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Just tried to change my wife's Passat's motor oil. I couldn't get the stupid oil filter out and went to Jiffy Lube in shame. OTOH, I changed my car's oil and it was a lot less messier this time around.

Don't feel bad. I went to change my Dad's oil in his '00 Passat V6 4motion wagon...and drained the transaxle instead. The two drains are close together and not well marked. One tow to the VW service and one trans refill later, we were all good. Never touched the damn thing again.

Don't feel bad. I went to change my Dad's oil in his '00 Passat V6 4motion wagon...and drained the transaxle instead. The two drains are close together and not well marked. One tow to the VW service and one trans refill later, we were all good. Never touched the damn thing again.

Hehe, I was reading up on how to change the oil on Passats and the instructions mentioned in bold print not to drain the transmission fluid.

I used to see this all the time when I was a SAAB mechanic. The engine sits on top of the transmission case using the top of the trans for the oil pan. The engine is also facing the firewall with the flywheel end by the radiator. So when the customers took the cars to a quicklube place that didn't know better they would remove the forward drain plug, drain out the transmission and then put 5 extra quarts of oil into the engine.

Insert very unfortunate sounds from engine and trans at this point........

Insert very unfortunate sounds of customer being told that it's not covered under warranty....

I used to see this all the time when I was a SAAB mechanic. The engine sits on top of the transmission case using the top of the trans for the oil pan. The engine is also facing the firewall with the flywheel end by the radiator. So when the customers took the cars to a quicklube place that didn't know better they would remove the forward drain plug, drain out the transmission and then put 5 extra quarts of oil into the engine.

Insert very unfortunate sounds from engine and trans at this point........

Insert very unfortunate sounds of customer being told that it's not covered under warranty....

OH my god! :D

When I was a senior in high school, I worked at a GM dealer the summer before I went to college. Part of my job included assisting with the dealer rent-a-car program. On more than 1 occasion, I had a sheepish manager from a quick lube establishment present with a very disgruntled former customer seeking a rental for an extended period because of situations such as this, or the oil filter fell off at speed, or the oil was mistakenly not replaced, or some other easily preventable catastrophe that destroyed the powertrain after a stop at the quick lube.
Consequently, I always watched them like a hawk whenever I was forced to use a quick lube, until I got my own place and could do it myself. They're not all bad, though the last one overfilled my HCH II by 0.6 qts of M1 despite me telling them it was a 3.4 qt fill. I'll give you a little room on the odd-quart fills, but that was a pure lack of attention on the part of the Midas in Lake Zurich :mad:

Now my garage floor is a lot messier but my cars are in a lot better shape with better fluids in them.:)

Not to toot my own horn here, but..........

If you have a GOOD factory dealer in your area, you probably stand a better chance of getting the work you want done correctly in the first place. Yes, I understand it may not always be the cheapest - although in allot of cases the difference can be negligible. But a good Honda tech is going to know without being told that a given car takes x qts of oil. It also may not always be the most convienent for everyone, or you may just dislike the dealer experience all together. The chances of "simple" errors is allot less for a trained tech that knows the car and has done 5 other oil changes on the same car that day already.

soapbox off.

The Jiffy Lube guys over here knew what they were doing; I was watching but provided my own oil an oil filter since I wasn't sure if they would be using the proper oil.

Incidentally, what happens if you just drain the automatic transmission fluid and try to drive off? I would imagine the car wouldn't move since there's no more fluid coupling.

The Jiffy Lube guys over here knew what they were doing; I was watching but provided my own oil an oil filter since I wasn't sure if they would be using the proper oil.

Incidentally, what happens if you just drain the automatic transmission fluid and try to drive off? I would imagine the car wouldn't move since there's no more fluid coupling.

There is still a considerable amount of fluid in the torque converter, lines, and cooler. The car will drive, but the tranny may behave erratically. Or, it may overheat since the fluid cools as well as lubricates. Either way, the car will move.

The Jiffy Lube guys over here knew what they were doing...

