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View Full Version : It's time to 'flex' our energy muscles


atlaw4u
04-18-2008, 09:00 AM
The U.S. alone pays 10 times as much to OPEC nations today – roughly $1.3 trillion (U.S.) – compared to 1999, but oil production out of these countries has been flat over the past 30 years. (http://www.thestar.com/article/410812)

http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/501/Chicago_Ethanol1.jpgTyler Hamilton - The Star - April 7, 2008

Robert Zubrin may be looking ahead at how humankind can travel to Mars, but the U.S. aerospace engineer is also concerned about problems right here on Mother Earth.

Namely, energy–its cost, its pollution, and perhaps most important, who controls it.

One of the biggest problems to solve, in Zubrin's view, is how to destroy the iron-grip control that the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries has on global oil supply and, by extension, the price of a barrel of crude. OPEC's 13 members, led by Saudi Arabia, have manipulated the world's oil market for too long and must be stopped, he says.

The solution? It's dead simple as far as Zubrin is concerned: create a legislative mandate that would immediately require all cars manufactured and sold in North America to have flex-fuel capability, meaning they can run on gasoline or an alcohol-based fuel such as ethanol (E85) or methanol (M85).

"If we had a North American flex-fuel standard it would effectively be an international flex-fuel standard," says Zubrin, during a telephone interview prior to a speech he gave last Wednesday in Toronto. "Gasoline would be forced to compete at the pumps against alcohols."

He calls it an "open-source fuel market," which would drive the price of oil back to about $50 (U.S.) a barrel – the price at which ethanol becomes a competitive alternative.

In just three years this would put 60 million new cars on the road that are no longer captive to gasoline, gradually loosening OPEC's grip as more "choice" enters the marketplace.

The cars themselves would only cost about $100 more, probably less. OPEC nations, adds Zubrin, "would no longer be able to do what they please."

On a side note, $50 oil would also slow down development in the oil sands – what many consider an environmental disaster in the making.

At times Zubrin's rhetoric comes across as a "war on terror" speech from U.S. President George W. Bush… http://www.thestar.com/article/410812

Earthling
04-18-2008, 09:12 AM
One of the biggest problems to solve, in Zubrin's view, is how to destroy the iron-grip control that the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries has on global oil supply and, by extension, the price of a barrel of crude. OPEC's 13 members, led by Saudi Arabia, have manipulated the world's oil market for too long and must be stopped, he says.

The solution? It's dead simple as far as Zubrin is concerned: create a legislative mandate that would immediately require all cars manufactured and sold in North America to have flex-fuel capability, meaning they can run on gasoline or an alcohol-based fuel such as ethanol (E85) or methanol (M85).

Yet another BS article!

As we have stated here many times, you can turn every ear of corn in North America into ethanol, and fall far short of fueling America's vehicles.

I've got a better idea for dealing with OPEC: mandate immediate drastic improvements in fuel economy. Ban the sale of FSP's, require a permit to own a pickup truck based on proven need, and outlaw SUV's. The way to deal with OPEC is by having a fleet of fuel efficient vehicles. Ethanol is not the solution, and never will be.

Harry

BailOut
04-18-2008, 09:28 AM
*sigh*

Unless we stop making Ethanol from corn I want nothing to do with E85, and Methane is an even more limited resource than oil is.

The best of intentions...

xcel
04-18-2008, 10:01 AM
Hi All:

___For being an aero engineer, this guy certainly did not do much homework :(

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Robert Lastick
04-18-2008, 10:11 AM
One of the biggest problems to solve, in Zubrin's view, is how to destroy the iron-grip control that the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries has on global oil supply and, by extension, the price of a barrel of crude.


Yet another BS article!



Harry

Right on Harry, Right on!

The iron grip OPEC has on this country is the same iron grip any dealer has on his junkie. It will help creating competition for oil, but surely not by making it out of things we eat! That's plain stupid. Turning algae, tires, grasses, yard waste, etc, will only slightly relieve the problem.

As you say, our problem is we are FSP junkies. We have to go cold turkey and we have to go soon. We can't just stop using gasoline, but we can make the use of FSP's so expensive that only people who own ocean going yachts can afford them.

But almost all of us are driving FSP's (myself included) and we do not have a cheap alternative to buy, thank you big 2.127! That's why I have always pushed government mandated immediate sale of all European high MPG vehicles here in this country and government mandated and subsidized production by the big 1.974 of high MPG PHEV's. The subsidy would also be offered to Americans buying their first high MPG vehicle and the money for subsidizing the manufacturing and sale of these high MPG vehicles will come from big oil's (the "other" criminal) windfall profits.

There is no time to wait for the big 1.872 to figure out the depth of the immorality they have, and continue to perpetrate on this country. We have to take the money that is being generated from the gasoline that fuels our FSP's and use it to get high MPG vehicles in all of our hands, and we need it NOW, not in 2010, 2011 or 2012.

We needed it a decade ago.:flag::flag::flag:

93Hatch
04-18-2008, 10:13 AM
Hi All:

___For being an aero engineer, this guy certainly did not do much homework :(

___Good Luck

___Wayne

So you won't be volunteering for any flights to Mars on Zubrin's space vehicles?:D

xcel
04-18-2008, 10:16 AM
Hi 93Hatch:

___Considering the fuel to get one to low earth orbit is more than I could possibly consume in 100 lifetimes, that would definitely be a no :(

___Good Luck

___Wayne

93Hatch
04-18-2008, 10:55 AM
Hi 93Hatch:

___Considering the fuel to get one to low earth orbit is more than I could possibly consume in 100 lifetimes, that would definitely be a no :(

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Well, i was thinking about the lack of research Durbin put into this article and the fact that it might not build trust in his space research.

Chuck
04-18-2008, 11:01 AM
Speaking of space travel, most of us here commute more like real space, while most drivers do like Capt Kirk :eek:

I can't change the law of physics!!!!

bestmapman
04-18-2008, 11:10 AM
Speaking of space travel, most of us here commute more like real space, while most drivers do like Capt Kirk :eek:

...beam me up Scotty...

xcel
04-18-2008, 12:35 PM
Hi 93Hatch:
Well, i was thinking about the lack of research Durbin put into this article and the fact that it might not build trust in his space research.
___When put that way, definitely not :D

___Good Luck

___Wayne

Earthling
04-18-2008, 12:40 PM
If Zubrin is this wrong about something as simple as ethanol, I sure wouldn't want to be one of his astronauts.

He envisions landing on Mars, spending a year or so, and manufacturing enough fuel for the return trip to Earth.

Yeah, good luck with that!

Harry



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