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Yep the Civic is trying to be a GM product. I may dump both of the cars.

Heres a link about the current problems with the Civic.
http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10789

The top of the center section of the dash in the Accord has a underlieing waffle pattern that can be seen. It looks awful. So its going to have to go in for warrenty work also. Im afraid to look closer at it.

Im putting Honda fan boy status on hold for the time being. Wifes very upset with these develpments also.

Hi Psy:

___I am sorry to hear of your Civic’s recent developments as the car you own is one I really like … I did not know you were having issues with the Accord however? If only all manufacturers could get the bugs out (not just the one in your tail light ;)) before their cars hit the streets, everybody would be much better off.

___Can you go into a bit more detail about the spring sag (I think you posted it here a few moths ago?) as well as the (2) rear tires? The plastic under the wiper sure does look like somebody at Honda missed something there? Did it crack through or was it a separate individual piece that pulled up?

___As far as getting rid of both, at least they are Honda’s and the residuals will save you somewhat. Imagine if they were just about anything else other then a hybrid, you would be getting ready to scream bloody murder :(

___Good Luck

___Wayne

No problems yet /crosses fingers

Hi Psy:

___I am sorry to hear of your Civic’s recent developments as the car you own is one I really like … I did not know you were having issues with the Accord however? If only all manufacturers could get the bugs out (not just the one in your tail light ;)) before their cars hit the streets, everybody would be much better off.

___Can you go into a bit more detail about the spring sag (I think you posted it here a few moths ago?) as well as the (2) rear tires? The plastic under the wiper sure does look like somebody at Honda missed something there? Did it crack through or was it a separate individual piece that pulled up?

___As far as getting rid of both, at least they are Honda’s and the residuals will save you somewhat. Imagine if they were just about anything else other then a hybrid, you would be getting ready to scream bloody murder :(

___Good Luck

___Wayne

I saw the spring sag at about 12k or 13k miles. I first messured it at 3/16 of a inche sag. Then saw 5/16 of a inche. I held off on getting anything done about it hoping the rest of the springs would follow suite. The car looks much better a tad lower. :) But they didnt settle any. then I noticed awful cupping and wear on the rear tires. Bridgestone el turanza. heck,, the belts where sliping. I took it up with Bridgestone. None of those idiots noticed the spring sag. Said I didnt rotate the tires,, blah blah blah. Honda ended up replacing them. Dealer said the algenment was good. Then ran me out of the shop as I was getting ready to look at it up on the rack system and the Hunter read out. That was just opesent of there treatment of me in the other shop where I was encouraged to be part of all of it. So I think theres more wrong than they want me to know about. all the sudden theres problems with me being in the shop for insurance reasons. Honda did replace the rear tires as part of the spring issue. :rolleyes:

The plastic on the windshield isnt cracked. There is a seam there. Reminds me of the last new GM product I bought new. The windshield trim blew off on the way home from the dealer after purchase. Then the rear drum brakes fell apart in the drums two weeks later.

Im going to start looking at cars again. heck I may just go buy a Cobalt and a Impala. I can get junk close and cheap. Dont have to buy a Honda to do that. Go revist Mitsu and Nissan.

Wife just jumped in the Ranger to go run some errans. And Im going to wait untill she gets back and use it to go get oil and fish food.

Its offical. There is now contemt and dsitrust of Honda now in the Townsley household.

My dealer and Honda are really going to have to kiss some booty or these cars are as good as gone!

Dead Cars Setting Still.

hm shame i was hoping quality control was up there but it seems honda wasn't as good as they used to be.

lucky mine is still wood dispite the body dings.

Sorry to hear about your recent experiences.

Over the last couple of decades I've heard several examples of assembly and parts quality related issues with several first year Honda models. Heck, to be fair, we can even recall Toyota having had its share of similar issues.

I confess that when I bought my HCH-2 I had concerns about this same issue. After all, I spent the last 2 decades recommending Hondas and Toyotas as long as we do not buy a first year model. ;)

Fortunately in my case, I was aware of the list of issues for the current 2006 year model. As I saw the list of field issues stabilize I thought it might be safe to jump in and buy my HCH2 instead of buying a Prius. Unfortuntely, many of us don't always have this information and we simply purchase a vehicle on faith alone. No manufacturer is immune from quality problems in their first year model run.

I would suggest you hound Honda and have them resolve the issues. I will not be the first one to state that despite the rather predictable quality issues with initial production runs - both Honda & Toyota still have a worldwide quality and reliability rating that is difficult to match.