I've been going to my local Jiffy Lube since July '02 (except for the Crossfire I had for a while) and they have always done well by me. Once you find a good quicklube place, you can stick with it.

However, if I had a vehicle that was "unusual" I would avoid them. They often don't have the correct filters, oil, knowledge of unusual layouts, etc.. That's why I didn't take the Crossfire to them.

And there's my concern about taking my Insight anywhere. It is pretty much the definition of "unusual." :p

I've been going to my local Jiffy Lube since July '02 (except for the Crossfire I had for a while) and they have always done well by me. Once you find a good quicklube place, you can stick with it.

However, if I had a vehicle that was "unusual" I would avoid them. They often don't have the correct filters, oil, knowledge of unusual layouts, etc.. That's why I didn't take the Crossfire to them.

I've heard of quick lube places not putting the correct oil into VWs. But in terms of how to drain the oil and what not they knew what to do. I suppose I should have asked what kind of oil they would have put in if I hadn't brought my own oil.

I've heard of quick lube places not putting the correct oil into VWs...

I guess my habit of always bringing my owner's manual and maintenance schedule helps me out there. The first few trips especially.

This is why I always change my own oil. I used to work in a plaza next to a valvoline instant and I used to hear all of there horror stories about the things they did to peoples cars while under the influence of drugs/alcohol. The worst one I remember was them repeatedly slamming the hood of a brand new SUV with the oil cap still sitting on top of the engine. Leaving several ring impressions in the hood:eek:

snipConsequently, I always watched them like a hawk whenever I was forced to use a quick lube, until I got my own place and could do it myself. They're not all bad, though the last one overfilled my HCH II by 0.6 qts of M1 despite me telling them it was a 3.4 qt fill.snip

Our Honda dealership always overfilled our HCHII, routinely putting 4 liters in, when the spec is 3.2/3.0 liters with/without filter change. FWIW, 3.0 liters does fine with or without the filter change, leaving the level closer to the top line than the bottom line. Even 3.0 quarts would suffice.

The original object of the exercise, as far as I know, was to get the level somewhere between those two marks on the dipstick, preferably a little closer to the higher one, not having the level at the full line minimum, or higher.

From the pros perspective (unfortunately), it makes sense to overfill. Then, no one will fault you for 'short-changing' the customer.

Since waking up to this I'm in the do-it-yourself crowd ;)

I suspect the same as well.

My car calls for around 4.5 but I get charged for 5 quarts. I'm pretty sure they don't allow all the oil to drain so perhaps they are putting in 4.5 but it's always a little above the full line. I now give them 4 quarts and tell them I'll top off at home even though I don't.

.. That's why I didn't take the Crossfire to them.

I had a Crossfire also. Pretty expensive oil change, eh? 8.5Qts of mobil one...:eek::eek:

I don't go to the quick lube type places. I either do it myself, or take it to the dealer. Since my brother is a dealer service manager, i don't worry about it being done properly.

Pretty expensive oil change, eh? 8.5Qts of mobil one...:eek::eek:...

Yeah, it was a bit pricey. However, I liked the maintenance reminder system. I went 15K miles on oil changes by following that (and that was pre-hypermiling).

I have used "Jiffy Lube" in the past, but have heard too many horror stories to continue. For the past 20 years, I have been changing my own oil as it is quite easy for the most part. My last car a 99 Buick, the easiest way to get at the oil filter was to remove the right front tire. MY current car, an 06 HHR with a 2.4L four, is one of the easiest cars to change oil. The car sits high enough, that I can reach the drain plug with no jacking and the filter is reached from the top. I can do an oil change in less than 30 minutes for less than $30 using Mobil 1 and an AC Delco filter cartridge. The dealer wants $89 for the same oil change.

<snip>and the filter is reached from the top. <snip>

That was the case with our first '81 Honda Civic, though never again in the myriad other Honda's that followed.

That first car also had decent bumpers: real chromed steel rails with black rubber contact strips, set off from the body and connected with hydraulic dampers. Not the expensive painted plastic fairings that are billed as bumpers now, sniff.

