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Please post your aftermarket tire experiences here.

Hi 06 HCH2:

___What are you exactly looking for? Replacements for your HCH-II? If so, I would be really careful of taking on a non-OEM pair of Bridgestone’s or Dunlop’s. Just about anything else will kill your FE and since you live in San Diego, it is not like you need winter tires.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

For the HCH2 I can definitely say DO NOT put the Pirelli Cinturato P5s on. They kill the mileage. I took a 20 percent loss during the 1800 miles I drove them. I went back with the Bridgestone Insignia SE200s.

Thanks, Wayne. As it turns out, after spending a lot of time reading many different tire threads here, I came to the same conclusion and decided to buy another set of oems, but I thought it might be convenient for others to have a single thread where they can go to see what people are experiencing with a/m tires, so I created this thread.

Hi 06 HCH2:

___I was hoping you were asking about a replacement before purchasing an aftermarket. Blaster’s experience mimics just about everyone else’s that have installed non-OEM’s on the Insight, HCH-I, -II and Prius-II unfortunately. In the case of the Insight, Prius-II, and HCH-I, the OEM replacements were really inexpensive back in their day. I just looked up the Dunlop S/P 31 AS ($86.00 a piece) and the Bridgestone Insignia SE200’s cost $70 per.

___The European’s are going gaga over the new Michelin Energy Saver’s on their fuel efficient models including the Peugeot 308 and Ford Fiesta EcoKinetic but I do not know that they are available over here yet let alone any sizes or what they will cost? There is the new Michelin Latitude (I think that is what it is called?) on the 09 FEH/MMH Michelin but I do not think they are sized to the HCH-II? My Accords low RRc Michelin Energy’s are outrageously priced which makes the Bridgestone and Dunlop’s look better all the time ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Another thing I'd add about the Bridgestones that came on the car is that I think they would have gone 45-50000 miles, but I had the bad rear upper control arms. They went from like new to worn out in about 8000 miles. I am sure this set will last much longer than the first.

Tire Rack has the Michelin Energy MXV4 S8 on sale for $86.

Hi Mike:

___That is a great price on the Energy's compared to what I am seeing locally at $130 to $160 + and I wish I was in the market for some new ones for the Accord! Not yet however ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

I've yet to replace tires on our '06 Civic Hybrid, but it has been on my mind a lot recently. With winter nearing, I was considering replacement this year. Right now I'm pretty much committed to sticking with the OEM's till next fall:

With the tires just rotated, we've got 5mm depth on the front, and very slightly less on the rear: an honest 4mm. Our current mileage is at 56,000km. I keep the pressures just over 40psi, front and back. Just extrapolating to replacement next fall, we'll likely see around 75.000 from the OEM's. Not too bad. We've not had the cupping, premature balding, alignment issues that are being reported by some owners. Heading into winter with 5mm remaining is going to make this winter the diciest, but with our mild winters I think we'll be ok.

Our tires are Bridgestone Insignia Se200 P195/65-R15 89S . I think this is the tire with second generation Honda Civic Hybrids in Canada, but couldn't say for certain.

I went to a Volco tire retailer within 2 blocks of us just to check out current prices. To replace with the OEM Bridgestone Insigina SE200 would be $105CAN, plus $18CAN for balance and valve stem. No extra charge for hidden weights. For comparison, their quote for Michelin Harmony was $148CAN (plus usual balance/valve charges).

I think it's a given that something like the Michelin Harmony would improve rain/snow traction and handling, but reduce mileage. I'm not sure how much, and it really would be good to see some data on this. We live in the lower mainland BC, Canada. We get infrequent snow, some winters none, occasionally a big whiteout for a week or so.

We've got through 2 winters with the OEM. They are not the best, even among all-seasons, obviously, but they've been "ok". They are a little sloppy on snow, but we manage. One good tack is to just stay off the road for the first day of a major blow. This isn't such a bad idea, regardless of your tire type. A heavy snowfall always seems to bring out the snow tire 4 wheel drive crazies, for one thing ;)

In the interest of FE, I'm likely going to stick with the OEM come replacement time, or their successor.

mendel, oem is the insignia se200-02, made in japan, and 2lb lighter than se200, which is made in canada. the insignia tire has very low rolling resistance, 0.0076, one of the lowest of any tire presently on the market.