Good luck

MS

Wait for chevy to dump the ecotec engine in the daewoo... I mean chevy aveo. Those chaewoo's are pretty solid from what I gather, except for the badges.

One of the biggest issues is that the early samples of any car model have the worst quality control. Many say "never buy the debut models" and others will tell you never to buy the first model year of a car. Statistical surveys have proven every manufacturer falls victim to this, even the top ranked Lexus shows the first year of any models has the most defects. I would imagine this is a similar case for the Civic - fit and finish problems due to unforseen issues in the first year of production of the new model.

One of the biggest issues is that the early samples of any car model have the worst quality control. Many say "never buy the debut models" and others will tell you never to buy the first model year of a car. Statistical surveys have proven every manufacturer falls victim to this, even the top ranked Lexus shows the first year of any models has the most defects. I would imagine this is a similar case for the Civic - fit and finish problems due to unforseen issues in the first year of production of the new model.

The 05 Accord is almost as bad. The dash is falling out of it!

hmmm, you make me feel I should not get (trade-up to) a HCH II, and with the intermittent problems with my HCH I, maybe I should look into getting rid of it as well. I still need to take mine to get it looked at, but it doesn't do its quirks 100% of the time, and I cannot afford to be picked up and dropped off by my dealerships van service. I was very shocked they didn't offer me something to use while it was getting warranty checked and/or repairs, since it is an expensive car for the working class. I don't pay my monthly payment for a taxi service. But I will hush before I work up my own blood pressure.

A hand-built Insight I am sure is of much better quality.

I read the posts on the link, I had no idea that many people were having interior/exterior trim problems. I would expect better from Honda, let alone any mid $20k car.

My sympathies. I might just go ahead and get a reliable rotary with an interior I have always felt molded to my body ... and become a RX hypermiler ;) Still no comparison to the mpg these Hondas get!!! But they sure are fun to drive :D

hmmm, you make me feel I should not get (trade-up to) a HCH II, and with the intermittent problems with my HCH I, maybe I should look into getting rid of it as well. I still need to take mine to get it looked at, but it doesn't do its quirks 100% of the time, and I cannot afford to be picked up and dropped off by my dealerships van service. I was very shocked they didn't offer me something to use while it was getting warranty checked and/or repairs, since it is an expensive car for the working class. I don't pay my monthly payment for a taxi service. But I will hush before I work up my own blood pressure.

A hand-built Insight I am sure is of much better quality.

I read the posts on the link, I had no idea that many people were having interior/exterior trim problems. I would expect better from Honda, let alone any mid $20k car.

My sympathies. I might just go ahead and get a reliable rotary with an interior I have always felt molded to my body ... and become a RX hypermiler ;) Still no comparison to the mpg these Hondas get!!! But they sure are fun to drive :D

I wouldnt worry about a HCHII. I havent heard much of anything about them. Folks dont seem to be having build and matrial quality problems with them. I think the HCHII fro right now is kinda being treated as a flagship right now. They are all built in Japan and looked after very carefully. I think most of the issues Im seeing and others can be traced back to the North American labor force IMO. Be it in the supply chain or in the assemble of the cars. Take the last gen Civic Si. Americans basicly hated the car cause it was a Euro Style Rally Hatch. Well that and the base RSX engine choice was a poor move. the car was built in England and has held up very well. With little to no problems like we are seeing with the North American produced Civics and Accords for that mattrer. Not even the people in Central and south America are having problems like we are. And if the Asian countrys where having issues it would be all over the place.

Please,, dont let my wine spoil your cheese if your out to get a HCHII. Get it. I would have gotten one it they had put a 5 MT and rear disc brakes on them. Who knows 07 mite be my year. :)

OOO took the Civic to a Tulsa dealer today. Will drop it off in the am to see if they can fix it. If I find dubble sticky tape used to hold the parts down. There maybe police involved.

Thank you for clearing up the Civic fit and finish, I thought you had a HCH II, I just didn't pay enough attention ... It still doesn't change the fact that my car is acting funny. I really wish I could get a loaner vehicle. Maybe if I insist enough, or try a different dealer out of town (which I will almost definitely do when buying my next Honda). Our Honda dealership acts quite snobbish both in the service department and the showroom. I just feel uncomfortable dealing with them (more-so than the normal dealership jitters).

ok, an american Honda, makes sense ...

and i say that with some experience. I worked at a well-known (nationally) automotive parts (hoses, belts, etc) manufacturer in town. The hoses they had me ship to the customer (usually Ford, Chrysler, and GM) I would NEVER accept for myself. I am not saying that they would necessarily fail (at least the ones I put out), but they had horrible cap damage (major pitting from rust build up), which only need the caps to be removed and cleaned, then the hoses would come out smooth.

