Archives

xcel

04-30-2006, 12:58 PM

philmcneal

05-01-2006, 02:59 AM

i know of many people selling their current gas guzzers and looking for a better alternative. You guys just made something that will get a lot of attention to cleanmpg, very well done! And I can see where we are going with trends like this, cleaner air! Yum time to spread the links.

brick

05-01-2006, 06:22 AM

Well done! It's just too bad that many of those cars, particularly the hybrids, are selling at prices well above those that you would expect. Any used Civic Hybrid, Insight, or Prius will go for in excess of $18-$20k with anything under 30k miles. At least, that's what I've found while playing with Autotrader. The best deal going for a real mileage machine is a well-used Insight. I have seen several of them up for sale with ~80k miles for under $10,000. The only wildcard there is the IMA battery, which may or may not be a concern. Also make sure you pack light!

Chuck

05-01-2006, 09:55 AM

Not that many 40mpg+ vehicles have been built since 1990. Still, it should be possible to find something if one is patient.

I had a 1974 Datsun B110 that got 50mpg (now known as Nissan). Cars from the 70s and 80s are bound to have a lot of milage on them, but some should be around.

krousdb

05-01-2006, 10:19 AM

No Del Sol's on the list.:(

Chuck

05-01-2006, 10:27 AM

One other thing to mourn about: I don't think we will see many dirt cheap Metros, CRX's, and similar subcompacts. I know about the Honda Fit, but it does not look like it will hypermile as well as some of the vehicles mentioned. More safety features will make if a little heavier, and the general public will not tolerate anything that can't go 0-60mph in over 12 seconds.

Hybrids will crack the 100mpg realm, but at a price.

Sledge

05-08-2006, 07:11 AM

i know of many people selling their current gas guzzers and looking for a better alternative.

Thanks to gas prices, the resale value of guzzlers has dropped quite a bit making it a bit more difficult in some cases to get into a decent smaller car.

malachite81

04-07-2007, 08:46 AM

brucepick

04-07-2007, 01:51 PM

Sorry to "hear" that.

I too, wouldn't want one that's been modified right out of being fuel-efficient - not to mention that the seller likely wants an increased price for all the mods.

This is probably old news for you, but have you tried craigslist.org, cars.com, and autos.com?

Years ago I was in a business buying and selling pre-owned items. One lesson I learned was to shop patiently. If you need a car this weekend or even this month you'll be under pressure and pay more for a less suitable item. If you shop patiently you stand a better chance of finding what you want at a price you find acceptable.

basjoos

04-08-2007, 09:44 AM

Another problem is finding a lightweight model like the Civic VX or CRX HF that doesn't have some brilliant featureset like this:

"B16 engine swap! Many Mods! JDM B18A VTEC TURBO GREDDY NOS! (rims not included, need for other car), lowered, nds paint, other half of body kit installed"

Its very difficult to find a stock one of these, because I've been looking.

Just needed to vent my frustration.

Its easier to find an unmodified Civic CX, since it isn't prewired for VTEC and didn't come with all the bells and whistles that make it attractive to the "Honda hybrid" crowd. The CX has the same transmission ratios and weight as the VX, and it you can't live with its stock 70hp motor, you can always stick a used 104hp DX motor in it, which will give you 10 sec 0 to 60mph times with no drop in mpg when driven frugally. The stock CX will give you an honest 50+ mpg at highway speeds and if you aero mod the heck out of it, can give you 68mpg at 75mph.

Earthling

04-27-2007, 01:53 PM

I can vouch for Civics making excellent used cars. My son is driving my old '98 Civic DX and we still have a '99 Civic LX as a second car.

Get an owner's manual and keep up the maintenance, including having the valves adjusted, and those cars will last forever.

My '99 still feels solid and new, with 140,000 miles on it.

Harry

yab13e

07-28-2007, 01:22 PM

I would also add the 1991-1994 Nissan Sentra to the list, those cars get 29 city and 38 hwy and have a more powerful 110 hp 1.6 engine. (my 94E mdl 5spd was neck and neck with a 94 Integra GS 5spd):eek: If you want the best mileage get the E model which is stripped down and has the least weight so its the fastest and most economical mdl. BTW Sentras are easier to find unmodified too.:) I really miss my Sentra, Katrina took it from me:(

Good Luck.

desdemona

07-29-2007, 11:48 PM

Thanks for your list!! It may come in quite handy to me. Otoh, I agree that the Hybrid prices might not be quite right. In fact, I am thinking blue book is saying higher. Btw, I loved my old Honda Civic hatchback (year??) but it was never the same by getting hit by a truck, so I had to sell it/or maybe it was junk it. Anyway I looked for one this time around and didn't find one so that's why I have the Toyota (I had to find if fast I was driving a rental car).

