Hot Deal – New 2020 Toyota Prius Prime LE for $16,529 + TTL

Discussion in 'In the News' started by xcel, Feb 12, 2020.

  1. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    And yet another update at the 67,026 mile mark...

    I had a private up to Mt Palomar so up I go from essentially Sea Level to 5,600' ASL. After the descent and a few past the inflection point to more flat terrain, I received a ping behind me to take a customer from the Harrah's casino to Valley View Casino a few miles down the road. All good and Plugshare is telling me their are numerous free L2s in the Casino parking garage. I arrived at the second casino parking garage with 23 percent and I never look a gift horse in the mouth. Along with the free L2 for an hour and a half, they offered free Coke products and a new mask. Ok, thank you very much as I know the customer I dropped off was going to pay for all of that and a whole lot more. Everyone always wins at the casino's, right? ;)

    I also took the opportunity to clean the interior and exterior with clean towels I use for this exact purpose.

    The Prius Prime is topped off, and I am at 1,550' ASL. I drive off, drop down to 975' ASL and the pack continued to fill although indication stops at 100 percent where it sat for the 4.5 mile drive to the roundabout before heading back up the 12.5 mile, switchback ladened 4,700' ascent. I am guessing the pack was probably at 102 to 104 percent and I ran the A/C at max in an attempt to bleed off the excess energy to reduce the chance of Cell damage.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime

    [​IMG]
    A climb from sea level to 5,600' has to go through 4,000' ASL, right? ;)

    From 975' ASL with an ~ 103 percent SoC pack, I climbed all the way to 4,000' ASL and still had 1 percent SoC. Think about the energy necessary to lift the 3,400 lb Prime LE with ~ 235 lbs of my own gear and myself onboard straight up over 3,000'. And that power came from a 200 lb Li-Ion pack and case located just under the rear hatch floor. Anyone that has pushed a 3,000+ lb car knows the energy expended just to get it to move let alone stop. Now think about lifting it into the sky over 3,000'!

    I was thoroughly amazed at this result!

    The second trip down from 5,600' ASL to 865' ASL some 14-miles later found SoC move from flat to 83 percent. She allowed another 36-miles before first ICE fire during the trip back.

    Wayne
     
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  2. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    We finally had a little rain... And snow above 4,000' ASL here in Southern California! I snapped a pic of the front side window glass showing its water repellant properties. This is simply the untreated glass as I have not added any Rain-X or other wax products to them ever. Just the std. side window glass and its water repellent properties that I have spoken about numerous times during the updates.

    [​IMG]

    And the snow shot on Mount Palomar at 5,600' ASL. Chains or 4X SUVs with snow tires were required during the snow storm. I just drove up the damn thing. ;)

    [​IMG]

    Wayne
     
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  3. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    The end of Year 1 or the 9-month update. The Prius Prime continues to roll as if it were driven right off the lot although there are now some 69,082 miles on her clock w/ an lmpg of 80.9 mpg indicated over those same miles.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime

    [​IMG]
    Parked just outside the Tavola Nostra Italian Restaurant in downtown San Diego, CA.

    [​IMG]

    Yes, I know, this southern California weather including winter temperatures and surrounds are so hard to get used to. ;)

    I have charged it a total of 20.4 times over its lifetime - 18.4 on free L2s, for a total "free miles" of ~ 715 miles.

    Repair expenses did not increase with the (2) flat tire repairs at $201 plus a $130 tow that I was reimbursed $100 for. I added the new set of Bridgestone Ecopia's for $560 at just past the 50k mile mark for a total of $791.

    Fuel costs include 715-miles from free opportunity charging, the first tank was a free dealer fill, and 67,727 miles on 901.8 gallons at an avg. cost of $2.662 per gallon = $2,400.59.

    Maintenance costs have not changed with the first 25k miles were on Toyota so $120 for (5) 5 qt, jugs of Mobil1 0W-16 (I still have 23.5 qts. left to go), $38 for (10) Toyota Genuine Oil Filters (I still have 6 left), and three labor charges for $57 incl. tip so far. Nothing else. Not even a bulb although I have to change out the cabin and air filter here shortly. $215.00 all in.

    Insurance: $1,023/year for $0 deductible liability incl. towing.

    It appears that the 2020 Toyota Prius Prime's TCO is still just under $0.10/mile. An absolutely incredible low TCO and one I do not think can be matched by any other new automobile. Or used one for that matter!

    Gross earnings from the March 4, 2020 purchase date through December 31, 2020 came to $78,621.27 for a gross of $1.138/mile. I have been donating time and miles delivering food for my daughter and son-in-law’s new restaurant while they struggle to get through the pandemic shutdowns in San Diego. The Prime is made for that kind of duty albeit I am donating all tips and free earnings back to the business.