We had many issues of bad hoses, people not fully assembling product, etc that were returned, I actually watched one person who didn't check the hoses, just put them in the totes. It is amazing how they wanted to push numbers instead of quality ... I could get into a lot of frustrating things about that company, but it is pointless.

I did find it funny when I asked them why they had no foreign auto maker accounts ... I was told bluntly: We don't meet their quality standards nor can we produce the numbers they would require. How true.

I see it as either 1) the workers don't really care as long as they have a job and get a paycheck ($$$) and/or 2) the management and companies are worried about how much they can make this quarter ( short-term profits$$$) ...

and in turn in most other countries ... 1) workers take pride in themselves and in turn their job is done to their best ability (honor/respect) and 2) management and companies are worried about their reputation and keeping customers long term and those customers recommended the product to others (honor/respect & long-term profits $$$)

Just my humble opinion based on the narrow part of the market I am knowledgeable of first-hand. It wasn't just the parts manufacturer, but I also worked for a worldwide cabinet manufacturer who followed the same line, but both those places have lost major accounts (finally) ... also worked for a shelving company that claimed millions of dollars of product (2+) going out each day, but paid the workers a low wage, didn't keep all the machinery working properly (stopped using the dryer after the wash and before the powerdercoat), and wouldn't put a/c in for the workers ... and it gets over 100 degrees outside, so with the ovens baking on the powdercoat, it was a bit toasty inside ... the auto part place also wouldn't put in a/c, and they used vulcanizers (big steam machines) to mold the hoses, a little warm in there as well, even when it was cool out you would sweat in both. I will admit, a lot of people lost weight, but they also have at least a person a month passing out from heat exhaustion, and I know each has had, within the last couple years, someone die from it as well. but that is way off point and I apologize.

Sorry for whining myself ;)

Took my car to the dealer today to have the dash insert replaced and the center cowl on the bottom of the windshield.

The got the clips in ok for the center cowl. But they screwed up my dash. There are tool marks all over the edges of the insert and the new insert is all bent up and sticking out in the center. So now its a new insert and a new dash top panel. this is now on par with owning a Chevy....

No flames intended here just my humble opinion.
The tech's are probably under the gun to fix problems based on a time standard book so if you get a newbie you're probably going to get sub par work and basically they could care less if your dash or trim gets beat up in the process. The older experienced people who really take pride in their work will get the job done right most of the time. I'm sure that most dealerships have very good quality programs in place but if nobody's awake during the training it is what it is.....a non program.

Being an engineer, I could probably fix most things that a car could have wrong with it but it would take me days if not weeks to figure it out even with the factory manual. Just think of that poor new person who gets his/her first job to fix your car. I give them plenty of respect. They are under the gun to get it done without incurring too much labor costs to you and they truely want to get it done well but in the end corners are cut to get you your car back in a reasonable amount of time. Let's not foget that these folks are highly paid individuals sometimes making 6 figure incomes.

Guess my point is that a "stock" car is only a mass produced machine and it can never be perfect and it will never run exactly as designed. As long as it fits into the mfg's range of quality std's, everybody should be happy. ;)

Took the civic back in this am so they could replace the top panel of the dash and the trim insert. :/

Good luck, I'm hoping I don't have any problems since I gave up a 05 RX-8 that ran well and mechanically was sound for the gas savings (from 20mpg to 45mpg) of the HCH II.

Have the civic back now. The dash looks good with no squeaks or rattles ,,, yet. :)

Good luck, I'm hoping I don't have any problems since I gave up a 05 RX-8 that ran well and mechanically was sound for the gas savings (from 20mpg to 45mpg) of the HCH II.

Hi,

I also own a 06 HCH II and it now has Approx. 6,000 miles on it. If I had the decision to make again I would purchase the same vehicle again. Quite, powerful, Excellent Nav. and not to forget the X/M Satellite Radio with the Bass Speaker Upgrade. All is well and one Great Hybrid (IMO).

Happy here: :bananajump:

tiger

Tiger, glad to hear you are happy!

Sounds like your system sounds good :D especially if the car is that quiet ...

Tiger, glad to hear you are happy!

Sounds like your system sounds good :D especially if the car is that quiet ...

Hi Shaun,

Believe me it is Quite and the sound system does sound great (IMO) for a factory system. :D

tiger