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Here are some photos of the current configuration of my car. Mods installed so far, listed from greatest of least effect on improving the coasting ability of my car: boattail, nosepiece, underbody panelling, grill block, front and rear whell well skirt, wheel spoilers, side spoilers, smooth hub caps, gap sealing.

Photos circling the car from front to back.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero11.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero10.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero9.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero6.jpg

Closeups:
Front wheel spoiler
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero12.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero13.jpg
Side skirt
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero14.jpg
Front wheel well skirt and wheel spoiler
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero19.jpg
Rear wheel well skirt and wheel spoiler
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero16.jpg
Boattail
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero18.jpg
View of underside from back of car.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero7.jpg
View of underside from front of car.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero8.jpg

Now you have gone too far!!! ;)

any chance of showing us some impressive numbers yet? how does your front wheels turn?

Hi Phil:

___The following should help: Installed a boat tail. (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=14709#post14709)

___Basjoos, with all the facets and the plastic flapping in the boat tail, are you sure you have actually reduced the Cd on the VX with some of the mods? The underbody, rear wheel skirts, and tire dams certainly appear to help but the hundreds if not thousands of angles created by the plastic and sheeting being formed to one another let alone the non-tight plastic in the rear could be making her into an aerodynamic nightmare with separation in any number of areas without you even realizing it? A measured coast down from 60 to 40 mph pre and post would give you an idea but below 40, the mass and RR of the tires has more of an effect then aerodynamics. Down below 25 and the aerodynamics play a very minimal part in an energy balance of something the size of a car?

___I would recommend PM’ing HAFNHAF as I believe he is an aerodynamicist w/ NASA/Lockheed and would have a much better understanding of the aero properties of a slow mover. I would hope to see very measurable results with your VX project that you have spent many hundreds of hours building rather then simply guessing as to each mod’s help/hindrance in terms of a reduction in Aero drag.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Where is a wind tunnel when we need it?

any chance of showing us some impressive numbers yet? how does your front wheels turn?

I installed the front wheel well covers, boattail and nosepiece in Oct and Nov as the temps have been dropping and so far I have been able to keep my mpg's at my summer levels. This last tank was 68mpg dispite 100miles of driving though rain, some of it VERY heavy, from that last weather system that brought the tornadoes to the Southeast. The front wheel well skirt is hinged at the top with two rollers that the tires roll against to open the skirt slightly for sharp turns and two springs (at the lower corners) retract the skirt when the tires straighten out. So far (2000miles) the system has worked well with no mechanical problems and no visible tire wear. I exhaust most of the radiator air into my front wheel wells, which helps dry and de-ice the roller assemblies.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/CivicBd.jpg

Hi Phil:

___The following should help: Installed a boat tail. (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=14709#post14709)

___Basjoos, with all the facets and the plastic flapping in the boat tail, are you sure you have actually reduced the Cd on the VX with some of the mods? The underbody, rear wheel skirts, and tire dams certainly appear to help but the hundreds if not thousands of angles created by the plastic and sheeting being formed to one another let alone the non-tight plastic in the rear could be making her into an aerodynamic nightmare with separation in any number of areas without you even realizing it? A measured coast down from 60 to 40 mph pre and post would give you an idea but below 40, the mass and RR of the tires has more of an effect then aerodynamics. Down below 25 and the aerodynamics play a very minimal part in an energy balance of something the size of a car?

___I would recommend PM’ing HAFNHAF as I believe he is an aerodynamicist w/ NASA/Lockheed and would have a much better understanding of the aero properties of a slow mover. I would hope to see very measurable results with your VX project that you have spent many hundreds of hours building rather then simply guessing as to each mod’s help/hindrance in terms of a reduction in Aero drag.

___Good Luck

___Wayne


My car is not a VX, it is a CX with the ICE from a DX. The clear vinyl plastic on the boattail does not flap. Clear vinyl is very stiff and totally unlike the floppy clear polyethylene that most people think of when they see "clear plastic". I can observe the clear vinyl of the boattail in my rear view mirror, and I have had it up to 80mph with no visible flutter. I tuft tested the upper half of the boattail (the part visible in the rear view mirror) and it has attached airflow on all of the parts that I could see. The improvement of the boattail on my coasting was very dramatic. After each aero mod I install, I do coast down tests on a familiar stretch of road.