Tire Rack has the Michelin Energy MXV4 S8 on sale for $86.
fwiw, that tire is 2lb heavier than oem.

06hch2,

Just had a look, and yes, our tire has a diminutive "02" after the "SE200", and says "Made in Japan". Hmm, I was not aware of that. Found both at Tirerack, the tread might be slightly different. The description is word-for-word, fwiw. Wonder about the rolling resistance, is there a difference?

06hch2, where did you get that stat about the rolling resistance value on the bridgestone? I could not find it when I looked. Here's another tidbit. My Insignias are USA made.

according to the specs of the two tires on tirerack.com, there is a slight difference in the tread section width btwn the two versions, but the structure is probably same.

i think a 2lb weight difference, however, would make a difference on our cars, but i have no proof. anyone want to chime in on this?

on rr: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-rolling_resistance_tires

The tread is 1/32 deeper on the non-Japan version, fwiw.

The tread is 1/32 deeper on the non-Japan version, fwiw.
right. i missed that. the greater amount of tread material and greater weight should make this tire less efficient than the "-02", fe-wise, but this tire should last longer. that's the downside of low rr tires. they don't last as long.

I'm about to pull the trigger on some GY tripletreads for the Mrs. this weekend. Her stock Integrity's still have 4/32 on them at 40k but the edges are going and they have become scary on anything other than clean, dry pavement. The TT's will cost a bit of FE but she needs something that can handle some snow and mud, which the integrity does poorly. I can probably make it another 10-15k on mine, so we'll see what's available next summer.

After much homework, I'm going with Nokian WR G2s next week. Living in the winter wonderland of northern Illinois, I definitely need something with traction and I just don't have a place for separate snows. They'll cost me ~$500-550 when it's all said, but I won't have a huge mileage hit and I'll hopefully avoid the near brush with death I had last winter with the Dunlops. ER G2s are rated for 50K miles, according to my supplier.

Hope this helps--

You're going to love your Nokian's. By far the best winter tire I've ever bought is these rSI's. Great grip and good FE.

You're going to love your Nokian's. By far the best winter tire I've ever bought is these rSI's. Great grip and good FE.

Good to hear, since I slid off the road, between 2 light poles, through a ditch and back up again on rte 45--all at ~12-15 mph. I've NEVER seen tires as poor in even the slightest adverse weather conditions as the Dunlops.

06hch2,

Our Bridgestone Insignia's are closing in on 3 years and 60,000km now, with (just rotated) 5mm remaining on fronts and 4mm on rear. At the rate of wear I'll have to get new next fall, but that will be close to 80,000km. Not too bad. Being on the west coast, and having gone through 2 winters without too much problem. I'm likely going to get the SE200 (without the -02) as replacement.

I've gone the separate-snow-tires-on-their-own-rims before (cripes, that was 25 years back, literally on the day our last son was born). With our climate they spent 95% of their time on bare roads, and they are a hassle to swap and store, and a big extra expense.

I think anything else is going to hurt the mileage, by up to 10%. That's only $10~$15 per month for us, but...

I recollect trying out the Anti-Lock Bracking on a snowy rooftop parking lot. We came to nice controlled stops in a reasonably short order, nothing alarming. Just thinking about it now, I wonder How it sounded to the shoppers underneath ;)

mendel, if its more traction you need, the se200 will help, but i think you will take a hit on your fe. let us know how it turns out.

06hch, are you meaning the SE200 will not as good mileage as the SE200-02? I don't think there would be a big difference. My speculation: the extra 1/32" tread depth, coupled with going to a brand new tire, would depress mileage slightly at the outset, but that would be it. Further speculation: the traction of the two tires is the same.

I would go with SE200-02 version but suspect it's hard to find. It does come in our size (and one other), but tirerack shows it currently unavailable. My guess is it's mainly supplied to manufacturers.

All my speculation assumes that beyond the minor differences, the tires are the same, ie: same internal construction and rubber type.

It will be next fall (unless I snap) before I make the switch.

