2022 Hyundai Ioniq 5 Intro and Preview

Discussion in 'In the News' started by xcel, May 25, 2021.

  1. litesong

    litesong litesong

    From October 11, 2021:
    Now, Volta has 2061 FREE chargers available across the country. Two of the eleven new Volta FREE chargers was just installed ONLY about 3 miles from our place. While I charge there, I can walk to the park that leads to the river at which I spent lots of time over the past 60+years. Now, I’ll have another reason to spend time on the river with my binoculars. Sssswwwweeeeeeeettt! I just went to the FREE chargers near me, AND they look great, possibly 40Amp chargers, the maximum AC charge that can be delivered to the Tesla Model 3, SR+.
    The electrical cables delivering power to cars, have nice suspension retractors, so there is no excuse to leave cables on the ground. This is one of the improvements to Volta chargers I had hoped for.
    I’m sure glad the posts from people, who are saying my enthusiasm for FREE chargers is unfounded…..ARE unfounded. Maybe, they can convince other rich EV drivers NOT to free charge & us poor people will have these Free chargers all to ourselves. That’s a joke. If rich people see poor people getting a break, rich people want the break, too. Yeah, presently 3(maybe 4?) FREE chargers in 2 locations are 3 or less miles from me.
    Did I say these were new FREE chargers? We’ll see how long it takes vandals to vandalize these new FREE chargers. Will I get an EV to charge on these new FREE chargers, before they get vandalized? The clock has started.
    Hey, I met one of the Volta maintenance people the other day at one of the Volta FREE chargers.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
  2. litesong

    litesong litesong

    In truth, the reduced charging rates are NOT bad. Hyundai knows that fast DC charging is hurting longevity of its battery packs. In efforts to satisfy the public demand for fast, battery-denigrating charging, Hyundai (like other manufacturers) produce EVs to accept fast charging. But also, in efforts to protect their manufactured products (& peoples’ personally owned EVs), they limit the worst battery-denigrating charging rates. Not bad strategies at all.
    As for me, I will NOT use fast, battery-denigrating chargers, which are expensive to use. I will slow charge…..which is FREE! Here I come, 500,000 miles of EV travel. Yeah, as I said in the post above, 3(maybe 4?) FREE chargers are now within 3 miles of me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
  3. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Litesong:

    As mentioned previously, they all ramp up to great levels for PR purposes but longevity with fast charging is the new metric. All are down to onboard charging rates by 95 percent so that is a non-issue as well. That 5 to 80 percent figure is everything for anyone on the road and without a decent curve, it turns into a negative. The VW ID4 owners with 125KW DCFC rates are envious as hell when I pull in and out in 10-minutes for 5 to 55% with the Taycan and they have 40-min to go.

    2021 Taycan EA Charging

    [​IMG]

    Wayne
     
    BillLin likes this.
  4. litesong

    litesong litesong

    PR definition of longevity is NOT my definition of LONGEVITY!​
     
    BillLin and xcel like this.
  5. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Litesong:

    Not PR, actual.

    Wayne
     
    RedylC94 and BillLin like this.
  6. litesong

    litesong litesong

    How many miles of battery life with continuous Fast Charging (including the new 800Volt chargers) would there be in the present day definition of “actual LONGEVITY”. Of course, we aren’t talking about the best battery pack LONGEVITY, but the average battery pack LONGEVITY of various brands of EVs & their battery packs, that would use DCFC.
    AND we’re NOT talking about people who are featherfooters, but average EV buyers who are getting big bangs, showing friends, relatives & neighbors the accelerations & decelerations of their new EVs, AND who may like to moto-cross. Yeah…..average people who will trade off their EVs, BEFORE their battery packs fail. Now we’re talking, “actual LONGEVITY”.
     
