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xcel
01-21-2009, 11:58 AM
A battle cry was heard throughout the land... The Dual-clutches are coming, the Dual-clutches are coming! (cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=181796)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/Ford_Dual-Clutch_6-speed_AT.jpgWayne Gerdes – CleanMPG (cleanmpg.com) – Jan. 20, 2009

Supplied possibly by Getrag, here is Ford’s all-new, 6-speed, Dual-clutch AT internals cutaway.

Detroit – While discussing future power trains and transmission with Ford engineers at the 2009 North American International Autoshow (NAIAS) last week, some very interesting body language described what was possibly to come as discussed in the Ford’s Lincoln C -- EcoBoosted 1.6L w/ dual clutch 6-speed worth upwards of 43 mpgUS (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18798) thread. Well today, Ford’s future is looking brighter then ever :)

Ford today announced it will introduce an advanced dual-clutch PowerShift six-speed automatic transmission (AT) into the North American marketplace by 2010. This announcement was not targetting a full or mid-sized automobile but for the first time in Ford's history, the North American small-car segment.

PowerShift delivers the fuel efficiency of a manual gearbox with the convenience and ease of use of an AT. At the same time, the PowerShift 6-speed dual-clutch AT can reduce fuel consumption by up to 9-percent depending on application.

“PowerShift represents a true competitive advantage for Ford and is one of the many technologies that will help our global small car platforms set a new world standard for efficiency and drive quality,” said Barb Samardzich, vice president, Global Powertrain Engineering, who announced PowerShift’s production timing at the 2009 Automotive News World Congress. “This advanced six-speed is an improvement over today’s automatic transmissions in terms of fuel economy, while providing customers an even more fun-to-drive experience.”

Ford states that almost 100-percent of its transmissions will be advanced six-speed gearboxes by 2013. Six-speed transmissions already have helped vehicles such as the 2010 Ford Fusion achieve best in class fuel economy, while at the same time allowing the Ford Flex and Ford Escape to achieve unsurpassed fuel economy in their respective segments.

Internals

Like all dual-clutch ATs originally developed for race cars, Ford’s PowerShift provides the full comfort of an AT thanks to uninterrupted torque from the dual-clutch technology. Dual-clutch ATs consist of two manual transmissions working in parallel, each with its own independent clutch unit. One clutch carries the uneven gears – 1, 3 and 5 – while the other the even gears – 2, 4 and 6. Subsequent gear changes are coordinated between both clutches as they engage and disengage for a seamless delivery of torque to the wheels.

In Europe, Ford currently offers a PowerShift AT in the diesel powered Ford Focus TDCi. This transmission uses a twin wet-clutch system to handle the higher torque levels of the 2.0L TDCI.

In North America, a dry-clutch derivative of Ford’s PowerShift AT will be used for added efficiency and durability. A dry clutch transmits power and torque through manual transmission clutch facings, while most ATs utilize wet clutch plates submerged in oil. As a result, the dry-clutch PowerShift transmission does not require an oil pump or torque converter, providing superior mechanical efficiency.

“A dry clutch is a real sweet spot for lighter vehicle applications,” said Piero Aversa, manager, Ford Automatic Transmission Engineering. “PowerShift is more efficient, it saves weight, is more durable, more efficient and the unit is sealed for life, requiring no regular maintenance.”

PowerShift, unlike conventional ATs, does not need the heavier torque converter or planetary gear sets. In addition, the dry-clutch derivative eliminates the need for the weighty pumps, hydraulic fluids, cooling lines and external coolers that wet clutch transmissions require. As a result, the dry-clutch PowerShift AT weighs nearly 30 pounds less than the ancient and outdated four-speed AT available on today’s North American Ford Focus
.
Additional benefits include the following:
Neutral coast down or NICE-On – The clutches will disengage when the brakes are applied, improving coasting downshifts and clutch robustness as well as reducing parasitic losses for increased fuel economy.


Precise clutch control in the form of a clutch slip to provide torsional damping of the engine vibration – This function improves noise, vibration and harshness (NVH) at low engine speeds and enables lower lugging limits for improved fuel economy.