I have seen some rolling resistance charts that show the SE200 (no mention of the -02) as having very low LLR statistitic, in the 15" category. I'll post the lists I've found tonight, after the goblins have quieted down ;)

Here's the lists I've found:

Rolling resistance Stat's, from:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-rolling_resistance_tires

0.00615 Bridgestone B381 P185/70R14
0.00650 Michelin SYMMETRY P225/60R16
0.00683 Michelin TIGER PAW AWP P225/60R16
0.00700 Bridgestone DUELER H/T 113S P265/70R17
0.00709 Michelin RUGGED TRAIL T/A P285/70R17
0.00754 Michelin LTX A/S P255/65R17
0.00758 Goodyear INTEGRITY (OE) P225/60R16
0.00760 Bridgestone INSIGNIA SE 200 89S P195/65R15
0.00767 Michelin RUGGED TRAIL T/A P245/65R17
0.00780 Continental Ameri-G4S WS P235/75R15
0.00795 Michelin TPAW TOURING TR/SR P215/70R16
0.00810 Bridgestone DUELER H/T 104S P235/70R16
0.00813 Goodyear Invicta GL 235/75R15
0.00825 Continental ContiTouring Contact CH95 P205/55R16
0.00829 Michelin CROSS TERRAIN SUV P255/75R17
0.00833 Michelin PILOT PRIMACY 275/50R19
0.00850 Michelin ENERGY LX4 P225/60R16
0.00854 Michelin PILOT LTX P265/70R17
0.00855 Michelin ENERGY MXV4 PLUS 235/65R17

====
Thursday, October 30, 2008

From:

http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/top-5-most-fuel-efficient-tires-lowest-rolling-2813.html

14 inch wheels:

$071 0.0062 Bridgestone/Firestone B381 P185/70R14: (another report said 0.00615)

I am listing only this tire for this size since its the absolute best LRR tire out of ANY SIZE and there is NO EXCUSE not to get it as it will save you more money over its lifetime than it would cost to even ship them over (if they are not available in your area).



15 inch wheels:

$090 0.00760 Bridgestone/Firestone Insignia SE 200 89S P195/65R15
$048 0.00780 General Tire Ameri-G4S WS P235/75R15
$065 0.00813 Goodyear Invicta GL 235/75R15
$101 0.00869 Michelin Energy LX4 P205/65R15
$075 0.00864 Michelin Steel Belted Radial P205/75/R15


16 inch wheels

$108 0.00650 Michelin Symmetry P225/60/R16
$079 0.00683 Michelin Tiger Paw AWP P255/60R16
$??? 0.00758 Goodyear Integrity P225/60R16
$067 0.00795 Michelin Tiger Paw Touring TR/SR P215/70R16
$??? 0.00810 Bridgestone/Firestone Dueler H/T 104S P235/70R16



17 inch wheels

$??? 0.00700 Bridgestone/Firestone Dueler H/t 113S P265/70R17
$195 0.00709 Michelin Rugged Trail T/A P285/70R17
$164 0.00754 Michelin LTX A/s P255/65R17
$096 0.00767 Michelin Rugged Trail T/a P245/65R17
$181 0.00829 Michelin Cross Terrain SUB P255/75R17

Interesting article here:

http://corporate.lexisnexis.com/news/marketing,branding/cat300001_doc869497477.html

concerning roll out of Bridgestone Ecopia EP200 in 2009, and mention that the 2009 Prius will be fitted with the P195/65R15 89S size.

06hch, are you meaning the SE200 will not as good mileage as the SE200-02? I don't think there would be a big difference. My speculation: the extra 1/32" tread depth, coupled with going to a brand new tire, would depress mileage slightly at the outset, but that would be it. Further speculation: the traction of the two tires is the same.

I would go with SE200-02 version but suspect it's hard to find. It does come in our size (and one other), but tirerack shows it currently unavailable. My guess is it's mainly supplied to manufacturers.

All my speculation assumes that beyond the minor differences, the tires are the same, ie: same internal construction and rubber type.

It will be next fall (unless I snap) before I make the switch.

