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Mix of Prius and FCX Clarity and for an excellent price too :) (http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=144144)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/Honda_Insight-II.jpgWayne Gerdes - CleanMPG (www.cleanmpg.com) - Sept. 4, 2008

Insight-II – Fuel Economy is estimated to be > 50 mpgUS on highway per the 08 EPA test cycles. Expect the lower front fascia to be cleaned up a bit as well…

Honda will reveal a version of its new Insight-II hybrid vehicle at the 2008 Paris International Auto Show on October 2. The Insight shares styling cues with the Honda FCX Clarity fuel cell vehicle and will provide a look at the highly-anticipated five-passenger global hybrid vehicle.

On sale this coming spring in the US, the all-new Insight-II will come to market at a price significantly below hybrid vehicles available today making the Insight not only affordable but needed.

"The original Honda Insight pioneered hybrid technology in the U.S. and remains a symbol of Honda's commitment to innovative technology and fuel efficiency," said Takeo Fukui, Honda Motor Co., Ltd. CEO. "This new Insight will break new ground as an affordable hybrid within the reach of customers who want great fuel economy and great value."

The Insight-II defines a new stage in the evolution of hybrid technology by utilizing a more cost-efficient version of Honda's Integrated Motor Assist™ (IMA™) hybrid technology, resulting in a new level of affordability for hybrid customers worldwide. With styling cues from the Prius and first seen in the FCX Clarity, the Insight-II is designed with a low center of gravity and a five-passenger cabin. While the Insight-II aerodynamics reveal its fuel efficient purpose, its five-door access and folding rear seats show functionality above and beyond any hybrid Honda has released in the past.

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/Honda_Insight-II_large.jpg
Insight-II in its full glory.

Honda achieved a significant cost reduction in Integrated Motor Assist (IMA) components which should make Insight-II the most affordable hybrid vehicle to date. The production Insight will be offered as a five-door, five-passenger hatchback. Numerous technologies, including a function to assist customers in achieving more fuel efficient driving habits, will be applied to achieve a further improvement in real world fuel efficiency. With a rumored $18,500 price tag, the new hybrid vehicle will represent the best value in the compact and mid-size hybrid segment. The new vehicle will be produced at an expanded hybrid vehicle production line at the Suzuka factory in Japan.

The Insight is expected to have annual global sales of 200,000 units per year - approximately 100,000 in North America. Following the launch of the new Insight, Honda also plans to introduce another unique sporty hybrid vehicle based on the CR-Z, first shown at the 2007 Tokyo Motor Show. All together, Honda's global sales of hybrids should increase to approximately 500,000 units a year, or more than 10 percent of its total worldwide annual automobile sales.

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/CRZ_-_Clarity_-_Insight-II.jpg
Insight-II next to its brethren the FCX Clarity and behind that, the CRZ concept.

The original Insight was introduced in December 1999 as America's first gas-electric hybrid car and was the first vehicle to break the 100-mpg fuel economy barrier for drivers around the world.

To Honda:

Please, please make it a manual with some decent gearing. For once.

To Honda:

Please, please make it a manual with some decent gearing. For once.

Amen, brother Lamebums, Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
;):flag::Banane35:

I'll take the one in the back.

The CRZ? It's a hot looking car, isn't it? :)

I'll take the one in the back.


I second that, but I want mine in blue.

I hope the lower price is a sign of a small engine, like the 1.2-1.4 liter I4 that's used in the european Jazz.

This car is great news and I can't wait to learn more about it. Did Honda confirm the folding rear seats?

Folding seats is mentioned in the official press release. :D

Wake me up when they combine this with a diesel.

So, with EPA at 50MPG, what can we expect to get on it? 70MPG? I hope it has room for car seats. I'm buying this car, as soon as I can. Even if it doesn't have a manual, which would kill me to do, but I've got to go hybrid.

I'm looking forward to test driving this car. I looks like Honda has done a great job with it.

Boy am I glad I own a little bit of Honda stock!!!

I might actually have to get on the waiting list for this one. Do you guys think Toyota will lower the price of the Prius when the Insight II is released?

Hi All:

___A few more pieces…
Engineers have mounted the compact control unit and battery beneath the floor to give the Insight both a low center of gravity and the practicality of a conventionally powered hatchback.
___Good Luck

___Wayne

I might actually have to get on the waiting list for this one. Do you guys think Toyota will lower the price of the Prius when the Insight II is released?


Either that or file patent infringement!

Wow... this is such a pretty car. If it gets 50 MPG, I'd take it over a Prius any day.

If it's not capable of 70 mpg highway, it would be a colossal disappointment. I'm sure it will be able to at *least* match the HCH-2, which has been demonstrated at 70-80 mpg via SAHM.

I'd expect that the engine is, at most, the 1.3L Civic Hybrid plant. Hopefully a touch smaller.

I wouldn't hold my breath for lean burn OR a 5-speed.

But, a 5-speed should help make it dramatically cheaper vs a CVT. Maybe that's the key to the low base price?

I soooo want this car, DH and I are seriously looking at getting one in the Spring. Of course the one in the back looks sssssssssmoking hot but I'm betting so is the sticker price.

Can't wait!

This looks tempting, depending on the actual EPA numbers, but like others here, the CRZ looks even more so. I wonder whether the CRZ will have a smaller engine and even better FE numbers because of its smaller size and the absence of the need to haul backseat passengers. When is CRZ coming?

Sign me up the CRZ model too!

That is *so* totally a Honda Prius. Aieeeeee.
.
_H*

It is going to be tough to decide between the insight II, CRZ or Prius III. I am so selling/trading in the FIT for one of the three in the next 2 years!

Lots of exciting new hybrids coming out! If Honda offers this or the CR-Z with a manual transmission, both will get a serious looking at from me in a few years.