    Wayne
     
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  4. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    While not a direct correlation to the 4th Gen Prius/Prius Prime's independent rear end, I saw this post regarding a Texan that had his first alignment completed on a 2008 Gen 2 at the 279k mile mark. His comments about the Prius is that it is a tank given the poor road conditions he drives on a daily basis.

    If the third and fourth gen use similar metallurgical and over-designed underpinnings, this bodes well for all Prius owners regarding chassis longevity going forward.

    [​IMG]

    Wayne
     
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  5. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    A small offset to the 2020 Toyota Prius Prime’s Total Cost of Ownership (TCO) arrived today…

    From: EV <ev@sdge.com>
    Date: January 29, 2021 at 3:47:27 PM PST
    To: EV <ev@sdge.com>

    Subject: Limited EV Purchase Credit Status Update - Approved

    Dear Applicant,

    Thank you for your interest in SDG&E’s Limited EV Purchase Credit program. Congratulations, your application has been approved, and you are eligible to receive the Limited EV Purchase Credit of $250. This credit will appear on your SDG&E bill within the next two months (depending on your bill cycle). For those who requested a check, it will be mailed to the address indicated on your application.

    If you have any questions, please email us at EV@sdge.com.

    To learn more about SDG&E electric vehicle programs, electric vehicle benefits, or to apply for an EV pricing plan, visit: sdge.com/EV.

    SDG&E Clean Transportation Team
    ev@sdge.com

    Comparing our own electricity usage and costs, here is my complete 2020 Usage and billing with the cumulative totals on the bottom.

    Dec 2019 - Jan 2020: 290 kWh - $76.91 ($0.265/kWh)
    Jan 2020 - Feb 2020: 330 kWh - $88.63 ($0.268/kWh)
    Feb 2020 - Mar 2020: 219 kWh - $60.45 ($0.276/kWh)
    Mar 2020 - Apr 2020: 208 kWh - $56.16 ($0.272/kWh)
    Apr 2020 - May 2020: 177 kWh - $46.85 ($0.264/kWh)
    May 2020 - Jun 2020: 203 kWh - $54.94 ($0.271/kWh)
    Jun 2020 - Jul 2020: 219 kWh - $60.50 ($0.276/kWh)
    Jul 2020 - Aug 2020: 289 kWh - $47.59 ($0.165/kWh) <-- Covid-19 Relief Disc.
    Aug 2020 - Sep 2020: 436 kWh - $94.28 ($0.216/kWh) <-- Covid-19 Relief Disc.
    Sep 2020 - Oct 2020: 331 kWh - $91.58 ($0.277/kWh)
    Oct 2020 - Nov 2020: 199 kWh - $55.13 ($0.277/kWh)
    Nov 2020 - Dec 2020: 249 kWh - $68.97 ($0.277/kWh)

    3,150 kWh over 12-months for $801.99 ($0.255/kWh) while averaging 262.5 kWh/month.

    With the $250 SDG&E EV Purchase Credit, those same 3,150 kWhs consumed cost $551.99 or $0.175/kWh. I should have been charging the 2020 Toyota Prius Prime from the home plug a lot more often as $0.175/kWh is the equivalent of driving on $2.18/gallon fuel from the following calculations.

    $0.175/kWh / 6 mi/kWh (36 miles of AWR per 6 kWh) = $0.0292/mile = $x.xx/gal / 75 miles/gal (actual mpgUS on fuel alone) or $2.18/gal.

    Over the course of 73.1k miles, gasoline is now up to avg. cost of $2.699 per gallon from the following:

    715 miles of free L2 + 68,367 miles on 901.8 gallons = 75.8 mpgUS at an average of $2.662/gallon ($2,400.59)

    57 miles of free L2 + 69,082 miles --- 69,139 miles to 73,100 miles = 3,961 miles on 52.4 gallons at 75.6 mpg and $2.919/gallon ($152.93)

    $2,553.52 in total fuel costs from 953.19 gallons = $2.699/gallon covering a total of 72,943 "fueled" miles.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime

    [​IMG]
    $2.789/gallon at an Indian Reservation East of San Diego -- This is the last time I will see fuel this low in California. :(

    As long as I stay below the 359 kWh per month allotment to keep in the low electricity cost tier of $0.28/kWh (for now), I can actually charge for less than the cost of gasoline to drive a similar distance. Will that $250 be offered in 2021 and how long will the Covid-19 SDG&E discounts last? It actually ends in 2-days so it is back to $0.32/kWh through 359 kWh and $0.40/kWh for tier 2 usage.