--des

phoebeisis

09-02-2007, 12:52 PM

A couple of other cars come to mind.The pre 2006 Aveo isn't a great car,and maybe isn't even a good car.The MPG isn't very good for auch a light-about 2400 lbs,I think-car.However the mpg is much better than the average car or SUV,and they are CHEAP.Some Aveos sold for as little as $8000 new.Now since 2006 they got a slightly more efficient motor,and side airbags(not side curtain unfortunately),so they are even better(relatively speaking-I would prefer a 2000 5 speed Civic with 80K to a 2003 Aveo with 40k, but the civic would cost you more because everyone prefers the Civic).
The Focus isn't such a bad car either,and once again it is real life cheap.You can easily find a 2001 or newer-70K miles for about $4500.I particularly like the little wagon,and the hatchback.The Focus also got s significant engine upgrade(Mazda I think) in about 2005,so they are even better.These USA badged(Aveo is made in Korea,the Focus is made in the USA I think) cars have typically poor resale,so they are bargains if you are short of $$.
A big aside;I have found KBB greatly overestimates private sale value for USA and Japanese cars.It is a bit closer to the mark with Honda and Toyota.
Thanks,
Charlie

aca2983

09-02-2007, 07:18 PM

This is a "dark-horse" candidate for sure, but I had a 1997 Dodge Stratus that gave me the best everyday MPG of all cars I've had short of the 83 Civic. The 2.0 engine and 5-speed is a rare combo. Since the engine is that same as the Neon, I would imagine the Neon would be capable of better MPG #s because of it's weight. I got low 30's in my short urban commute, and high 30's on the highway, frequently exceeding 40. (My record was 45). It was a great handling car, comparable to Accords of the period, and had tons of back seat and trunk room. It was always the car of choice on roadtrips when we had more than 2 people because it was so roomy and cheap on gas. That car also had the best A/C of any car I've had. All my Japanese cars (Honda, Mazda, Subaru) have had lousy A/C output even when new. Except for the Subie, it also handled in snow better than any other.

desdemona

09-03-2007, 03:08 PM

Somehow the 83 Civic rings a bell. I'm guessing it was my old Civic. It must have been in your sig line as I don't see it here. The Hatchback is also, imo, one fo the nicest designs for carrying anything (the kinds of things people tend to really carry-- groceries, misc from home depot, trips to the mall, bikes, etc vs large game carcuses, off roader equipment, mountain climber gear, etc.).

--des

This is a "dark-horse" candidate for sure, but I had a 1997 Dodge Stratus that gave me the best everyday MPG of all cars I've had short of the 83 Civic. The 2.0 engine and 5-speed is a rare combo. Since the engine is that same as the Neon, I would imagine the Neon would be capable of better MPG #s because of it's weight. I got low 30's in my short urban commute, and high 30's on the highway, frequently exceeding 40. (My record was 45). It was a great handling car, comparable to Accords of the period, and had tons of back seat and trunk room. It was always the car of choice on roadtrips when we had more than 2 people because it was so roomy and cheap on gas. That car also had the best A/C of any car I've had. All my Japanese cars (Honda, Mazda, Subaru) have had lousy A/C output even when new. Except for the Subie, it also handled in snow better than any other.

2TonJellyBean

09-03-2007, 06:45 PM

If you regularly can and do fill six seats, I'd toss in Buick's LeSabre or even Park Ave if you can find a low miler that isn't supercharged. With the NA 3800 either of these cars gets very good highway mileage. For example, I'm not sure a slushbox Protegé could beat it at highway speeds and if so by very much, especially with a few seats filled and a trunk of stuff you need.

Consider the MPG per person - not quite at 40 passenger highway coach level but nice dependable comfortable quiet transportation.

aca2983

09-04-2007, 10:12 PM

Des,
The 80 thru 83 Civics were the 2nd Generation Civics.
All years had 1.3 or 1.5 engines ("1300" or "1500"). Base models had 4-speed manual trans, and upper models had 5-speed or an automatic. 80-81's had round headlights and were available in 2-door hatch or a wagon.