I'm getting off topic, though.

My last two oil changes were free, so is the next one. Chrysler thought they'd interest me in getting a replacement and offered a buy one get three free oil changes deal. Yeah I took it. I wont have to buy oil to do an oil change for another year. Oh yeah, i have oil that I bought that I haven't used yet...

Change my own here. I use the Mityvac 7400, but wish I had got the 7201... Anyway, I change it through the dip stick hole and it makes life much easier.

Change my own here. I use the Mityvac 7400, but wish I had got the 7201... Anyway, I change it through the dip stick hole and it makes life much easier.

Doesn't that potentially leave some residual gunk in the oil pan?

I have used "Jiffy Lube" in the past, but have heard too many horror stories to continue...

I'm not sure about all the other chains, but I know that Jiffy Lube is locally owned and operated. That can be good or bad.

When you find a good one, you can stay with them, knowing that one of your neighbors owns and/or runs it and that kind of customer relationship will probably continue.

If you find a bad one, you just have to stay away from them until they change ownership.

The one in Warrensburg Missouri is one of the good ones. Sedalia Missouri (26 miles away) has one of the bad ones. When I was living in Sedlaia, I still went to the store in Warrensburg.

I certainly don't want to say that dealerships are the only or best choice - there are certainly good ones and some that are less than professional.

I do think that you stand a better chance of getting good service from a group that is doing it as a career, rather than beer and bail money.

Mistakes and accidents happen, and I am certainly guilty of both many times over the years - but I don't hide it and make sure that it's fixed right before the car leaves my hands.

Either way, find someplace and someone you can trust and build a relationship with and you will push the odds in your favor.

That was the case with our first '81 Honda Civic, though never again in the myriad other Honda's that followed.

That first car also had decent bumpers: real chromed steel rails with black rubber contact strips, set off from the body and connected with hydraulic dampers. Not the expensive painted plastic fairings that are billed as bumpers now, sniff.

I'm getting off topic, though.

My '03 Civic is the easiest change I've done so far, filter is right up front and I have to barely get under the car (a set of ramps has also made all my changes a lot nicer), the '98 is kind of a pain, the filter is back by the fire wall and way up and of course its right above the exhaust pipe.

Doesn't that potentially leave some residual gunk in the oil pan?

Just for my own entertainment, I have used a mityvac to drain the oil out of a pan that I was going to remove to replace the leaking gasket anyway - just to see if it left anything behind.

The results - no debris and maybe 1/2 cup of oil left behind. Better that I expected and certainly sufficient. I would assume that any small paticles would be suspended in the oil and trapped by the filter and anything larger than that would be too heavy and stay on the bottom of the pan out of harms way. The only drawback was the time it took to suck all the oil out through that little tube - but it would probably be a wash if you consider that time it takes me to put the car on the lift and get it up in the air and then back down.

I try to do oil changes with one hour minimum drain times. I take the plug out and oil filter off before dinner or a game on TV and then replace and refill after dinner or the game. The only problem with that is it can be hard to see the oil level on the dipstick until new gunk has built up in the oil.

At work we generally take our vehicles to franchised oil change places. When our former place changed hands they started using 5W30 for everything:rolleyes:; that wasn't too good for the diesels. They refunded our money after the dealership tested the oil when we had some engine trouble.

I actually change the oil on my Insight without jacking it up. There is just enough room for me to slide under there with my head turned sideways, and I can remove and replace the oil drain bolt by reaching down around the engine from the top (it faces the firewall, not the pavement).

Not bad for a really low car. ;)

I actually change the oil on my Insight without jacking it up. There is just enough room for me to slide under there with my head turned sideways, and I can remove and replace the oil drain bolt by reaching down around the engine from the top (it faces the firewall, not the pavement).

