2TonJellyBean
11-16-2007, 11:10 PM
So far, Volkswagon has received very little fanfare and deserved accolades for developing a milestone in automotive transmission engineering. The DSG (direct shift gearbox), S-Tronic or double-clutch gearbox... "automatic" transmission is probably one of the key breakthroughs since present day fluid coupled inefficient at low revs automatics. Look at the manufacturers grasping out now CVTs but nobody is really raving about them. That driveline has to have much much more friction than VW's near perfect driveline in the DSG 6 speed design. It's a great transmission. Look at Vooch's numbers, and that's with the challenges of being a fairly heavy turbo car.
Anyway, this is a huge deal. A directly attached yet automatically shifted transmission. It shifts faster than the Ferrari Enzo. F1 cars are similar. My only area where I'd like to see marketing opportunities is in funding the R&D it would take to get many many more gears.
I cycle a lot and I have very narrow most efficient powerbands for different efforts over related times. I'll ride a 15K time trial at 178 - 180 bpm, and ramp up to 195 at the end, but if I did two very short hills on a ride over an 8 hour or longer period at that rate I would possibly never recover... I would only ever try ramping up to 180 within 30 - 60 kms from the end. Long meaning 200 kms and up. The legs unlike the heart, just work harder at nearly the same speed unless you ride a fixed gear. Clipped into a fixed gear you can't freewheel and your legs become more effective over a wide range of RPMS - the opposite of a sweet spot. The advantage of a fixed gear bike is the chain is perfectly straight and can't be any more simple, robust or efficient. It's great for the legs and can drop you on harsh railroad crossings. A fellow long distance cyclist would peddle at up to 180 rpm downhill and even be able to clip out to go faster and then clip in at 140 rpm - my legs are spun by then. On a fixed gear you gear for your sweet leg cadence for the average speed and then see how wide a range of RPMs you can go from there. If there's a big hill you don't want to walk, you gear for that instead. High intensity crits and I'm over 100 RPMs but nothing over 120, long distances (200kms plus) and I'll be most efficient with anything mid 70s to 90 depending on conditions AND gears. I depend on 20 gears on one bike and 27 on the other - some are redundant.
The key point is, my efficiency can be measured, my maximum endurance can be measured. To get good results I'm dependent on many gears. I have sweet spots for riding different distances. Our engines all have their sweet spots - they sound pretty monotonous on CVTs. And try and buy a Maxima without one? No more manuals on the Maxima. If they had enough gears on it it could do much better than the CVT with its friction losses. You could let the transmission shift if it was just as efficient as you or take the paddles if you can do better.
Gears are good... and lots of them help performance. This new VW can shift faster than the servo shifted Ferrari Enzo. You have to lift to shift. That's its one negative tick in the CONS department, and when you think about it or drive efficiently in a slushbox you lift to shift, although I'd much rather paddle, the ECM can do the lift quicker.
Right now in my slushbox, as soon as you can grab the next gear, I lift. For me 4th at 40kph and 5th at 62kph are the key times I lift to shift. Below those speeds it's usually not a good idea to be looking at gauges. ;) I really wish my vehicle had VW's transmission - just with more gears - maybe 8 but I'd love 3 x 10. I'd like to see a gear count war like the Shimano-disposible-crap verses the lusty Italian Campie grouppos had.
Can you imagine a 10 x 2 or 3 transmission? Pick your gearing faster than on a quick change rear hub - no tools - just the ECM or your paddle finger. Anyone would be as good as a lazy pulse and glide. Nearly all of the benefits! If you find the gear is close enough to the sweet spot for that speed then why bother? It's disruptive to P&G when talking to the other people in the car, oh yeah... that seat's been taken out for the sealots to get from 72 to 79 MPG. Anyway, the normal rank and file driver would get amazingly better mileage with this change, it's truly revolutionary.