82-83's had square headlights, updated dash, and were also available in a 4-door sedan besides the hatch and wagon. In 1982 there was a hatchback model called the "1300FE". It was the highest MPG car of it's day. My parents bought a new 1982 1300FE in a yukky brown color. They wanted the car and it was late in the year and there was no choice. It had a plain AM/FM radio with one speaker, and in 1982, A/C was not available on the 1300FE. The equipment in the car was similar to other models. I think the key mechanical difference that contributed to the MPG was taller gearing in the 5-speed.

In 1983 the 1300FE gained an upshift indicator light on the dashboard, and you could order it with dealer installed A/C. I bought a used 1983 1300FE around 1988 or 89. It had 105k miles on it and was previously owned by a teacher. My folks and I were wary of buying a car with that many miles, but we did. My car was rather posh. It had the A/C, a 4-speaker stereo with cassette, AND an aftermarket but stock-looking cruise control. The original seat fabric was worn out (a common issue) and I paid $175 to have a local shop reupholster it in plush dark blue velour fabric. The car was metallic light blue. "Normal" everyday MPG for me was low to mid 40's. On highway trips it easily got mid-50's. My mileage probably took a slight hit because I had wider than stock tires on it (175 vs 165) and let's just say I didn't drive it "easy", although with only about 50hp, you couldn't really drive it too "hard". I kept it until about 1995 when it had about 205k miles on it and I traded it for a used 1991 Civic DX hatchback. That car was crappy. The 83 was and is the best car I've every owned. I dutifully changed the oil myself every 3500 miles. It only had to be towed once, and that was due to unusual circumstances (long story, but it went for a swim...). At 205k it still ran and looked great, just a tiny bit of blue smoke on startup due to worn valve seals, and some tiny patches of rust in the back. I guess I got nervous and decided to trade, plus I was living alone on my own in the city and didn't want to have to deal with potential problems, and didn't have my folks nearby to fall back on if needed.

The 2nd Generation Civics are not widely written about or remembered. In most climates, they eventually rusted, so you don't see them too much anymore. They did raise the bar though- the refinement was way better than a lot of other small cars of the period (we had also had a Chevette) The 1300FE deserves a special place in FE history though, because it was the Prius of it's day, the best MPG car you could buy if I recall correctly. It was bested in 84 (or 85?) by the CRX HF, which had more power, better FE, but only 2 seats. The later VX was pretty good too, especially considering it was much roomier.

I was proud to own such a fun to drive, satisfying, and well-made car, and I dream of finding one someday to restore it.

xcel

09-04-2007, 10:34 PM

Hi Aca2983:

___That was a great personal history lesson on fuel efficient vehicles of an era long forgotten by most. Thank you!

___Good Luck

___Wayne

desdemona

09-05-2007, 09:43 PM

Thanks. I looked it up on Wikipedia. It must have been it, though somehow I remember something a little smaller or compact looking-- but it was a compact, so maybe the pictures are a little deceptive.

I do recall rust being a problem (wouldn't be here in NM). I had an automatic, as it is all I can drive.

But I enjoyed the little ride thru memory lane.

--des

Des,
The 80 thru 83 Civics were the 2nd Generation Civics.
All years had 1.3 or 1.5 engines ("1300" or "1500"). Base models had 4-speed manual trans, and upper models had 5-speed or an automatic. 80-81's had round headlights and were available in 2-door hatch or a wagon.

82-83's had square headlights, updated dash, and were also available in a 4-door sedan besides the hatch and wagon. In 1982 there was a hatchback model called the "1300FE". It was the highest MPG car of it's day. My parents bought a new 1982 1300FE in a yukky brown color. They wanted the car and it was late in the year and there was no choice. It had a plain AM/FM radio with one speaker, and in 1982, A/C was not available on the 1300FE. The equipment in the car was similar to other models. I think the key mechanical difference that contributed to the MPG was taller gearing in the 5-speed.