Low-speed driving or creep mode with integrated brake pressure – This function simulates the low-speed control drivers are accustomed to from an automatic transmission. The amount of rolling torque in Drive and Reverse is precisely controlled, gradually building as brake pressure is released.


Hill mode or launch assist – Prevents a vehicle from rolling back on a grade by maintaining brake pressure until the engine delivers enough torque to move the vehicle up the hill, providing improved driver confidence, comfort, safety and clutch robustness.
The all-new PowerShift Dual-clutch 6-speed AT gives Ford another tool in their arsenal for targeting best in class or among the best fuel economy in a given segment with every new vehicle it introduces in North America. Besides the all-new (for Ford) advanced six-speed dual-clutch AT and future 6-speed manual transmissions, Ford is still planning to place advanced internal combustion engines with the much talked about EcoBoost upgrades, hybrids and full electric vehicles on the road in the very near future. Adding to this capability, vehicle weight reduction and electric power-assisted steering will help improve fuel economy by 30-percent across the fleet by 2020.

Who is it that said CAFÉ’ standards would not work ;)

Mike78
01-21-2009, 12:41 PM
Well done Ford. You are making real strides while everyone else (domestic that is) just wants to talk about it.

If any domestic mfg is worthy of the "buy American" slogan being thrown around, my vote would be for them.

jkp1187
01-21-2009, 12:51 PM
Well done Ford. You are making real strides while everyone else (domestic that is) just wants to talk about it.

If any domestic mfg is worthy of the "buy American" slogan being thrown around, my vote would be for them.

Actually, they're the only one one the Big Three who don't need to rely on appeals to patriotism to sell cars nowdays.

dukenukem
01-21-2009, 02:25 PM
Yes! this sounds like the way to go. I just wish they did this sooner. Now combine this technolygy with hybrid battery and it may send the prius to the junkyard. Either way its got me hooked.

Earthling
01-21-2009, 03:28 PM
I've noticed that the automatic transmission in my '99 Civic is nothing like the usual automatic transmission. The physical layout is completely different. I believe it's somewhat similar to this new Ford transmission, in that it's kind of a manual transmission that is set up to act like an automatic.

It would be amazing if Ford went from having the worst transmissions to the best. I sure hope they do, and I'm encouraged by their proactive stance. Their willingness to change is refreshing and very hopeful.

Harry

Indigo
01-21-2009, 03:45 PM
I'm very happy that at least *one* of the Detroit-3 likes innovating. I'd buy a Ford compact car that got 43 MPG. No problem!

jkp1187
01-21-2009, 04:00 PM
I've noticed that the automatic transmission in my '99 Civic is nothing like the usual automatic transmission. The physical layout is completely different. I believe it's somewhat similar to this new Ford transmission, in that it's kind of a manual transmission that is set up to act like an automatic.


Now that isn't correct -- to the best of my knowledge, the Honda Civic has been offered only with either a standard manual or a torque-converter automatic. (Some autos may have a tiptronic shifter which allows the driver to select a gear, but it's the reverse of what you said -- an automatic that is made to shift like a manual.)

There are two types of "automatic-shifting manuals" out there -- the Sequential Manual Gearbox (SMG), similar to what was offered in the previous-gen BMW M3, and the Dual Clutch transmission, which is offered in, among others, some recent VWs and Audis (and, apparently soon, Ford.) Those are both manual gearboxes that have been rigged to shift like an automatic, either via computer-control or by driver selection.

SMG: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/sequential-gearbox.htm
DCT: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/dual-clutch-transmission.htm
Automatic Transmission: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/automatic-transmission.htm

jhu
01-21-2009, 04:04 PM
It's a neat technology. But it's more complex than a regular manual. VW has had dual-clutch since at least 2005 I think. But, being a VW, I don't think it's all that reliable relatively speaking.