I have seen some rolling resistance charts that show the SE200 (no mention of the -02) as having very low LLR statistitic, in the 15" category. I'll post the lists I've found tonight, after the goblins have quieted down ;)

Mendel, I agree with you that traction should be same because the rating is same, but I have it from an authority that the -02 will blow the aftermarket version out of the water fe-wise because the -02 is made specifically for our car (you won't find it on the dx, ex, or lx sedan), just as the B381, the lowest rr tire out there, is made specifically for the Insight. Trust me on this.

As far as availability, I bought 4 of the -02 version at my local mom and pop tire store this week. It is available.

Re: the lists, good find!

Interesting article here:

http://corporate.lexisnexis.com/news/marketing,branding/cat300001_doc869497477.html

Finally, a/m tires for gas mizers are coming!

06hch2,

Thanks for the info on the OEM SE200-02.

Hmm, if I'm tire shopping next fall hopefully these Ecopia's, or something similar, will have materialized.

Tire manufacturers seem slow to wake up to the demand for LRR, but maybe it depends on your perspective ;) If you're into hybrids and mileage it seems astounding that:

1. Rolling Resistance statistics are not mandatory on all tires yet.

2. Next to no tires are being designed with LRR at the forefront.

The last article I linked says the new Ecopia line will be a combination of low rolling resistance and decent traction. If that's true, and they come with reasonable pricetags, would be nice.

I'd argue that the se200 gets 99 percent of what the se200-02 gets. I checked and I have the regular se200s. It has been only a couple hundred miles but I immediately saw my mileage jump back to 47 mpg range( a lot of cold mornings here lately as well). Once I get 2-3 tanks on the tires I'll have a better feel. Plus the se200 version gets a 65000 mile treadwear warranty.

Hi All:

___Most of these are in the files section...

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Blaster94,

99% sounds pretty good, particularly with brand new tires and cold ambient temps. Please post your mileage when you've had them a while longer. Of course with winter coming, mileage tends to suffer regardless of your tires.

Good to hear, since I slid off the road, between 2 light poles, through a ditch and back up again on rte 45--all at ~12-15 mph. I've NEVER seen tires as poor in even the slightest adverse weather conditions as the Dunlops.

I had Dunlop M3's I think they were called? I didn't slide off the road, but I was surprised at how little traction they felt like they provided, so I sold them after one season. I was very disappointed as they were supposed to be good tires and were very expensive.

Interesting. My RE92s are pretty worn down and I didn't have much trouble in the snow and ice last winter in my Insight. I wonder if the light weight is offsetting it that much?

my 05 HCH came with bridgestone 381s. i think they wore out a lot sooner than i expected, especially considering i run snow tires in the winter. they started cupping and got very noisy.

last february i bought another pair, just before wayne and friends took my car on a cross country mileage trip. so they ended up with 6000 miles on them right away. i would like to say they broke in well, but since then i have cut my driving from 100 miles a day to perhaps 35. they are already LOUD. i had them rotated after i replaced my snows, and he said they already seemed to have flat spots. i mean, these things roar like a loud muffler, at least to me inside the car.

i am going to have to put snow tires on pretty soon, and i am going to get their opinion of what's going on with these tires. if they are as bad off as they sound, i hope i am going to be able to at least get some kind of adjustment from the seller. i am NOT happy with them.......

Interesting. My RE92s are pretty worn down and I didn't have much trouble in the snow and ice last winter in my Insight. I wonder if the light weight is offsetting it that much?

I think your driving technique makes a huge difference as well. You know how to smoothly accelerate, take corners at proper speeds and brake evenly. While these may sound like basic things, most drivers don't have a clue how to do these things and they rely even more on their equipment than you do.

I still would hope you'd buy a proper winter tire if you're driving in snow and icy conditions. Even the worst winter tire is better than the best all season in winter conditions, simply because of the winter tires softer compound.

Oh, I do know they are better but I hate messing with tires. I learned to drive down in SC on glare ice -- really. I got my permit and out we went on the stuff. That was many years ago...

I've been in MN for 8 years now and have never used snow tires on my vehicles. I did drive Laurie's HCH-I with snow tires on it and the experience was nice, but didn't seem compelling to me. My habits were conditioned to non-ABS, non-power brakes with all season tires so I guess you're right about my driving...

I'm in the same school of thought regarding snows: they do give you an edge, but in a temperate coastal climate like ours, they are overkill 95% of the time, a big extra expense, and a pain to store/swap. If you're somewhere in the interior, it's another story I'm sure.

