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no flames, please, let me explain.....

i don't do TV, however, on the bike at the gym, with 5 screens almost in your face, sometimes you can't help but see stuff. even without sounds, this is one of the most disgusting messages i have seen in quite some time:

commercial goes like this: nice guy in the supermarket, buying some healthy stuff. however, the package of tofu just won't scan, and he's getting dirty looks from the guy behind him who has the belt stacked high with ribs, steaks, etc. so nice guy stomps out of the store, slams the cart into the rack, gets into his car and squeals out of the parking lot. from there he apparently drives straight to a hummer dealer. walks in, points at the first one he sees. the next frame he is seated in this monstrosity with a self satisfied look on his face, and the copy comes up....RESTORE YOUR MANHOOD.

sheesh, what the heck kind of message is this? and no wonder we have problems.......:eek:

laurie,


Don't worry - everybody at this forum cares about fuel economy. :)
The Hummer sympathizers that attack seem to think I'm the only one that does it, even when it's obvious many others do.

Pathetic. I don't see how it is going to sway someone.

BTW, ironicaly of all the people I know that drive hummers. 100% are female. These H2s and H3s. I don't know anyone with an original hummer.

the hummers that i see around here are mostly driven by real estate agents or radio people. though on my way home last night, i again saw a hummer towing a huge pontoon boat. i wonder if it was the one i saw a while ago traveling in the opposite direction. perhaps he ran out of gas money :)

I think this is just a verbalization that everybody knows:

An H2 (and similar vehicles) does not have much utility - they are seldom seen moving lots of people or things
They are seldom used off-road
The open secret is people get them to impress people or gratify their ego
This is fuel on the fire (pardon the pun) since it's typically used for commuting and requires several times the gas as many fine sedans.
Most people here find driving a gas-guzzler simply to impress as repulsive, narcassistic.
People that like Hummers get defensive that many other people have negative convictions, particluarly the ego part.In an earlier era, I think the if the majority of people frowned on Hummers, they would get rid of them becuase it totally defeats the purpose of an item that impresses others. Now I wonder if more Hummer contempt by the general population would bring on a civil war, judging from some of the attitudes of their supporters. :(

I read somewhere that 70% of the Hummer drivers were men - don't know if that was H1, H2....I'm sure it's not the H3. Not sure....

hee hee, i was mean to one once..........i know there is a website that advocates giving them the finger, however, i usually just use a thumbs down. once i saw one coming at me, and when we made i contact i raised my hand......he waved, i gave him a downturned thumb.....ok, i'm naughty

Most of the Hummers I see around here are driven by men. Manly men. Men with huuuuge...fuel budgets. Fortunately there aren't that many...mostly H3s (that still look huge to me). Also fortunate is that I rarely have to deal with them, because I spend my time in the far right lane while they spend their time in the far left. It makes me sad to see them running along at ~10mpg @75mph, but I have to believe that their little worlds will come crumbling down soon enough. Maybe we're talking about people with a terminal case of $>sense, but how happy can they really be? Even if the frontal lobe is out to lunch, there must be some weak little bit of gray matter in there that understands reality and finds subtle ways of punishing the part of the brain (maybe a few feet lower) that does the decision making.

That said, (what did I say?), I don't feel the need to be outraged. Let GM conduct a disastrous ad campaign, because we all know that they are being laughed at. In turn, that guy in the Hummer is being laughed at, if only because the rest of us saw the commercial and know that the tofu is under the passenger seat next to the security blanket. Karma shall do its thing.

That's what I've been accused of doing by the Hummer sympathizers that are trying to portray me as a PETA-style militant. I don't care for all the vulgar content at www.fuh2.com (http://www.fuh2.com), but effectively makes the point the H2 is all about ego, and nothing about utility. The ads validate it.

In our area of the NJ Shore, a lot of the Hummers are driven by the Summer residents. And most of them are moms on cell phones. There's a large number of the Summer residents that are very wealthy and very self-centered, so it doesn't really surprise me.