PaleMelanesian
01-21-2009, 04:51 PM
There is something different about the design of Honda's automatics. I don't remember what it is, but in driving, it makes them feel more "manual-like" than some others. You can definitely feel each gear shift.

jimepting
01-21-2009, 05:03 PM
It is an innovative and interesting new design. I just wish the picture provided a little more insight into how the clutches and gear shafts interact. I also don't see any dog clutches. Is it just possible that gear engagement is electrical? Good on Ford!

jimepting
01-21-2009, 05:14 PM
I think I see it! On the top front shaft, one of the two gear set shafts, there are two slick rings with groves in the middle. Those groves would be for the shift forks, so the actual gear engagement is going to be by mechanical motion, and synchronizer action. Therefore, the gearbox will present some of the same wear issues for those who insist in fas P&G. I think ;-)

jkp1187
01-21-2009, 05:18 PM
There is something different about the design of Honda's automatics. I don't remember what it is, but in driving, it makes them feel more "manual-like" than some others. You can definitely feel each gear shift.

Perhaps that's why Honda had to issue a recall for all those automatic transmissions due to premature transmission failure? :D

GaryG
01-21-2009, 05:40 PM
Here is another article with a cut away drawing:
http://www.motorauthority.com/ford-launching-dual-clutch-transmission-in-us-in-2010.html

GaryG

Earthling
01-21-2009, 07:21 PM
Now that isn't correct -- to the best of my knowledge, the Honda Civic has been offered only with either a standard manual or a torque-converter automatic.


I'm looking at the shop manual for my Civic. The car is ten years old, and I've never had any transmission issues other than changing the fluid, which is very easy.

The automatic does have a torque converter, but it has a mainshaft and countershaft, with 4 clutches. It does not have the sun and planetary gears like "regular" automatic transmissions. So it does look similar to the proposed Ford automatic.

Harry

jimepting
01-21-2009, 08:44 PM
Thats Gary. That helps some.

xcel
01-21-2009, 08:52 PM
Hi All:

___We upload this stuff for a reason :)

Volvo launches their version of DSG – American’s need not apply :( (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8175)

BMW’s Dual-Clutch 7-speed manumatic transmission is about to make waves. (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8454)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

JusBringIt
01-21-2009, 08:59 PM
The search key works wonders ;)

jimepting
01-21-2009, 09:05 PM
As usual, one of the best explanations comes from "howstuffwork." Here is the link:

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/dual-clutch-transmission.htm

I didn't realize that the design had been around for several years at VW. Very interesting technical stuff.

Vooch
01-21-2009, 09:55 PM
VW has a lot of experience with Dual Clutch trannys - people love 'em

spitfiregirl52
01-21-2009, 11:56 PM
It's ironic that this got posted today. (Yay Ford!) But I was just thinking about how a car would get better gas mileage on the highway if at 65 mph the rpms wouldn't go to 3000! I was thinking about that today! So funny. Anyways, good to know that Ford is moving along in the right direction (I think they have been for a little while, at least). And it's interesting that both Volvo and BMW have already been using this technology for awhile. Why does it take so long for good things to come to action sometimes?

Kacey Green
01-22-2009, 06:17 AM
HCHIIs feel like the have Honda 5MTs at low speeds sometimes (under 10mph)

lightfoot
01-22-2009, 07:11 AM
Sounds nice, but several things about it scare me:

(1) "Precise clutch control in the form of a clutch slip to provide torsional damping of the engine vibration – This function improves noise, vibration and harshness (NVH) at low engine speeds and enables lower lugging limits for improved fuel economy."

(2) “PowerShift is more efficient, it saves weight, is more durable, and the unit is sealed for life, requiring no regular maintenance.”

Won't slipping reduce clutch life? When lugging my Subaru and Insight, I avoid vibration by going light on the gas, not by slipping the clutch. In general, I try to minimize slipping the clutch, so programming in clutch slippage is worrisome.

It sounds like you have to buy a whole new tranny if the dry clutches wear out. Could be very expensive.

Also, as mentioned above, is N available at all times in all gears for coasting? Sounds like it automatically clutches when you let off the gas. Does this mean no DFCO? Is it compatible with FAS-ing? And can one bump-start after a FAS with this system?



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