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hi there, i drive my I2 for almost 2000 km in more than one month.

My best FE (not displayed but calculated at the pump) is around 53 mpg. The biggest improvement was pumping the tires to 40 psi (as written on the side walls). This gave a boost of 10%.

if i recall the article of msantos http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22589 the following table (see below) in that article reflects my best FE; i drive 50% city and 50% highway high speed (85-100 kmh).

So I was wonderng if anyone has beaten this average consistently? And which techniques were applied that resulted in these improvements. I want to go to the 60+ mpg range.

thank you and best regards, Eddy

2010 Honda Insight-II - Fuel Economy Results Summary

Driving regimen Avg Speeds Distance Ambient Temp Fuel used Calculated FE Displayed FE
City (stop-and-go) 0-50km/h (0-30 MPH) 56Km (35 M) 15C (59F) 2.32L 4.2 L/100 km (56 mpgUS) 4.1 L/100 km (57 mpgUS)
Suburban (low Speed) 40-60km/h (25-38 MPH) 92km (60 M) 12C (53 F) 2.98L 3.2 L/100 km (73 mpgUS) 3.0 L/100 km (78 mpgUS)
Highway (low speed) 60-75km/h (35-45 MPH) 105km (49 M) 10C (50 F) 3.33L 3.3 L/100 km (71 mpgUS) 3.2 L/100 km (73 mpgUS)
Highway (high speed) 80-100km/h (50-60 MPH) 75km (47 M) 14C (57 F) 3.42L 4.3 L/100 km (55 mpgUS) 4.2 L/100 km (56 mpgUS)
2010 Canadian Honda Insight – EX City Highway Combined CleanMPG Observed Fuel Economy
Canada 5.0L/100 Km 4.6 L/100 Km 4.8 L/100 Km 3.7 L/100 Km
US 47 mpgUS 51.0 mpgUS 49 mpgUS 63.5 mpgUS
British Imperial 56.0 mpgIMP 61.4 mpgIMP 58.8 mpgIMP 74.3 mpgIMP
Overall average fuel efficiency was observed at 3.7 L/100km (63.57 MPG US)

Hi Eddy;

You wont have much of a problem locking your Insight into the 60's (less than 4 L/100km) if you keep your highway speeds below 85 km/h. At any speed above and it will be almost impossible to reach those numbers on a perfectly flat highway.

One thing I intentionally did not mention in the review:
The tires on my test unit were pressed a bit higher than the setting you chose, and I would suggest you taking yours even higher. 40 PSI is a good start but the results continue to improve as you inch a bit higher and as your confidence increases. ;)

Keeping the EcoAssist in the green is what we always seek, but there is still ample room for further improvements in that zone. I would suggest placing the MID in the instantaneous FE screen and let your right foot pick an FE range you seek. This means pursuing an FE point that is slightly better than what you are looking for and for this to happen you may need to settle for a speed range where this is possible.

Gliding is the other thing where the big numbers come in. At first your Insight may appear to be pretty hard to lock it on a perfect glide without placing the CVT in neutral and shutting off the ICE... but if you practice a bit you may be able to come close to it. I've had the chance to drive the HI-II a few more times and I believe I am getting better at inducing the softglide (one tick-assist or one tick regen, and no fuel consumed).

The strategy for me thus far has been to minimize the use of assist to an absolute minimum when accelerating and save the SoC for the glides where I would rather use a tick or two (at most) to extend my glide.

Also, there are moments under light acceleration where you can regen (1-2 ticks) without hitting your FE much at all. When you spot these moments, keep your foot steady and take advantage of them by riding it for as long as it lasts. In my books this is a softglide charge that you are banking and it can be used in a multitude of low speed glide scenarios.

Lastly, at higher highway speeds (>85km/h) you can try a variation of P&G especially if the traffic allows and you are comfortable with it. For instance, accelerate gently to 100km/h while using absolutely no electric assist, then gently back off the throttle until you are consuming the lowest fuel possible. Keep your foot steady and let the speed bleed slowly. In some cases you can back off your foot all the way until you almost induce a softglide and in some cases do get a tick or two of EV assist (but only if your SoC is very good).
When you reach your lower speed boundary (80km/h) restart the cycle again with a very gentle acceleration to 100km. A full cycle may take 2-5 kms to complete depending on the road grade and other factors.