Can't help commenting the magic folding seats and stuff under the floor are all Fit innovations that are cool.

Hi Paul:

___Until we receive dimensions, we have no idea what the Insight-II really is. I have always suspected it was going to be based off the Asian/European City/Aria Sedan underpinning which is essentially the Fit/Jazz minus the hatch. Either way, I am still a bit skeptical about the $18,500 price tag as a 5-door hatch has far more utility than the HCH-II sedan, it still holds five, it will have every safety feature of the HCH-II and more and it costs as much as $5,000 less while using the same or possibly even better 1.3L IMA equipped system. The HCH-II is dead as will be quite a few Civic and Fit sales from initial speculation.

___What it will be worth? We can be reasonably assured SAHM will be there. If its lighter weight, a little more performance and a little higher City/Highway. I think we need to wait for MSantos to add his own thoughts as he may have had some input into the IMA Gen V that the Insight-II will come equipped with ;)

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Off topic, but I'm about to pull the trigger on the wifes car Friday /Sat.
It just seems like too good of a deal. 2009 new AT cylinder Camry 4 door $17,988 + TTT

I like new as the used ones hold value it worth $1 or 2 K to have fresh

She wants a big car like that and will not except a MT
I showed her Prius and she said eweeee and then pftttt

The Accord LX sedan 4 cylinder AT is $1k more On paper is about the same entry level deal.

Knowing I'll keep it for 10 years and around 150k miles how bad am I messing up here with this deal?

I recall an article I read a while back specified that the next refresh of the HCH would have the updated IMA system as well -- which would finally allow that back seat to fold down.

I'm more interested in the smaller car, but I'm most interested to see what they did to IMA. I'm really hoping for a much lower assist affinity, some way to temporarily nullify assist, and some clutching mechanism to allow true free-wheeling of the drivetrain.

Bring it on!! I want to get my hands on it!

On a related note, I still expect the CRZ to be a performance oriented machine with a rating in the 40s.

Nice looking car - better than the image being batted around earlier.

IMHO, i'm guessing that the low price of the new Insight is due to Honda wanting to take back market share from Toyota. Meaning they will sell them with minimal profit or even at a loss. Works for me!

It does look like a prius..except slightly more stylish.

On the FE estimates, the Japanese car mags estimate a FE on the 10-15 mode test of 38km/L, HCHII IIRC is 29-32km/L. The gen2 Prius gets 29-35.5km/L with an estimate of 40km/L for the Gen3 Prius.

Good Luck
Andrew

It appears they've conceded aerodynamics for styling more than in the original Insight, e.g. no rounded edges behind the front wheels, no fender skirts, eggbeater wheels, etc.

They're going to need to do better than than the computer renderings seen here if they're planning to be selling them next year.

Guess I should have bought Honda stock yesterday. Lol 100,000 in NA those will go quick. I guess I'll call the local Honda dealer and see if I can put down a deposit.

It appears they've conceded aerodynamics for styling more than in the original Insight, e.g. no rounded edges behind the front wheels, no fender skirts, eggbeater wheels, etc.

They're going to need to do better than than the computer renderings seen here if they're planning to be selling them next year.

One thing to consider is that drag coefficient is less important the slower you go, and the smaller the frontal area is. It's only a coefficient. I often suspect that all the slippery stuff on my Insight is somewhat wasted at the 50mph or less that I usually drive.

Efficiency elsewhere may yield greater results.

Hi Andrew:

___As you know, the Japan10-15 is a perfect SeeSaw P&G which is very interesting in its own right but did the mags you read talk about the vehicle estimates as guesstimates or have they heard something from within Toyota and Honda themselves? 25% increase from both vehicles even on the 10-15 is so overly huge it is almost mindboggling? I like it but 25% is a really large number in one generation from a vehicle that is already very fuel efficient.

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Hi Wayne

They only mention that it is their own estimate, I am certain there is a lot of pressure to exceed the Gen2 Prius.

Good Luck
Andrew

One thing to consider is that drag coefficient is less important the slower you go, and the smaller the frontal area is. It's only a coefficient. I often suspect that all the slippery stuff on my Insight is somewhat wasted at the 50mph or less that I usually drive.

Efficiency elsewhere may yield greater results.

Its not wasted, you get noticeable amounts of aero drag at speeds as low as 30mph. Just try to ride a bicycle at that speed and you'll see what I mean. Its just that aero drag doesn't become the predominant load on the engine until you get up around 40 to 55mph, depending on the vehicle's Cd.

It appears they've conceded aerodynamics for styling more than in the original Insight, e.g. no rounded edges behind the front wheels, no fender skirts, eggbeater wheels, etc

Then it looks like there'll be lots of room for aeromodding to improve the mileage above OEM figures, especially if most of your time is spent on the highways. I would prefer to be able to buy a car that I wouldn't have to aeromod to get optimum mpg performance out of, but such a car doesn't exist yet. Maybe the Aptera....but the pics I've seen of the prototype show a few areas that could be improved by aeromods.

One of the easiest ways automakers could get fuel economy improvements is aeromods - no moving parts or high tech on the final product.

Many of you have heard about how GM is laboring to get the Volt's Cd down to 0.28 - good, but not cutting edge. This is NOT a technical issue.

One possibility is GM would hate to do like Honda has done on the Insight II and make it look like a Prius...keep in mind Honda is an arch-rival of Toyota, yet they did it.

What I lean towards is Detroit and most consumers still have their heads in the bulkly SUV era - brainwashed for a generation that boxy, blunt, bricks are macho - streamlined cars are wussy. Just look at some of the Chrysler cars (the 300) along with the original concept Volt - still have a bit of a blunt front.