In 1983 the 1300FE gained an upshift indicator light on the dashboard, and you could order it with dealer installed A/C. I bought a used 1983 1300FE around 1988 or 89. It had 105k miles on it and was previously owned by a teacher. My folks and I were wary of buying a car with that many miles, but we did. My car was rather posh. It had the A/C, a 4-speaker stereo with cassette, AND an aftermarket but stock-looking cruise control. The original seat fabric was worn out (a common issue) and I paid $175 to have a local shop reupholster it in plush dark blue velour fabric. The car was metallic light blue. "Normal" everyday MPG for me was low to mid 40's. On highway trips it easily got mid-50's. My mileage probably took a slight hit because I had wider than stock tires on it (175 vs 165) and let's just say I didn't drive it "easy", although with only about 50hp, you couldn't really drive it too "hard". I kept it until about 1995 when it had about 205k miles on it and I traded it for a used 1991 Civic DX hatchback. That car was crappy. The 83 was and is the best car I've every owned. I dutifully changed the oil myself every 3500 miles. It only had to be towed once, and that was due to unusual circumstances (long story, but it went for a swim...). At 205k it still ran and looked great, just a tiny bit of blue smoke on startup due to worn valve seals, and some tiny patches of rust in the back. I guess I got nervous and decided to trade, plus I was living alone on my own in the city and didn't want to have to deal with potential problems, and didn't have my folks nearby to fall back on if needed.

The 2nd Generation Civics are not widely written about or remembered. In most climates, they eventually rusted, so you don't see them too much anymore. They did raise the bar though- the refinement was way better than a lot of other small cars of the period (we had also had a Chevette) The 1300FE deserves a special place in FE history though, because it was the Prius of it's day, the best MPG car you could buy if I recall correctly. It was bested in 84 (or 85?) by the CRX HF, which had more power, better FE, but only 2 seats. The later VX was pretty good too, especially considering it was much roomier.

I was proud to own such a fun to drive, satisfying, and well-made car, and I dream of finding one someday to restore it.

Snowy_Jeep

10-04-2007, 02:38 PM

Thanks for the insights. We're looking for something, anything to help. Our rides need replacing! So hearing that if we shop patiently we can make it happen is a big help!

brucepick

10-15-2007, 08:35 AM

I'd like to take a minute to highlight the Civic HX series, produced from '96 to '05. It's EPA numbers were typically 10-20% higher than other similar Civics of the same years. As all HX's on the US market should have OBD-II, they are Scangauge capable. :D

The article mentions the Honda Civic 4 cyl, 1.7 L, Man(5), LEAN-BURN 36/44 but I saw it on the list above only for '03 and '04. I believe this is the HX which had a long ten year production run.

The original EPA rating of 36/44 was recently revised to an estimated 30/39 to reflect the newer test procedure. Those numbers are for 5-spd standard transmission; various changes including the upsizing the engine from 1.6 liters to 1.7 caused slight shifts in the EPA mpg numbers.

Thanks again to Wayne for producing this very comprehensive guide!

julianelischer

10-21-2007, 02:43 PM

I have a '91 Honda CRX that I dearly love. I have a 54 mile commute
(I try work from home when I can but it's not always possible) and even with 230,000 miles on it it's giving me 41Mpg when driven like a maniac.
I'd like to drive a bit more sensibly but traffic patterns at the times I need to drive
and the fact that I really don't like losing an entire 80 minutes of my day driving
means that I usually end up driving faster when I can, or in stop-n-go.
Still the CRX gives me lots of get-up-n-go and reat mileage. I'm really imporessed by it.

I'd love to get a nice new shiney hybrid, but you know, at 42 MPG teh CRX does ok, and
there is an ecological cost to making a new car. ESPECIALLY a hybrid.

Does anyone know how much fuel I'd have to save to make the purchase of a new hybrid a neutral event from the perspective of total energy usage?

xcel

10-21-2007, 02:57 PM

Hi Julian:

___If your CRX is working fine, keep it. What you are giving up is the SMOG forming emissions, the creature comforts and safety features of a new hybrid/new car vs. your older CRX. If it is the CRX HF, you more then likely will only gain a few mpg’s given your 41 mpg now and what most pull in a Prius at 46 – 48 mpg while driving them in a fashion I will call “reckless”. Remember you are not averaging 80 even though you may see 80 as a top speed to work and back. 80 is up to you but I bet your CRX is probably worth 60 + mpg if you were to set her up a bit better, slow to between the limits and work on the basic techniques?

___Good Luck

___Wayne

warthog1984

02-24-2008, 12:48 PM

Could somebody update the list? It's been a couple years and the used car market seems to have changed significantly.