You gotta give GM/Hummer credit for knowing their target market, though. This ad is an admission on their part that the Hummer is an ideal car for any guy who needs a large vehicle to feel secure in his manhood. :D

Mike

Welcome Proco to CleanMPG!

A good cyberfriend in Jersy has a big orange cat I'm fond of. After he got diabetis, his size went down from an H1 (22 pounds) to an H3 (16 lbs.) :D It's under control now. :(

I know some of those Jersey moms.

They complain about everything and then pull into the gas station and drop $100 into the tank.

Geesh.

She drives a Toyota Corolla - was just saying her cat is "Hummer sized" :D

I saw that commercial as well. Goes to show you that all those ad's are just an insult to a normal person's intelligence. But they sell cars because they excite the very basic human emotions.....

This is a good read > http://www.slate.com/id/2081132/

In quotable language, I can understand the anger from the Hummer sympathizers - I'm gonna do what ever I want and couldn't care less. BTW, I'm better than you.... :rolleyes:

People who drive enormous, angry, military-style vehicles around city streets are never embarrassed. The whole point of the Hummer is a total—and aggressive—disregard for what anyone else thinks...should be called an FUV

The H1 was a pretty impressive, capable vehicle. For certain
purposes. I'm always impressed by how they got so much ground
clearance with NO punkins hanging down, and how they mounted
the brakes up high inboard of the suspension so they act on the
wheels through the jackshafts. Clearly a certain amount of sound
engineering thought went into that thing, and it shows especially
when you crawl under one and look around.
.
Anything since is a total sham.
.
_H*

Fortunately there aren't that many...mostly H3s (that still look huge to me). ... It makes me sad to see them running along at ~10mpg @75mph
Just to clarify, the H3 is rated 16/19 with the automatic, and 16/20 with the manual transmission. That's equal or better than a Ford Explorer (15/20, 14/20).

I got a kick out of this. From "The Onion dot Com". Kind of sums it all up I think.....

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/50075/10

Gotta love that Onion! Thanks Delta for the Slate "FUV" quote. That is spot on! :D

I got a kick out of this. From "The Onion dot Com". Kind of sums it all up I think.....

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/50075/10


kinda of reminds me of the tongue in cheek "commercial" on my favorite public radio station. they do faux commercials which are really jabs at what goes on in the world today. one of the good ones is for the ficticious Intimida from Sherpa, the biggest SUV made. it looks llike a mountain parked in the back of the car lot.....etc etc. i am too foggy (no coffee yet) to remember everything they say, but while driving along you can just picture in your mind what they are describing.....makes the excursion look small

I honestly believe that driving safer and for better FE is a behaviorial thing, mostly.

Choosing to drive a vehicle apporpiately sized for the task in a friendly manner is not rocket science - it's a choice.

Hummer must be doing a variety of these because I just saw a new one last night. 2 Moms are at the park, first Mom puts her kid ahead of the other mom's kid at the slide, the snubbed mom protests and gets the cold shoulder. So she goes off (I suppose in search of a spine) and finds the answer in a Hummer. We see the evil smile on her face as she drives off. Very expensive one-upmanship.

Almost as bad as the other commercial that ran a long time. First day of new school, Mom asks her kids, are you SURE you want to be dropped off in front? Kids are all oh yeah, no problem. Their envious classmates part like the red sea as the kids swagger out of their....Hummer. It's clear the 7th grade pack hierarchy has been reordered and there are new alpha-males in charge.

It should not be a surprise that advertisers have our baser instincts as their target. We just have to warn our kids keep their eyes on the strategy, and not on the glitter.

When people name who they admire the most, names like Mother Theresa or Gandhi come to mind.

