name V stack but I would be guessing if this were the case or not since I did not ask that question. At least we know Honda is placing the Clarity in a few hands by the summer of 08 per the press kit(s). What was not announced was how the chosen few will be screened. Honda will be using a similar process as GM did with the EV-1. I asked Stephen Ellis if it will be as onerous and he hinted that it would not but they are looking for a specific subset of the Southern CA population that applies to place the Clarity into those individuals hands. It will be extremely limited.

___My only regret is due to lack of funds, I arrived over 3 hours after the first announcements were being presented on the show floor(s). I was chasing down vehicles of interest to CleanMPG members over the 2 main show floors well behind the curve. Unfortunately, I did not have the opportunity to study the Honda press materials before I spoke with Stephen Ellis and trust me, I asked some pretty foolish questions that were already released that I simply had not reviewed previously. Imprudent would be a great description to describe my questions although the information I received and the opportunity to speak with a titan of “our” industry was greatly appreciated.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

First drive of Honda FCX Clarity at ToV. (http://www.vtec.net/articles/view-article?article_id=724661) (Again, I'm just a member there who likes Hondas.)

-mr. bill

Boston is having *its* huge auto show this week, and I'm going
to wander over on Friday. There's no way I'll get as thorough
as Wayne, but anything in particular I should look for/at?
.
_H*