Most of my commute is on rural and suburban interstate, so most of my drive is at 55 to 70mph, a speed range where the effects of aero mods are noticable. The faster I go, the more noticable the effects of the mods, and it has been like a horsepower boost at speeds over 70mph, where I can now climb hills in 5th that I used to have to shift down to 4th on in the car's pre-mod days. The effects of all of the mods have added up and the car coasts much better than it did before and can maintain speed while coasting on even the slightest downhill. Pulse driving is a joy, since the coast phase now lasts so long.

I haven't spent hundred of hours on the mods. The construction methods I use are very quick to go together and needs only a few tools (the boatail took a day and a quarter from raw materials to completely installed boattail).

Hi Basjoos:

___All I am saying is that there are a ton of areas for flow separation and a tuft test let alone being able to see a tuft along all those edges will not reveal the separation. I think you should speak with an aerodynamicist as you may be causing a higher Cd with some of the mods. That boat tail is not a smooth surface but is also wrinkled and undulating. HAFNHAF may be a guy to help. Other wise, you may be flying blind depending on your training.

___As for the aero mods themselves, the difference between a CX/VX/DX with and without the mods at 65 mph might be the difference between 20 and 25 HP. Does a Cd drop of maybe .05 and 5 less HP at speed give you 50% higher FE at a specific speed? No. I wanted to make sure you understood this as well as get some help to make sure what you have built is aerodynamically clean vs. guess work.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

What a great toy! You must get the best looks from other drivers.
.
I can't wait to see what you do to the Winnebago...
.
_H*

The front does ask the question to the automakers:

Why not make a pair of stuts inside a collapasble front bumper?

Less drag, more crumple zone.

Even if the shape of my car isn't optimized as determined by wind tunnel testing, the coasting performance of the car is MUCH better than it was when the car was its stock configuration.

The Winnebago doesn't belong to me.

hey question for the underbody... can I get a pic shot of the board you put under there? How do you make it so that the exhaust doesn't melt the plastic? So just give the pipe like 5 inches of clearance space?

Hi Basjoos:

Thanks for sharing your excellent insights to new car design.

Cheers! :flag:

Hi Basjoos:

Quick question.... Do you have a MPG log on this car. This might be interesting to see.

:Banane42: What tpe of tires are you using? They almost look like donut tires. Also, what are you using for psi?

Now here is an interesting Vehicle

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/aero11.jpg


that the Aero-Mods were installed in :flag: America:

Terry (tiger)

It may not be pretty, but apparantlly it works.

It may not be pretty, but apparantlly it works.

:woot: Hey the Numbers don't Lie: :smilingface (52):



Terry (tiger)

I wonder what the length of the car is. There is no way it would fit in my garage.

The underbody is coroplast with aluminum flashing used to cover areas within 4" of the exhaust system. Photos of my car (and of other vehicles I used for design studies) are at: http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v417/MikeMariettaSC/80MPG%20Honda%20Civic/
Unfortunately I don't have any good photos of the underside since the low ground clearance makes it difficult to get a good shot.

The gas log is in the Mileage Logs is listed under "Aerocivic" at the top of the "Gas" category. Tires are 175/70/13 Michelin Hamony at 55psi.

Total vehicle length is 18', the mods added 4' (6" to the front, 3'5" to the rear) to the original length.

Basjoos,

..................how do you see out the front of the car ..........especially when it is raining !

( And where are the windshield wipers ? How do you get the thing inspected ? )

Stay safe dude !

I admire what you are doing, but I worry about your safety.

( That sounds like something a mother would say come to think of it :p)


I installed a bellypan just like yours on my '93 Civic hatchback ( which if you remember is just like yours ( except mine is a blue. )

I'm going to modify my car like yours, but ....not soooo extreme.

What is that Super MID thing on your dash ? Does it tell the MPG like a Scanguage 2 does ?

I would love to have something that tells my MPG, but our cars are too old for the Scanguage.

Stat safe

Basjoos : since you like to travel and experiment, why not take your machine here : www.a2wt.com

It's a budget wind-tunnel for the rest of us.