Side Note: Stopped by 2 dealers yesterday. Absolutely packed with SUV/truck drivers looking at sedans. The only salesman I could find had to use the only open room with a CPU- the breakroom.

xcel

02-24-2008, 01:51 PM

Hi Warthog:

___Since I have over 65 hours on CleanMPG this week and a never ending list of stories, articles, posts and threads to keep up with, I would be greatly appreciative if you would take care of the update for me? It should not take over 3 or 4 hours to cross reference the vehicles with today’s KBB data using the original criteria.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

yellowtail3

02-24-2008, 04:06 PM

Here's your on-the-cheap list:

1. 91-94 Sentra. Get the 1.6 engine with a four- or five-speed
2. mid-early 90s Corolla or Prizm - be sure to get the five-speed
3. 91-99 Ford Escort. 91-96 best MPG, 97 and on a little more refined. Get a five-speed wagon - MPG as good or better than anything listed above, with FAR MORE SPACE.

I've got two of them.

BillLin

02-24-2008, 09:08 PM

re: updating the list

I can help with some of the "legwork..." Same years with increased miles, or same/similar models from 2006 back? (which would probably require more knowledge of the various models, e.g. lean burn) If all conditions remained the same, I don't know how useful the kbb values would be with unrealistically low miles. I didn't see where the default miles for given years came from, but I haven't looked that closely at the kbb site yet. Even the default miles for the older models seemed impossibly low, with only 3000 miles difference from year to year toward the end of the list.

Thanks for guidance/suggestions.

Cheers,
Bill (not likely to get to this tonight)

yellowtail3

02-24-2008, 09:40 PM

Here's a thought: look at a few Craigslist and Ebay ads. 'watch' the ebay auctions, see what cars of a model & year actually sell for.

here you go http://tinyurl.com/2kp2wm

xcel

02-24-2008, 11:07 PM

Hi Bill:

___I will work with you in the morning on this if you are able?

___Yellowtail, not a chance. For one, an exact vehicle matching the criteria will never sell for the same price on E-Bay and second, to catch every vehicle on the list with a similar miles and condition would not be practical vs. KBB with the criteria spelled out.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

warthog1984

02-25-2008, 12:27 AM

I could get the data. Don't know how to upload the formatting

xcel

02-25-2008, 12:31 PM

Hi All:

___Spent the morning updating the article and it is complete. If you find any errors, pass them along and I will fix them ASAP ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

lamebums

03-13-2008, 10:17 PM

I'm not so sure about these prices - I'd reasonably add 20% to these numbers. My experience is entirely anecdotal, but through scanning Craigslist, Ebay, kbb.com, and other places, the prices seem to be considerably higher than mentioned here. I think that with the gas prices, there's been a run on small, fuel-efficient cars, and that's driving up the demand - and thus the price of the cars. I mean, how many of the small cars owner's don't say "great on gas" or "gas saver" when they're trying to sell it?

xcel

03-13-2008, 10:43 PM

Hi Auston:

___These prices came directly from KBB if that helps? Whether one can pick up a used vehicle at the prices listed is a good question. I know a quick analysis of 03 – 05 HCH-I’s w/ clear titles on Ebay (actual purchases), they are going for under what is reported by KBB for a given odometer reading.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

93Hatch

03-14-2008, 06:50 AM

1988festiva

03-15-2008, 10:28 PM

Have to put a word in for the Festiva and Aspire. Incredibly under-rated cars if there ever were any. my '88 averages high '30's-low 40's mpg, and gets at least 45 highway, even though it's only rated at 40. (best ever mpg=57.7). Keep in mind, this is with an older one with a carburetor and a 4-speed.. later cars with FI and overdrive do better.
Certainly not the fanciest thing out there, but 0-60 in about 10 sec. is all you need, and used ones are, what, a few hundred $$$?

Pgh_G6

05-31-2008, 08:16 PM

I came to cleanmpg just today. I am still paying off my 2006 Pontiac G6 (21City, 32HWY) I actually get about 19-20City, 30 Hwy.
I have to work with the car I have(Pontiac G6.)
I have started to reduce my driving and am looking for methods to extend my mileage.
I am lucky that I work at home and need to travel for shopping, visits, entertainment, doctors appointments, etc.
Hopefully, I will be able to get a fuel efficient car in the future, but right now I am just looking for ways to extend the mileage on my Pontiac.
After reading the article about how to begin hypermiling, I will record changes in my MPG by doing the following:

1. Starting out slower
2. Planning ahead for my braking
3. Checking air pressure and putting in air between the recommended GM Mileage on the door and the air pressure limit on the tires.
I MIGHT EVEN TRY LIMITING MY IDLING AT LONG STOPS.

However, Once I tried to turn off my car -while idling in traffic on a steep hill - and then trying drifting downward.
I was frightened when I lost control of steering(it seemed) and I think the brakes were inefficient and that really scared me. I have not turned off the car on a hill again!