    BillLin likes this.
  7. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Litesong:

    Here is an ancient study. A 2% loss of cap after 50k miles between L2 and DCFC on four Leaf's with just as high of C-rates compared to some of todays DCFC'ing profiles. The LEAF's air cooled packs are nowhere near to the same tech as todays liquid cooled and controlled Li-Ion wonders.

    https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2015/01/f19/dcfc_study_fs_50k.pdf

    Wayne
     
    BillLin and EdwinTheMagnificent like this.
  8. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Interesting. Thank you. I’m assuming the “ancient” Idaho study was conducted in Idaho(Boise?) with both the L2 slow chargers and minimal 50kW “fast” chargers? Note: the highest battery temp on DC “fast” charging, never got higher than about 105degF., even in summer, despite the use of the lower tech air cooling. Also note: the least disparate battery temperatures between L2 & minimal DCFC did occur in the summer, where the L2 battery temperatures were about 101degF. I must assume tests were conducted in “controlled” conditions & battery temperatures were never considered to be excessively high, as encountered in other US reports in so many of the Nissan Leaf “rapidgate” undue temperature rise episodes AND subsequent automatic charge-rate reductions. Such controlled tests might be considered normal for testing the Nissan battery packs’ air cooling temperatures, that are trying to match the slower speeds & drivers encountered on Japanese roads. It is also noted that “off-summer” seasons had L2 & minimal DCFC 50kW “fast” chargers vary by as much as 9degF., but usually a difference of about 7degF.
    Of course, we are NOT talking about DCFC 50kW chargers, to which the public does NOT want to be restricted. The Bjorn Nyland Hyundai Ioniq 5 & separate KIA EV6 “tests” were conducted under extreme extra “fast” charging, but those chargers are presently available to the public. They did encounter battery temperatures of 124 degF. AND the Nyland “test” was performed in Norway (& not summer?). I also believe that Nyland may NOT have been driving as fast as is his “norm”.

    Tho your given tests “only” indicate temperature differences between L2 & minimal DC “fast” charging of 4degF to 9degF, I see no reason to change my thinking that continuous use of extreme DCFC systems CANNOT provide battery pack normal longevities to 500,000 miles.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2021
    xcel likes this.
  9. BillLin

    BillLin PV solar, geothermal HVAC, hybrids and electrics

    A few comments, Litesong.

    Please get Bjorn Nyland's name right if you're going to quote his studies so much.

    Consider "C" charge rate, not just absolute charging current. The current "extremely fast" chargers aren't exceeding the C-rate as much as you indicate. e.g. 50 kW is to a 24 kW-h pack (2.1C) as 100 kW is to a 48 kW-h pack and as 208 kW is to a 100 kW-h pack. So your point is valid but only to a small degree.

    As most EV manufacturers will do, the DC charging rate tapers as the battery capacity is reached. How well or how aggressively they taper will result in different levels of "damage" to the battery. The car owner can also apply their own good sense and avoid topping off their EVs on a fast charger, regardless of the designed taper rate.

    Battery "calendar life" is a factor that I think you will have to contend with on your 500k mile EV.
     
    xcel and litesong like this.
  10. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Well……three miles away from me! How about that. Given the US continental area & the 2061 FREE Volta chargers, I only had an average chance that a FREE Volta charger would be a radius distance from me of 15.88 miles distant, AND that 15.88 mile radius distance should be more miles to get to by road, it is very amazing that it is only 3 miles away. That the charger is a nice walk’s distance from the river I often spent time (& still do), I am flabbergasted.
    …….I gotta get an EV!!!!
     