Less than 500 bucks !!


All of us on the forum here would like to see some actual numbers .

...less than $400 for first time users. sounds like a good deal.

I think there is a minimum of 2 hours. But it isn't listed on the first time prices so who knows.

I use Rain-X on the false windshield and most of the rain follows the air flow right over it, so visibility isn't a problem most of the time. Its easily removable and I mainly use it when I'm not expecting rain in the forecast. South Carolina doesn't have state inspections. The SuperMID is a Scangauge type of device for cars that are too old (ODB1) to be compatible with Scangauge.

South Carolina doesn't have state inspections.



:eek:



The SuperMID is a Scangauge type of device for cars that are too old (ODB1) to be compatible with Scangauge.


So who makes it and where do I get one ?:)

It tells the MPG like a Scanguage does ?

I notice that it looks like you had to rig it to work ( dangling wires and exposed circut boards ) so how hard is it to set up ?

Is it accurate ?

Thanks !

BTW I made the comment that $ 500 bucks was cheap because most wind tunnels charge thousands of dollars more .... per hour, not per session.

Hi Wannabeclean:

___A SuperMid is what we used at the Prius Marathon Attempt to measure FE over 100 mpg. It taps directly into the VSS and an injector measuring actual fuel consumed. Our own Yoshi makes them for those who ask. Send him a PM if you are interested … I know he was working on a US/English version vs. the metric version we used as well as boxing it up in a ScanGauge like enclosure but I am not sure how far he has moved on the upgrades?

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/500/SuperMid_at_the_Prius_II_Marathon_Attempt.jpg

___Good Luck

___Wayne

How difficult is it to set up one of these things ?
Do I need to know math, be an electrician etc ??

Thanks !

Hi Wannabeclean:

___I have never hooked one up but IIRC, Dan (Krousdb) tapped into an injector wire and the VSS wire from the ECU. He then ran the small harness into the car and tied it into the SuperMid and its display. Once it was calibrated, it was darn close to dead on. Hopefully Basjoos can give you an idea as to what is needed down to the type of tap(s) and gauge wire …

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Basjoos : since you like to travel and experiment, why not take your machine here : www.a2wt.com

It's a budget wind-tunnel for the rest of us.

Less than 500 bucks !!


All of us on the forum here would like to see some actual numbers .

I'd be nice to know my Cd, but even 1 hour of windtunnel costs at the intro price is much more than I have spent on aero mods so far.

It took me an hour to install the SuperMID. There are 4 wires (+12VDC, ground, VSS (speedometer pulse), and INJ(1 of the 4 fuel injector wires). Get +12V from the fuse panel under the dash, ground from any number of places (I connected to a ground wire under the dash by the steering wheel). The VSS and INJ wires are under a metal plate on the right side of the passenger's footwell under the carpeting just in the front of the door. Google "supermid install" to find step by step install instructions (at crxmpg.com and Gassavers.org) and "OBD1 ECU pinout" to get the VSS and INJ pin numbers and locations (several sites with this info). Yoshi provides wire connectors in his kit, the only extras I had to buy was velcro to attach the MID on top of the steering wheel base and a female spade connector to plug the 12V wire into the fuse panel.

This thing looks fantastic ! :Banane10:

Too good to be true really.

So,what are the SuperMIDs shortcomings ?

How accurate is it ?

So if I understand correctly, the guage shows your instant MPG reading - right ?

Is it accurate enough to show changes in MPG when you do aerodynamic changes such as a grill block ?

I'd like to do some testing like MetroMPG has done.

( An A-B-A-B sort of test run )

What are the other displays ? One looks like the speed of the car, but the others I can't make out.

I really wish you could make it to that wind tunnel to do some testing on your Civic.
I'd love to see some numbers !

It shows instantaneous L/km, average L/km over the past 5 km, average L/km since last reset, average ICE-on L/km, total fuel used, distance travelled, average speed, % of distance travelled with the ICE on, and has some timers. It has several databases you can flip between, so you can monitor total data, data for the current tank, and data for specific parts of your drive. It is accurate enough to show the effects of aerodynamic changes, assuming all other factors affecting mileage were unchanged.