Not bad for a really low car. ;)
Either you're Gumby or I'm the Michelin man, because I can't fit under either of my Hondas past the front clip :)

Never estimate the usefulness of long arms. ;)

Just for my own entertainment, I have used a mityvac to drain the oil out of a pan that I was going to remove to replace the leaking gasket anyway - just to see if it left anything behind.

The results - no debris and maybe 1/2 cup of oil left behind. Better that I expected and certainly sufficient. I would assume that any small paticles would be suspended in the oil and trapped by the filter and anything larger than that would be too heavy and stay on the bottom of the pan out of harms way. The only drawback was the time it took to suck all the oil out through that little tube - but it would probably be a wash if you consider that time it takes me to put the car on the lift and get it up in the air and then back down.

That's a good thing to know. I am always wondering how much crap I've left behind when I do an oil change. I can almost feel the difference afterward, even with M1, but the oil never seems outrageously dirty.

I started changing my own oil when I was 15. Partly I felt it was good to get under the car, know what you're putting in it, etc. But it was also because some knucklehead at a quickie lube place stripped out the drain plug in my Mustang. They then had US go to the parts house to get an oversize plug to re-cut threads. Losers.

Been changing my own since I had one to change. Trucks are so easy to get under, you'd be silly not to. You could do it anywhere, anytime, without ramps and with few tools. Get a drain pan with a lid and throw it in the bed to take it for disposal.

My current truck is even more of a no-brainer:
It takes 10 qts of oil, so you can save a ton by buying your own.
A new engine costs more than some new cars, so you can save a ton by not letting anybody screw it up.
I got a $20 Fumoto oil drain valve that makes draining easier (and keeps the oil from draining right on top of the skid guard and making a big mess in my driveway).

Beware though. It's like a drug. Start with changing oil, then fuel and air filters, then start the simple repairs, and before you know it you'll be rebuilding engines on your kitchen table.

Well here is a pic of the oil filter housing (it uses filter inserts - no spin on filter cans), lots of fun to deal with all day long :mad:- especially on hot cars just dropped off. The housing cap is the cast aluminum piece with the giant nut cast into it in the center of the pic - right next to the exhaust manifold on the right and almost no room from the frame rail on the left. BTW it takes a 36mm socket to get that sucker off.

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/500/medium/IMG00178-20090803-1650.jpg

And here how you can have a bad day at work as a mechanic when you try to move your 3500 pound toolbox and fail :eek:

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/500/medium/IMG00186-20090804-1833.jpg

Fortunately no one was hurt and we were able to get the box back on 6 wheels without too much additional drama.

My quicklube place lost my business... they refused (twice!) to put fully synthetic oil into my 130k mile Elantra. They kept giving me the "it'll leak" song and dance, even after I told them I have zero leaks then, and haven't had any with 12000 on fully synthetic. So, @#$# em. I buy Mobile 1 high mileage stuff now and just do it at home. The main reason I went to the quicklube to begin with is I have very little free time, and end up running wayyyy over my service intervals. Oh well, their loss.

When I first bought my Dodge, the dealer gave me a coupon for my first free oil change. Well, I got about five miles from the dealership after that first oil change and the oil light came on and the check engine light was blinking.

Pulled into a "quickie mart" parking lot, popped the hood and went for the dipstick. Well, I was the dipstick because it left burn imprints on my hand. :eek:

Went to check under the car and saw oil dripping from the oil filter -- THEY DIDN'T TIGHTEN THE (blankety-blank) OIL FILTER!!!!

Got a new engine, though. :woot:

My quicklube place lost my business... they refused (twice!) to put fully synthetic oil into my 130k mile Elantra. They kept giving me the "it'll leak" song and dance, even after I told them I have zero leaks then, and haven't had any with 12000 on fully synthetic. So, @#$# em. I buy Mobile 1 high mileage stuff now and just do it at home. The main reason I went to the quicklube to begin with is I have very little free time, and end up running wayyyy over my service intervals. Oh well, their loss.

I go to the Jiffy Lube for the same reason you used to go to your quicklube.

And if they tried anything like what yours did to you they would loose my business just as quickly.