Any more tips?

Right Lane Cruiser

05-31-2008, 10:14 PM

Welcome PGH!! You are in good company here and we are glad to have you. :)

Did you return your key to the ON position after you turn the car off? If not your steering lock may have engaged. If you put the key back to on position all of your electronics will work and though you won't have power steering you'll still be able to steer with some effort. The power brakes depend upon vacuum built up by the running engine and you'll have 3-4 good brake applications before that runs out. Brakes will still work but you'll have to press harder. None of this should be too much of an issue if you are only sitting with the engine off at stops.

Check your user's manual to find out if your car is "flat towable" (able to be pulled on all 4 wheels) -- if it isn't please don't try letting your car roll without the engine running as it might damage the transmission.

To add to your list, look up the definitions of DWL and DWB in the Glossary -- use these with Light Timing and you'll be well on your way to making significant improvements in your mileage. :)

Also be sure to read the article Beating the EPA - The Why’s and how to Hypermile. (http://http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1510) to get a really good overview of techniques and their application.

CitrusInsighter

06-01-2008, 03:25 AM

Hi PGH,

Your G6 is a very "workable" vehicle in terms of fuel economy. My dad had one for about 4 months last summer while his Insight was in for repairs. During that time, he averaged about 45 mpg on his commute to and from work (about 16 miles 1-way rural hwy). This was with MAX Sidewall in the tires, and whatever oil Enterprise put in the engine. Through a few thousand miles of FAS' and Pulse and Glide, the engine, transmission, and starter showed no undue wear. The only thing was the oil life indicator quickly went to 0% because of all of the engine starts. This should be ignored since you're not straining your engine as much as the computer thinks you are by assuming that you're making 100's of 1-3 mile cold trips. Don't wait to get the tires ALL THE WAY up to MAX sidewall, whatever that may be on your car. The car we had was a V6 Automatic. That transmission was so smooth, and with a brief rev-match, re-engaged perfectly after a FAS. The one time I got to drive it, I had a segment over 60 mpg with a little effort and a ScanGauge which is absolutely necessary in that car to get the kind of mileage that we know its capable of. The G6 is also a great highway car with decent aero drag and gearing that keeps the revs down at freeway speeds (50-60 mph). Just make sure you're mastered the basics, and the car will reward you with "compact-like" mileage in a sporty mid-size.

phoebeisis

06-01-2008, 10:53 AM

I've noticed that as summer arrives in hot cities you will see lots of older -8 years or so FE cars-Focus,Civic,Corolla,Prizm-with broken ACs for very good prices.The sellers don't want to spend the $1000 to repair the AC so they have to drop the price-a lot.

If you are handy and can do the some AC work yourself, or can live without the AC, or can use another method to stay cool-ice vest etc,12 volt fan-you can get a great deal.You can cobble together some sort of vest that will hold ice very cheaply.
Charlie

da9dad

06-04-2008, 01:15 PM

I've been involved with Honda automobiles for a good 10years. I have gone through 5 models. I've just recently or about a year and half ago finally broke down and bought an 1990 Acura Integra LS (Auto). Now I don't believe in modifying the car to where it becomes illegal to drive on city streets. What I have learned though is that Honda motors are at the least the most intelligently developed engines in the world (again this my opinion...I'm sure those of you who are reading have a different angle on this...) They take the least amount of fuel and bring about the most amount of HP to bring about a great deal of FE. I've also learned that if your the only person driving the car is to make the car as light as possible. I'm not talking removing stuff from your trunk I'm talking. removing material from the inside. When you think about it the interior adds further weight. So at the very least removing the rear seat and trunk panels including the carpet would help in saving weight of 20-60#'s. I've even considered purchasing a Carbon Fiber Hood and Trunk. The stock hood for my car car is approx 80#'s and about the same for the trunk so that's nearly 200# is weight saving increasing the FE a great deal. However, this modificaition comes at a cost ($400-500 for the hood and $600-800 for the trunk. If lucky, can even find Carbon fiber front fenders). Now I don't like fancy looking hoods and gills so I'd stick with the stock look. Then there's the Wheels. Honda Civic hatch back wheels such as the HX (96-97) all have a light alloy wheel that weighs in approx 11.75# each. getting your engine to turn these wheels should also add to fuel savings as there is less mass to torque. However, these wheels are only 14" but if you increase the size say to 16" and finding a forged wheel that weighs in at 13-15# your increasing FE and decreasing rolling diameter (remember this is the wheel only, you have to account for tire weight).
So for those of you who have bigger wheels, with chromed feature. Try removing that wheel and putting it on a scale. If you have a wheel that weighs in at 30-40# especially when your using the stock steel wheel, the operative word here is STEEL then your definitely making your engine work harder.

sessegolo

06-09-2008, 07:45 AM

From a hypermiling perspective it seems that some cars allow better mileage gains (over EPA) than others... Is that right? If so, what would be a good bet as far as a small, second-hand sedan? It seems that would be the Civic, based on what I read on other threads...???