    The electricity to fuel cost comparison when below the 359 kWh threshold indicates a $2.18/gallon equivalent on electricity while I have paid an average of $2.699/gallon in 2020. Average fuel prices are beyond that already here in San Diego of course. More calculations with summer rates just months away and watching the kWh use to the day are probably in order.

    Wayne
     
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  6. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    I have had a lot of red cars , prompting some to say that red is my favorite color.

    That Prime in blue is beautiful.
     
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  7. Jay

    Jay Well-Known Member

    Wow! 32c/kwh for electricity! I thought only Hawaiians paid that much.
     
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  8. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Jay:

    And San Diego residents. :(

    Fortunately as you can deduce from my yearly usage (3,150 kWh) and total cost ($551.99), the best climate of any city in the world provides significant reductions in consumption. For every kWh consumed, I am also taking advantage of the cleanest grid in the country - 45 percent renewable, while not getting creamed in the process. I have spoken with San Diego residents with $250 to $400/month bills and many have moved to net-zero home solar to almost eliminate the monthly outlay other than the upfront installation costs of course.

    Wayne
     
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  9. Trollbait

    Trollbait Well-Known Member

    New England electric rates can be high enough to make it cheaper to use gas with a Prius plug in.
     
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  10. BillLin

    BillLin PV solar, geothermal HVAC, hybrids and electrics

    It is for me. About 26 cents per kWh last year. I haven't checked in a few months to half year. But... we still use the battery. We switch back and forth to the ICE as it suits us.
     
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  11. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    With a day left before rates rise back to $0.33/kWh, I thought I would grab a few kWhs from home this morning and afternoon. On the rare occasion I do opportunity charge at a free L2, I have seen the time to full drop from 2:10 when I first picked up the car last March to 2:00 starting about 3-months ago. I was thinking after 23 full charges that maybe there was a slight battery degradation. Maybe there is but I have never plugged in and studied the amount of power or time from my Mustart L2 charging cable from home to derive the details. I plugged it in for a few minutes just to grab this pic. I repeated the unplug, plug in, and verify the resultant initial kW charging rate to make sure. IIRC, I thought the Prius Prime had a 3.3 kW onboard charger. At least when initially plugged in, it is consuming 3.5 kWh at the plug itself.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime initial measured Charge Rate on an L2

    [​IMG]

    While I have a few hours, I will try and pull a full charge from flat tonight to see if it still pulls in 6.81 kWh like the 2017 did when measuring its kWh input while on an L1.

    2017 Toyota Prius Prime Measured Charge from flat to full on an L1

    [​IMG]

    Wayne
     
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  12. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    So the first measured L2 on my own 2020 Toyota Prius Prime brought up some questions.

    As I mentioned yesterday, about 3-months ago I noticed the time to charge went from 2 hours and 10-minutes to 2-hours. The final 10-minutes of charge that is probably at an extremely low 1 to 2 kW rate was probably removed because I do not see/hear that during the charge completion anymore.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime Measured L2 Mustart Cable Charging

    [​IMG]
    1. Mustart Reset - 2. Initiate charging at 3.5 kW - 3. Time to Full: 2-hours and 0-minutes.
    4. 40-minutes in and still at 3.5 kW - 5. 5.735 kW to full - 6. 100 percent SoC.​

    Just 5.735 kW on the 2020? That is a bit off from the 2017 we charged w/ 6.81 kWh from flat to full?

    Was there an OTA update to reprogram the onboard charger to take off that last bit of fill? I did not even know the Prius had an OTA capability although I have seen the head unit update twice to newer SW versions. over the past 9-months.

    Bill, I hope you can do a measured recharge on yours sometime to compare.

    Wayne
     
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  13. BillLin

    BillLin PV solar, geothermal HVAC, hybrids and electrics

    Hi Wayne,

    Sorry, I can't do a measured charge other than on L1, but even so, I don't plan to ever run the battery dry to check. 1-2 hour top-offs on L1 is all I do, and these days, my Crosstrek is on the L1 and Joyce's Prius Prime gets the GE L2 charger. The L2 charger is completely analog.

    I thought I read somewhere that L1 charging has greater losses than L2 charging, so a 2017 full charge on L1 may not be sufficiently comparable to a 2020 high mileage L2 charge to check capacity loss. I'll have to dig around a bit to see if I can find that bit that stuck in my mind. If you have a L2 measured charge before (new car) and after (e.g. with 80k miles), then that would be something.

    Somewhere along the line, I think I've been using 5.5 kW (or 5.something) usable as a figure to gauge efficiency of drives. I've seen mention of various numbers in various places.