Further optimizations of this P&G routine is possible with N-ICE-ON and even N-ICE-OFF

Cheers;

MSantos

I'm starting to get in that region with my Contour SVT - does that count :-)

Hi Manuel:

___You and Sean should be politicians :angel:

___Craig, nope ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Hi Wayne;

As we all know, that's the thing about the "Internet": It almost never forgets. ;)

Cheers;

MSantos

hi Manuel, thanks for your suggestions.

if you keep your highway speeds below 85 km/h. At any speed above and it will be almost impossible to reach those numbers on a perfectly flat highway.

unfortunately i want to keep my high speed.

The tires on my test unit were pressed a bit higher than the setting you chose, and I would suggest you taking yours even higher.

what pressure do you suggest which still will be on the safe side?

Lastly, at higher highway speeds (>85km/h) you can try a variation of P&G

i have tried this, however not much improvement sofar. i think have to practice more.

Further optimizations of this P&G routine is possible with N-ICE-ON and even N-ICE-OFF
please explain

what pressure do you suggest which still will be on the safe side?


As a start we suggest people note the max rating of the tire and press the tires as follows:

Front = MAX-2 PSI
Rear = MAX-4 PSI

This does two things:
First it accounts for the extra load placed on the front tires
Second it allows for the an additional increase of up to ~2 PSI without truly exceeding the rated pressure limit especially when the car is stopped and tires are fully exposed to the sun. As per my own measurements, at these pressures the tires actually cool down a bit when traveling at sensible speeds.Note: As I tried to imply this is something I typically suggest to new owners and other folks who never operated higher inflation levels. I typically operate my tires at much higher pressures than the tire's max pressure rating.

In the end, it is all a matter of confidence and purpose.



i have tried this, however not much improvement sofar. i think have to practice more.

The improvement is often not that fantastic because it still takes a fair amount of focus and dedication. Practice and patience is indeed key.

But, if you are going to work at it then why not raise the P&G a couple of notches higher and shoot for real results?


please explain

N-ICE-ON: After pulsing to your target speed you switch the CVT to N and you let the car glide the distance. In neutral the ICE will consume fuel at a very slow rate 0.5-0.7 L/100km with none of the IMA power-up detriments of the next approach.

N-ICE-OFF: After pulsing to your target speed you switch the CVT to N and turn off the car for several seconds. The re-power the car into IGN-II without turning on the engine and let the car glide the distance. At the end of the glide, re-power the the engine and pulse up. It may take up to 10-15 seconds for the power up fuel guzzling to subside a bit so depending on the duration of your pulses you may wish to compare it to the N-ICE-ON.

Cheers;

MSantos

Isn't shifting from neutral back into drive while moving going to be hard on the CVT unless you have the rpms just right?

Hi ScorpD;

Not a problem at all as long as you let the PCM+CVT do its work that way it is meant to. ;)

This means keeping one's eager foot under control and not rushing the CVT before it has a chance to finish its thing.

Cheers;

MSantos

MSantos - Thanks

I gave it a try this morning and set a new personal best on my 30 mile drive to work, 62.3 according to the mid. My previous best was 61.4, a small improvement but it still counts.

I'll have to keep working at it to find the most appropriate use along with the other tricks I've learned here. My normal drive consists of lots of gently rolling hills and I'm still working on finding the best speed to let me keep my momentum up.

But it will to wait as we are off to Mexico for some much needed r&r. :Banane57:

I am a new 2010 Insight owner (just got one yesterday). So far I have been very impressed with the mpg's. I took a 60 mile trip today and got 58.9 mpg without the AC on. On the return trip I got 57.3 mpg with the AC on. I still haven't broken 60 mpg, but I was getting high 50's without employing many hypermiling techniques. I mainly tried to keep the eco assist in the green, accelerated slowly, and coasted as much as possible. I'm very confident that 60 mpg's are just around the corner. I'll try some of the tips you guys mentioned. Thanks!

You are doing GREAT in a brand new car. The tires require 1000+ miles to get scrubbed and the car is still stiff as well not to mention the learning curve.