Italo

Vooch

06-09-2008, 06:24 PM

Here is what I'd look for in a small used car (aside from the obvious used car stuff)

1) 5 speed manual

2) engine with the most torque (not HP) check out original specs - for DWL & P&G

3) best original EPA MPG (go to the EPA MPG site - you can find cars EPA rating from waaaay back)

4) If you want to get really technical , I'd compare weight, CD's and gear ratios, but most of that is already incorporated into the EPA rating.

5) Highest Max sidewall pressure of Tires

xcel

06-09-2008, 07:33 PM

guajero

06-27-2008, 07:30 PM

I highly recomend the Chevrolet Prizm (http://www.ecobeater.com/wheels/chevrolet-prizm), I have driven four of them and great mileage can be easily coaxed out of them. The prizm is a poor man's corolla and is much cheaper on the used market.

brucepick

10-04-2008, 08:46 PM

Wayne, I want to thank you for this article.

This is where I first learned of the Honda Civic HX - a car with near-hybrid FE that can be bought at maybe 15% of the price of a new Prius or Civic Hybrid. It took me a while but I finally acquired one.

Last week I became the owner of a '97 Civic HX with 5-speed. Early results are between 41-53 mpg. Yesterday I had the thermostat changed (was running too cool) and had four new tires installed - so I think now we'll see what FE it produces when properly set up.

Thank you again, Wayne.
Bruce

peacefrog_0521

10-11-2008, 06:24 PM

It struck me as curious several months ago when I was trying to find a used VW Jetta TDI, that they were few in number, overpriced, and still usually sold before I could inquire. Same for the Golf. The New Beetle TDI, however - plenty of those to go around...

COMP

10-11-2008, 06:33 PM

Electrify

02-16-2009, 08:38 PM

Echo FTW!!!

Unbeatable mileage, great space, maneuverable, top of the line reliability, and under $10,000!!! If you are in the market for a used car, I cannot recommend this vehicle enough.

(Unless you live in Europe, where you have a wide selection of superminis and city cars)

KrazyDawg

03-05-2009, 12:41 PM

Hi Italo:

___The Civic of any era is about the best available for FE from a compact.

___As Vooch said, a stick can really do wonders if you want to hypermile as it has the ability to do so much more including better performance and in some cases, even better Fe on the highway. Negatives, lower resale which you should be able to take advantage of since you are buying used yourself :)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

I disagree. The 95 Civic EX that I have is in the middle in terms of years but towards the lowest end for fuel efficiency. Combined MPG is 26 by the new EPA. Older and newer civics alike have a higher combined MPG. The VX is a different model and because my engine is a 1.6L VTEC it's not the most efficient compared to other models in the same year. All the other models of 95 with the exception of EX receives better MPG. I drove a 94 Civic LX as a loaner car that had better MPG. In short, one has to do research still even on Civics but they are reliable.

JusBringIt

03-05-2009, 12:47 PM

I disagree. The 95 Civic EX that I have is in the middle in terms of years but towards the lowest end for fuel efficiency. Combined MPG is 26 by the new EPA. Older and newer civics alike have a higher combined MPG. The VX is a different model and because my engine is a 1.6L VTEC it's not the most efficient compared to other models in the same year. All the other models of 95 with the exception of EX receives better MPG. I drove a 94 Civic LX as a loaner car that had better MPG. In short, one has to do research still even on Civics but they are reliable.

The statement was not saying civics are the best for fuel economy regardless. There are civics that are more performance oriented, hence losing fuel economy. 26 on the new epa is decent for that time period as my 1999 avenger is worth 21 combined on the new epa 27hwy on old epa.