    Here are a couple mentions...

    https://priuschat.com/threads/how-many-kilowatts-for-full-charge.187070/

     
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  14. Trollbait

    Trollbait Well-Known Member

    Level 1 charging is slightly less efficient than Level 2. I think it is mostly because of the longer run time of the charger and electronics; there are losses there from the start.. IIRC, the difference between the two is under 10%.
     
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  15. BillLin

    BillLin PV solar, geothermal HVAC, hybrids and electrics

    Yes, that's it. Sounds familiar now. Thanks, Trollbait. So longer run time for the charger electronics, and for me, a much longer run to the L1 EVSE plug-in point, so resistance losses in addition.
     
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  16. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    I gave it anther full charge from flat and watched the outcome a little more closely. Who the hell does this??? ;)

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime

    [​IMG]
    5.83 kW usable from its 8.8 kWh pack.​

    While the time to full continues to display 2-hours when initiating a charge, the time from flat to full of 1 hr and 58-min for the charge two days ago and this mornings 2-hours and 0 minutes falls right in line with that readout. The fall off in charging is also evident as I snapped the central charging display and the Mustart details indicating just 0.9 kW charging rate with 10-minutes to go before full and charging stops. Instead of the 6.81 kWh while on an L1, the total usable shows 5.830 from this mornings charge from flat to full on the L2.

    1 kWh difference between an L1 charge in a 2017 vs an L2 on my 2020 seems really excessive. Even if the time to charge was 2 hours and 10-minutes while charging at 3.5kW for the same duration before the rate falloff occurs, that is only an additional .6 kWh. I sure wish I had performed this same L2 home charge back in March when I purchased it new and the display indicated 2 hours and 10-minutes to full charge although I did not have the MUSTART 40A L2 then either. OTA update? Std. programming with a total miles or total charges protection programming reducing total useable as the pack ages with miles or C rates both in and out? While the Prius Prime has only been charged 25-times in 9-months, I most certainly taken advantage of its power storage with mountain descents and extending small powered glides more so than the average driver would?

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime

    [​IMG]
    Fully detailed and ready to sell.​

    I have a showing of my 2020 in the morning - another full detail as soon as I get home tonight with a touch up tomorrow morning, and if it is a legit interested party at $17,650, I may have an opportunity to do the same full charge from flat to full on a brand new 2021 plugged into my MUSTART L2 before the week is out? Or maybe not.

    Wayne
     
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  17. BillLin

    BillLin PV solar, geothermal HVAC, hybrids and electrics

    Lucky buyer. Your car still looks like a beauty and we all know everything but maybe the suspension has been babied. The plastic wheel covers on our 2017 are a bit scraped up and there are a couple scratches down to the alloy wheel itself. Granite curbs around here are murderous on the careless driver, or I should say on the careless driver's car wheels.
     
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  18. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi Bill:

    No curbed wheel cover or rims thank goodness. A few very small chips in the hood from road debris and perfect in every other sense. It turns out the mechanic and the lady that was interested was from an auction site. I asked her why did she waste our time? All three of us? Before the mechanic arrived, I charged one more time at home from flat to full since I had the prospective buyer showing up this morning. 1 hr, 59 min, 51 sec from flat to full and the Prius Prime consumed/absorbed 5.816 kWh and still within the tight band 5.7 to 5.8 kWh.

    I had better stop charging at home as this is the fifth time in 2-weeks and our January - February consumption will be closing in on the 130 percent of the 359 kWh tier II allowance when rates rise to a staggering $0.40/kWh if I continue do this much longer. Not having to go to go the gas station could become a habit as California is now well into the $3.05+ range. I did add one-third of a tank on Tuesday to top off when I was up in Mount Palomar, CA near the La Jolla Indian Reservation gas station. They are still selling at $2.78/gallon there.

    I drove to San Diego tonight covering 34.9-miles of 95 percent Interstate and still have 5 percent SoC to consume for the drive home tonight. The range offered is still excellent at 36 to 38-miles on the highway and 42 to 48-miles in the city as it should be.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime PHEV-25

    [​IMG]
    Flat to full.​

    Wayne
     
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  19. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    The Driveway Auction lady was kind enough to send me the CarFax that she ordered. This is what they look like in 3 pages pulled from my phone that was pulled from hers.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime CarFax

    [​IMG]

    Everything checks out. ;)

    Wayne
     
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  20. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    While volunteering at the Italian restaurant last night, someone left a door ding in the drivers side upper rear quarter panel. While the pic does not really show its depth, I can see it when walking up to the drivers side door and looking down the profile.

    2020 Toyota Prius Prime

    [​IMG]
    75k miles with no dings. Less than a week for sale online and here we are.​

    I am going to have it fixed hopefully tomorrow given how small it is. :( :( :(

    Wayne
     
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