It's a disturbing commentary that commercials like this are working by appealing for people to be the polar opposite:

brutish to compensate for insecurities
in-your-face
insensitive
vain, status-seeking
self-centered
self-serving over charitySorry to touch on the political, but when Americans condemn a militaristic nation like North Korea, doesn't it undermine our moral authority when a lot of us are lusting to shove traffic around in a large mitary-based vehicle? Let's be honest, the ads are not promoting the Hummer to be used as an off-road vehicle, but an intimidator.

Well the whole point is to make money. Hummer doesn't need to convince everybody to buy a Hummer, or even 10%, they just need to push that half of 1 percent over the edge that was thinking of buying one anyway. In fact it's way smaller than that, really. Hummer sold about 60,000 vehicles in 2005 if I remember correctly, which means only 1 out of 5000 Americans chose Hummer. That's a very, very small minority, so I would refrain from reading too much into what it says of the nation as a whole when it's so few that choose Hummer.

Granted, it's a small segment, but it's very visible. Toystores and non-dealership ads have Hummers all over the place. Verizon was at my gym last night with their H2. Plenty of radio stations, and businesses consider the H2 to be a cool billboard.

While not as extreme in styling, other similar vehicles send a like message.

Such an emotional issue....

Hi All:

___I guess the real answer to this will be with future H2/H3 sales? With gasoline now hard locked above $3.00 per in my locale ($3.16 per gallon of 87 Unleaded 2 days ago :() and bound to climb even further with yesterdays Crude run up, let us wait and see. Advertising is a 2 way street. Does anyone remember the Regen based Prius II commercial? How many Prius II’s were sold because of the guy and gal driving 2 feet, slamming on the brakes, driving 2 feet and slamming on the brakes talking about recapturing energy in braking (completely idiotic waste of time and resources)? Hummer hired a good ad agency is all but they still have one hell of a head wind looking at $3.00 + fuel costs on top of a not so family or environment friendly pig of a machine …

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Guess what?

I was at the gym and saw the tail end of this ad.

Someone else at GH also saw this ad at the gym.

Why does everybody see this at the gym? :D

I can only hope that "like nothing else" starts having
more and more *negative* meaning in peoples' minds...
.
_H*

I was at the gym and saw the tail end of this ad.

Someone else at GH also saw this ad at the gym.

Why does everybody see this at the gym? :D
If I had to guess, I'd say it's their target demographic. Think about it - why do most people go to the gym? Either to look good or to feel good. They will likely have programming playing at a gym that fits the target demographic of people who want to look and feel good. The Hummer is right there - it makes you look good (because they think it will make people envy you, or think highly of you and your muscular Hummer) or make you feel good, because you can be smug about this manly vehicle you drive. Seems like the target demographic of people at a gym to me.

Guess what?

I was at the gym and saw the tail end of this ad.

Someone else at GH also saw this ad at the gym.

Why does everybody see this at the gym? :D

the only reason i saw it at the gym, is that's the only time i see a television that's on. i never watch at home.

the dynamics of the gym i go to might skew the whole theory....mostly, at least when i am there, it's older people, and a large percentage of women.

and anyhow, i don't think they control where it's shown.....or the time. i was there at 7AM....

This is a hot topic.

Anyone serious about FE and clean emissions will likely see the Hummer as the last vehicle they would want to drive.

When that occasional person thinks an H2 is just fine, I wonder - how can you rationally promote it at a site promoting FE, greeness, or hybrids? I just don't understand that. Pickups occassional haul things - minivans haul people, an H2 as Clotaire Rapaille reveals, is a vehicle designed by people like him for those that don't give a d*** about others.

What follows is from Keith Bradshier and Clotaire Rapaille - what they said...


__________________________________________

This review (http://www.newsreview.com/chico/Content?oid=oid%3A25060) of Keith Bradshier's The High and Mighty says it very well.

__________________________________________

Clotaire Rapaille (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4710897/) came from France to America and is considered my many to be the one most responsible for making the modern SUV what it is today by appealing to the reptillian instincts. Check out the links....the people doing these commercials know exactly what they are doing

Interview (http://www.onthemedia.org/transcripts/transcripts_041803_hummer.html) (complete)


....BOB GARFIELD: They are not particularly practical. They are very, very expensive -- at least in the high end of 50,000 dollars and more. They get, some of them, between ten and 15 miles to the gallon. They're difficult to park and everyone who doesn't drive one hates them. Why do people buy SUVs?