Wrt my epa ratings, the 95 civic is comparably better as far as economy goes, maybe a few more detailed specs would provide me the info I need to make a better comparison, but time is not really in my favor at this time.

mnarwold

10-25-2011, 07:30 PM

Any chance one of you MPG guru's would be able to do an updated version on this same article? I'm hoping to buy a fuel sipper in the next 12 months or so and would find an updated list very helpful. I can go through and look at autotrader.com for some cars, but it seems like some vehicles can be hypermiled way better than others, so you can't really just look at epa estimates.

44 mpg by 2010

12-17-2011, 10:52 AM

Have any of you looked at http://www.fueleconomy.gov/ lately?

It has undergone MAJOR CHANGES since October 2011.

Pay special attention to ....

POWER SEARCH http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/powerSearch.jsp
This allows one step search 1984 to present on multiple parameters like ... year range, MSRP (Edmunds 2011 to present), Make, Market Class, Fuel type, Drive, Transmission, Cylinders, and MPG (city, combined, and/or Highway ≥).

Also ... Shared MPG Estimates http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList

I have found these to be VERY POWERFUL resources when considering any NEW ... or ... USED vehicle purchase.

These are very powerful research tools!

My special thanks to those that use My Garage http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do or Tracking Your MPG Just Got Easier
Now you can enter "Your MPG" data at the pump from your mobile device at www.fueleconomy.gov/m!

Particularly when you allow your fuel consumption rate data to be shared with OUR ... NATIONAL KNOWLEDGE BASE of "experienced mpg" ... even if you folks ARE hypermiling.

FXSTi

12-17-2011, 11:21 AM

ItsNotAboutTheMoney

12-18-2011, 07:46 PM

Now you can enter "Your MPG" data at the pump from your mobile device at www.fueleconomy.gov/m!

I hadn't noticed the main site's changes. I tend to use www.fueleconomy.gov/m (the mobile site) if I'm just getting information about one car because it's simple to use and doesn't use JavaScript. It's particularly annoying that the www.fueleconomy.gov site uses external JavaScript APIs.

OriEri

04-04-2012, 08:27 AM

My Jetta was in an accident last night and I think it iwll be totaled by my insurance company. :( I will miss it, but this also creates a quandary. I was planning on getting a CODA 150mi range car when they come out in the fall. So, is there a way to do a short term lease, like less than one year?

Right Lane Cruiser

04-04-2012, 08:34 AM

I'm sorry to hear that. :(

I've heard of people selling leases to other people when they want to get out of it early. Possibly you could find one with a year left or you could sell your lease after a year.

OriEri

04-11-2012, 03:16 AM

I am in a rental Leaf at the moment. Thought I would give a shorter range EV a try as I psych myself up to buy a CODA.

Right Lane Cruiser

04-11-2012, 07:29 AM

How do you like it?

bill14224

08-04-2012, 03:48 PM

Economy is complex. I once had a Honda Civic 1.5L hatchback that averaged 38mpg. My family grew so my next car was a Mercury Sable wagon with a 3L V-6 which only got 22mpg. I had each car 5 years. Both cars overall cost me the same to own and operate. Guess which car was nicer?

EdwinTheMagnificent

08-05-2012, 07:10 AM

50 mpg by 2012

08-05-2012, 07:34 PM

Wow, after folks read that , there will be a stampede of people running to their local used-car lot to try to find a Sable wagon. Some of them will only be able to find a Taurus and will be laughed at by the Sable owners. But ALL of them will be SO GLAD they were able to dump their crappy uncomfortable Prius and get into some real American iron.

Maybe the data at these links will shed some light on the situation

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList2&make=Mercury&model=Sable Wagon

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList2&make=Mercury&model=Sable

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList2&make=Mercury&model=Sable FWD

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList2&make=Honda&model=Civic

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList2&make=Honda&model=Civic HX

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList2&make=Honda&model=Civic HF

There is a great amount of data covering many years (some pre 1990) so I'll let you review it and draw your own conclusions about user average mpg experience.

BTW ... http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList is based more than 35,000 model configurations over the past 28 years.

EDIT: My new 1975 Civic CVCC cost 1/6 the base price of the 2012 Civic HF with 38 and 39 User MPG respectively. Of course, the 2012 is a LOT MORE car.

PaleMelanesian

08-07-2012, 02:07 PM

EDIT: My new 1975 Civic CVCC cost 1/6 the base price of the 2012 Civic HF with 38 and 39 User MPG respectively. Of course, the 2012 is a LOT MORE car.

Yes, but inflation. Counting for that, the old CVCC cost 2/3 as much as the new Hf.