    BillLin likes this.
  11. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Thanks for the Nyland correction. :confused: I may have used Nyland somewhere, but I see I started using Hyland continuously. You just showed, that I think his wife is prettier, than his importance to EV improvement. & you are also correct that lipstick kW labels on EV chargers are not the average rate(causing damage?), but a maximum rate(really causing damage?). It is observed that L2 kW rates are NEVER anywhere close to DCFC average rates, but L2 kW rates are often what some EV drivers have never dealt with. But, as long as EV charger manufacturers pump their quick lipstick rates, I’ll use their rates. As you state, it matters not how aggressive EV manufacturers taper their rates, damage is being done. I would never depend on “driver good sense” to limit equipment damage on the fly.
    As for “calendar life”, I will contend with it, by using L2 charging, instead of DCFC. Whatever the “calendar life” is, rich EV drivers using lots of DCFC will (& are) dumping their EVs into the hands of poorer people, before “calendar life” is an issue. Rich people say, “Let poor people deal with my abuse!”
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
    BillLin likes this.
  12. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Volt chargers now are up to 2074….still a long ways from the 3000 they hoped to have by the end of this year. I know the L2 slow FREE Volta chargers can’t be used for quick distance driving, like everyone has been telling me, especially for heavier & less efficient EVs, like the Hyundai Ioniq 5. But, if you’re laid back & living in scenic places that coincidentally have slow FREE Volta & other slow, FREE chargers near by, then leisurely lifestyles can redefine the quality of life given by slow FREE L2 charging.
    Cases in point: From my Everett, Washington area, I can readily travel to the US northern border with Canada & return home on slow FREE charging. Or traveling east to Wenatchee, Wa.(lots of FREE strong chargers), I can then travel north into the Okanogan region AND return to Everett, all on slow FREE charging. How far north of Wenatchee I would travel, defines whether I can return to Everett in one day. Getting to Spokane from Wenatchee on FREE charging is difficult, BUT may not be an impossibility, tho multi-days to do such will be needed. From Everett, I can get to Yakima on FREE charging(one of my favorite drives). Strong FREE charging is in Yakima. There is a possibility of getting from Yakima to Boise, Idaho & back to Everett on FREE charging, altho that would take maybe 3 days. From Everett, I can get to Portland, Oregon & back to Everett on slow FREE charging. That trip would be a very long day trip….or longer. & finally, slow, FREE Volta & other slow L2 chargers will get me to the Pacific Ocean & back home….FREE. AND in either of two directions! I’ll spend more time traveling to the Ocean, than I ever have before. Did I say all this travel will be FREE? Yes, I did say it’ll be FREE.
    Like on most car websites, members here CANNOT TRADE their short travel times for long times & FREE charging. As for me, I love traveling slow, interspersing car travel with walking & hiking travel. Once I get an EV, my most interesting travel times appear to be ahead of me, not behind me at my advancing age.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2021
  13. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Volta now has about 2096 chargers. Nothing special when they had hopes to have 3000 chargers by the end of 2021. More importantly, they have added EV chargers in Berlin, Germany to go with Victoria, Canada, which appears to be Volta measures to become an international consortium.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2021
  14. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Oct. 5, 2021:
    “Ha. Hahaaaa!”, says I. Since the above post, the price of the Tesla Model 3 with 7.7 kW OBC, has escalated way beyond my budget. In looking around for another EV, I found the 2022 Chevy Bolt. Cheap….at least cheaper…..actually way cheaper than the Tesla! & lo & behold, I discovered the cheap Bolt has an 11.5 kW OBC! So my chargings will gain 40+ Miles Per Hour. AND my time to enjoy the local scenery will be reduced to (555* 7.7/11.5 ) or 372 24 hour days. Still……I should be dead by the time……THAT TIME comes around. Hope I’m enjoying some local scenery when I die. The local Chevy dealer is two miles away for any servicing or repairs the Chevy Bolt will need, so I’ll have a nice walk home with 2 lakes & distant mountains to view. Maybe I’ll die on THAT walk. Nice………

    Oh, I should choose which binoculars I want to be buried with. I have many binos I USE & can’t CHOOSE. Oh, that’s right. I’m going to get cremated. Hope people after me, get as much fun from my binoculars as I did.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2021
    BillLin likes this.
  15. litesong

    litesong litesong

    Tho FREE Volta chargers increase slowly, at times they plop down where I need them. I now have a line of Volta chargers from my region, all the way to Enumclaw, Washington. Topping up for FREE at Enumclaw, means an EV can now make the run up Highway 410 along the White River. Have to wait for next year, with the snow piling up now & the passes closed. But, rising further & turning right off the highway, one can drive to magnificent 6400 foot Sunrise on the northeast ridges & slopes of Mount Rainier! Or continue on the 410 up to 5500 foot Chinook Pass. Then take a long extended sweet drop all the way to Yakima on the Columbia River….. where there are more FREE chargers. Then, return to I-90, where there are more FREE chargers & back home. Sure hope I can get an EV within the year.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2021
    xcel likes this.

Share This Page