CLOTAIRE RAPAILLE: Well, the first key element was kind of a failure by all the car manufacturers in Detroit to create the car that people want! All these cars -- they were boring and ugly. They look all the same; they had no identity. It's a little bit like the cars were telling you well, I, I'm, I'm not so sure of myself; I don't dare to be a car. They - that's what the message of these intellectual cars designed by Nasstar [sp?] - they're trying to get more aerodynamic and gas mileage. And then they were not sexy at all! So suddenly this SUV is hey, the hell with you -I'm strong, I'm big, I'm taller than you --and I'm proud of being that! You know? So the message was more self-confidence.

BOB GARFIELD: If SUV marketing is about appealing to primal instincts, it would seem to me that the hummer, which is possibly the most impractical automobile ever designed--

CLOTAIRE RAPAILLE: Right.

BOB GARFIELD: -- the appeal just be practically bestial!

CLOTAIRE RAPAILLE: You see that, that -- what is fantastic here in, in the time where we are right now -- the hummer is almost a car in uniform. I mean in a time of war, to have a, a, a uniform is the message. I know how to fight; I'm part of a structure; I'm strong. I even told people in Detroit -- and they laugh at me -- I say put four stars on the shoulder of the hummer - you will sell it better. And by the way, if you look at Ralph Lauren right now, his winter collection was full of uniforms; I mean it's the fashion. And people wear a car. You don't drive a car. When people say to me, you know, you need a car to go from point A to point B -- you don't need a hummer to go from point A to point B; you don't need a hummer to go shopping. I mean let's be serious. There are other reasons, other deep, deep motivation there.

BOB GARFIELD: One of the commercials shows a, a series of phrases one after the other--: [ROCK MUSIC UP AND UNDER] Do not do this. Do not do that. Eat your vegetables, it says on screen. [LAUGHTER] Play it safe. And then you hear--: [ROCK MUSIC UP LOUD] and then you see the phrase--: Whatever. Is the message there: "I own a hummer. To hell with you?"

CLOTAIRE RAPAILLE: Definitely something like that. I mean I'm, I'm not behind this message, but there is something about feeling good about the hell with you; I do what I want, you see? And this is part of the American culture. And a lot of people resent this attitude around the world. You see that, that's what a lot of people resent about this administration - what they say is the hell with you - we're going to go to war anyway. But on the other hand there is something positive about it, because we know what we want and we do it!-- whatever it is. You know. So they're using that to sell a hummer. Definitely. And I think it works! I think these guys are, in terms of marketing the hummer, are doing a great job if you look at the sale of the hummer...

Hi Chuck:

___Great find! I would however love to setup an H2 and see what she is worth over 200 miles or so. Not a dream or anything but I would be very interested in knowing what is possible from these beasts vs. what I know they are receiving while idling at lights and in parking lots while running A/C at MAX, running high throttle openings from said light’s and any stop, and then hard on the binders for the next one as they are driven around here. I have 2 neighbors with the ****ed things even now and have a feeling they might have more potential then most of us given them credit for. You might call it my own morbid curiosity? Not that someone in a $53 - $60,000 automobile really gives a **** about FE or those around them but at least we would know …

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Wayne,

Wikapedia actually states the Hummer has a very efficient engine, but of course everything about the vehicle makes it a waste. Heard that some big rigs have better FE.

I highly recommend Googling for:

"The High and Mighty" - by Keith Bradshier

www.amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com) does not have it, but it's still available if you look.