After reading the HCHII skidding/flipping story last night, I ordered the 195/65R15 Michelin Energy MXV4 S8 from Tire Rack. With the sale price and life potential, I think they will be great.

As a bonus,a Emergency Roadside Kit Including:
Foot pump
Emergency cables
First aid kit
Rain slicker, &
Flashlight was thrown in.

I guess I will have to test the performance of the foot pump since that is a recent discussion here.

After 3 weeks with my Nokians, I can say they are probably the best tires I've owned. My FE is slightly down but I can't tell if that is b/c of the arrival of cold weather or not. They're currently at 39-40 psi and I will bump them up as soon as I get a chance. Overall, the car seems to coast as well as it did before and the Nokians are much quieter.

After 3 weeks with my Nokians, I can say they are probably the best tires I've owned. My FE is slightly down but I can't tell if that is b/c of the arrival of cold weather or not. They're currently at 39-40 psi and I will bump them up as soon as I get a chance. Overall, the car seems to coast as well as it did before and the Nokians are much quieter.

+1

I've running my Nokians at 56 psi because that's as high as my el cheapo compressor will easily go and these tires continue to impress. The only bad thing I've read about Nokians was that they can get loud as they wear down.

I did read one persons complaining about their Nokians, but I think they were a troll as they only said the tires "didn't get the job done" with no details and only complained after several people suggested they replace their Blizzaks (which they also said were no good) with Nokians.

I've got 2 1/2 tanks on the Nokians so far this winter and all over 50 mpg. It won't last when we have to do shorter trips, but shows the tires capabilities, that you don't trade off much FE for amazing grip and control.

I recently replaced my second set of oem tires with Bridgestone Ecopias, a new fuel-efficient, LRR aftermarket tire. While they were much quieter than the oems and have a longer advertised tread-life, they lagged the oems in fuel efficiency by approximately 5mpg. Also, they didn't track the road as well as the oems. I had to pay much more attention to the direction of travel with the Ecopias than I did with the oem Insignias. After a week of working very hard to make good fuel economy numbers with these tires, I returned them and had the dealer replace them with a new set of Insignias, inflated equal to the Ecopias. Right off the bat, my fuel economy numbers went back up to where they were before the Ecopias. That is my experience with the Ecopias, fyi.

Hi 06HCH-II:

Thanks for the update.

Since this thread was brought back from the forgotten, a good overall write-up on the state of th state regarding LRR tires can be read at the following:

When round and black becomes lean and green (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24904)

Good Luck

Wayne

Which flavour of Ecopia did you get, 06HCH2? The Ecopia EP20 tread pattern looks to be identical to Insignia SE200, fwiw. We put those on our previous 06HCHII when our Insignia's were getting pretty worn, they behaved the same as far as I could tell.

The Ecopia tire I tried was the EP422, advertised as a LRR tire.

Just completed a 599.3 mile - 10.1 gal tank on Mich Energy Savers. Great handling and quieter than the Dunlop OEM's, IMHO.

Thanks,

Bob

I purchased a Prius in Aug. and was very impressed with the GY Integrity tires on this car. Anyway my 2006 HCH2 required new tires. I decided to go one step better than the GY Integrity tires and and went for Goodyear Assurance Fuel Max on my HCH. These are rated a bit higher than the Integrity's.What a difference these tires made with the comfort, ride quality without a drop in FE. My FE is the same and only have 2000 Kilometers on them, so expect even better FE :Banane45: Another plus is they are all season and perform better on snow and ice than my snow tire.[Tiger claw by Cooper] For anyone that may be looking for a good all season tire. H

Around new years I finally replaced the OEM Dunlops on my HCHII...boy were they loud, not to mention horrible in ANY snow (most likely because they were worn).

What a pain finding anyplace that knows what they are selling, anyways, I went with Goodyear Weatherhandler Fuel Max tires, and wow! It's like I'm driving a totally different car, it SOO quiet, the tires are really comfrotable, and in the snow/ICE they're awesome!

Not too sure about MPG yet, but it seems to be on par, even though it's been SOO cold here lately.

Chris