Wouldn't it be just about the greenest gesture ever if all the other manufacturers could share in VW's amazing breakthrough in transmissions, and then let a gear count war break out? Lexus has the 7 speed, why don't they have VW's technology available to them? I really wish every auto maker could take advantage of this. Imagine the savings on everything? Even starters! ;)
About DSG (http://cars.about.com/od/thingsyouneedtoknow/a/ag_howDSGworks.htm)
Anyway, this is a huge deal. A directly attached yet automatically shifted transmission. It shifts faster than the Ferrari Enzo. F1 cars are similar. My only area where I'd like to see marketing opportunities is in funding the R&D it would take to get many many more gears.
I cycle a lot and I have very narrow most efficient powerbands for different efforts over related times. I'll ride a 15K time trial at 178 - 180 bpm, and ramp up to 195 at the end, but if I did two very short hills on a ride over an 8 hour or longer period at that rate I would possibly never recover... I would only ever try ramping up to 180 within 30 - 60 kms from the end. Long meaning 200 kms and up. The legs unlike the heart, just work harder at nearly the same speed unless you ride a fixed gear. Clipped into a fixed gear you can't freewheel and your legs become more effective over a wide range of RPMS - the opposite of a sweet spot. The advantage of a fixed gear bike is the chain is perfectly straight and can't be any more simple, robust or efficient. It's great for the legs and can drop you on harsh railroad crossings. A fellow long distance cyclist would peddle at up to 180 rpm downhill and even be able to clip out to go faster and then clip in at 140 rpm - my legs are spun by then. On a fixed gear you gear for your sweet leg cadence for the average speed and then see how wide a range of RPMs you can go from there. If there's a big hill you don't want to walk, you gear for that instead. High intensity crits and I'm over 100 RPMs but nothing over 120, long distances (200kms plus) and I'll be most efficient with anything mid 70s to 90 depending on conditions AND gears. I depend on 20 gears on one bike and 27 on the other - some are redundant.
The key point is, my efficiency can be measured, my maximum endurance can be measured. To get good results I'm dependent on many gears. I have sweet spots for riding different distances. Our engines all have their sweet spots - they sound pretty monotonous on CVTs. And try and buy a Maxima without one? No more manuals on the Maxima. If they had enough gears on it it could do much better than the CVT with its friction losses. You could let the transmission shift if it was just as efficient as you or take the paddles if you can do better.
Gears are good... and lots of them help performance. This new VW can shift faster than the servo shifted Ferrari Enzo. You have to lift to shift. That's its one negative tick in the CONS department, and when you think about it or drive efficiently in a slushbox you lift to shift, although I'd much rather paddle, the ECM can do the lift quicker.
Right now in my slushbox, as soon as you can grab the next gear, I lift. For me 4th at 40kph and 5th at 62kph are the key times I lift to shift. Below those speeds it's usually not a good idea to be looking at gauges. ;) I really wish my vehicle had VW's transmission - just with more gears - maybe 8 but I'd love 3 x 10. I'd like to see a gear count war like the Shimano-disposible-crap verses the lusty Italian Campie grouppos had.
Can you imagine a 10 x 2 or 3 transmission? Pick your gearing faster than on a quick change rear hub - no tools - just the ECM or your paddle finger. Anyone would be as good as a lazy pulse and glide. Nearly all of the benefits! If you find the gear is close enough to the sweet spot for that speed then why bother? It's disruptive to P&G when talking to the other people in the car, oh yeah... that seat's been taken out for the sealots to get from 72 to 79 MPG. Anyway, the normal rank and file driver would get amazingly better mileage with this change, it's truly revolutionary.
Wouldn't it be just about the greenest gesture ever if all the other manufacturers could share in VW's amazing breakthrough in transmissions, and then let a gear count war break out? Lexus has the 7 speed, why don't they have VW's technology available to them? I really wish every auto maker could take advantage of this. Imagine the savings on everything? Even starters! ;)
About DSG (http://cars.about.com/od/thingsyouneedtoknow/a/ag_howDSGworks.htm)