Bradshier mentions Rapaille extensively, and gives a through history of the SUV:

The Chevy Surburban came out in 1938?
Jeep kicked off the modern SUV around 1984 (and had a car frame, unlike many that followed)
Many pickup trucks are so high because they wanted Texans to ride with their hats on (honest)
Not rosey picture of what happens when kids get them as hand-me-downs and they are older.
Investigates the solutions

i can totally attest to the fact that they don't give a fickle flying rats a$$ about gas. i may have told this little anecdote on GH, but it still bugs me. i went to lunch one day at perkins. as i entered the building, there was a hummer parked right next to the door, with the engine running. that darn thing ran the entire time i was in there eating. had i figure out which of the patrons it belonged to, i really think i might have said something...no excuse for such ignorant waste.

Great find! I would however love to setup an H2 and see what she is worth over 200 miles or so.
Wayne in a Hummer...wouldn't the cosmic energy differential alone cause the universe to implode or something?
What I'd give for the photo rights.... :D

Wayne in a Hummer...wouldn't the cosmic energy differential alone cause the universe to implode or something?
What I'd give for the photo rights.... :D
Hi Tarabell:

ROFLMAO :D :D :D

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Ha. I would just about drive to Chicago to see Wayne hypermile an H2. Say, how many people could we fit in one of those things? :D

Update to this. Has anyone seen this commercial? They changed it now so at the end it says "restore the balance".

Oh, there's a companion one for women now, too - with the tag line 'Get your Girl on' (or maybe it even says 'grrl', although that would be typical of GM to be so passé)

Set up:

Mom & young child are at playground /park, and the child's about to get on the slide or whatever. Just then, a pushy mom puts her own child in front, and *they* get to get on the slide first.

Our mom says "I'm sorry, <name> was next"
Pushy mom: "Yeah, well, we're next now"

Series of quick cuts of our mom (with child in tow) assertively:
- driving to dealer
- pointing out vehicle to salesman
- signing sales contract
- getting key dropped in her hand
- driving off lot
- driving down street with a very smug (sorry, couldn't resist) look on her face...then you see the tagline superimposed in the last shot of mom & her new hummer.


Using people's anger / frustration to sell the vehicle is pretty sad. Of course, that's not half as sad as they're going to be after a month or two of filling the thing up...but like Wayne said...if someone goes and buys one these days, they're not worried about $3/gal gas, and they'll think dwindling supplies & CO2 emissions are a myth. :(

It also doesn't resolve her issue with 'pushy mom' - what's our mom going to do next time - point out her Hummer and say... "don't mess with me, b!tch - I drive a Hummer" ? She could have saved herself $30K in vehicle costs and another $30K in gas costs (and all of us her excess CO2 emissions) if she had just went for a handful or two of Pushy mom's hair. Would've made a more interesting commercial, too ;)

A woman that nearly ran me off the road this afternoon would probably love to trade her minivan for an H2. {sigh}

For anyone that might be Hummer apologists, a GM executive or commercial has to promote these icons of gas guzzlers again.

Last night at the gym I saw the extended Hummer Submarine commercial. Don't have a problem with the Hummer driven off a pier and it converts into a submarine like one of 007's cars. But it goes on. A guy with a 1970's puny electric vehicle (http://www.didik.com/didik_ct.htm) rushes to scrap it to get an H3. Variations of the recent "Restore Your Manhood" commercial of the mild-mannered guy dropping his tofu and other health foods at the supermarket to get an H3 and be transformed into a "real man".

If you have a "real car" - do you need commercials that pander to one's insecurities? The commercial just mentioned is worse as it's green bashing. Yes, I know - Hummer customers don't believe in Climate Change or peak oil, but lot of other people see this and wonder if GM is serious about their fuel cell vehicles.

Simply, I am bewildered by the fact that our culture equates a big truck with manhood.

Ask the men that fough the Battle of the Bulge about manhood. Ask the men who fought on the mooncrater that is Iwo Jima. Ask the women who stood up for voting rights. Ask the slaves who defied their masters on the Underground Railroad.

I cannot say that I am an accomplished, courageous, and awe-inspiring person; however, I can correctly name who is.