The saddest feature about this whole discussion is that I am routinely exceeding these mpg numbers in a 18 year old non-hybrid car while driving at a much higher average speed. Just think how high the mileage could have been on the Insight-II if Honda had designed it with a Cd in the mid 0.1's with appropriately tall gearing to take advantage of its low drag.

Hi Basjoos:

___We all have to remember their is at least 700 pounds of safety, comfort, convenience and far lower emissions equipment added to a modern car vs. those from the past.

___Driving around Chicago at the speed limits in the fully equipped Accord allows twice the EPA and it is loaded with most of the latest and not modded a bit.

___Mods have their place but when comparing yesterdays to today’s vehicles, there is a delta that has to be taken into account.

___As it is, the non-modded Insight-I is easily worth 90 + lmpg. The HCH-I is worth 75 +. The HCH-II is easily worth 70 + and the Insight-II is easily worth 65 +. Honda is heading backwards but at the same time meeting stricter emissions requirements while at the same time increasing the safety of their vehicles.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

My car weighs 600 lbs more than the Insight 2, but weight has little effect on your mileage when driving on fairly flat highways where you don't need to use the brakes. But the point I'm trying to make is that the Insight's mileage could be much better than it currently is if Honda had knocked the Cd down another 0.1 and had allowed the CVT to dive deeper into taller gear ratios so it could run 2000rpm at 60mph.

Hi Basjoos:

___You meant to say 600 pounds less, right?

___Honda like all manufacturers are under the impression (correctly or incorrectly) that they have to tune their vehicles for performance. I am not sure what the Aerocivic does in the 0 to 60 dance but the rest of the automobile marketplace are tuned to beat 11 seconds and most are now in the 9 second range while hauling the extra weight of emissions, safety and amenities.

___While pointing out the Honda’s previously, I wanted everyone to notice how Honda was going backward. Mainly due to the lack of Leanburn in the HCH-II and Insight-II which really hurts them by comparison to the previous HCH-I lean-burner. The Insight-II lost on its gearing as well :( Looking back at the HX from way back, since it met emissions of the time, it ran Leanburn up to about 65 mph (at least Dan’s did). The Insight would not meet the emissions of its time if allowed to run leanburn at those loads and for the period the old HX would yet is/was far more aerodynamic and even lighter weight. Today a leanburn vehicle can be built to meet Tier II/Bin 5 but the extra expense of a LNT apparently makes the vehicle cost prohibitive compared to its peers. Other than the Jetta TDI so far anyway...

___Then there is styling. The Aerocivic along with the Aptera and some of the other more aerodynamically correct designs of the past would not sell in a quantity to be profitable in the consumer marketplace today. At least that is what I believe the manufacturers are thinking while they watched their past hatchback and wagon designs wither on the vine other than the basically the Prius and the new SportWagen. We will see what happens when the Aptera comes out but because it is really out there, I suspect quite a few of those that placed a $500 deposit will ask for their $’s back once it is time for the real $’s to pay for said purchase.

___If you want to have it all, you have to look at the European Super diesels that are not even equipped to meet US Tier I levels let alone today’s Tier-II. The iCDTi we had was amazing in Chicago traffic with my best trip home from work at over 110 mpg. Your Aerocicvic could not do that... It was also good for 60 mpg + while hauling 3 across the country and hauling @$$ in mid winter with temps as low as – 4 degrees F and WINTER TIRES. It was also loaded with all the air bags, VSC, ABS, amenities and it was the lowest trim level. This is the future of the American automobile. Great interiors, safer than anything we are currently driving and soon, far more efficient thanks to minor or major electrification. Cd's will come down but I doubt America or anywhere else is ready for Jet like Cd's.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

I took a 60 mile trip today and got 58.9 mpg without the AC on. On the return trip I got 57.3 mpg with the AC on.

I am about a month into driving my new I2 and am still learning how to hypermile. Just to clarify, which screen on the MID are you obtaining these mpg readings of 58.9, 57.3 from? I have my trip A reset at each fill up so the only screen that shows me per trip mpg is the screen that shows the 20/40/60 bars and the instantaneous mpg (not too exact). I am wondering if you are using the trip A differently? Or maybe you are using the trip B in a way that I am not aware of?