2016 Toyota Prius First Drive Review - First Drive Results

Discussion in 'Toyota Prius Family' started by xcel, Nov 18, 2015.

  1. thunderstruck

    thunderstruck Super Moderator

    Is the radar CC changed for 2017? Mine is horrible, not smooth in the least. It mashes the gas and brake pedals, just kills the fuel economy. It leaves way too much room in slow rush hour traffic, needs to get closer to car in front or someone invariably jumps in. And I do have distance set to the minimum of the 3 settings with steering wheel button.
     
  2. jcp123

    jcp123 Caliente!

    You should try radar cruise in a Freightliner sometime...it's hopeless.
     
  3. RedylC94

    RedylC94 Well-Known Member

    That much is also true of programming of the non-radar dumb cruise control of my 2011. The 1970's aftermarket cruise I had in my '81 Mazda was less irritating, at least when it worked.
     
  4. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    I took on taking a 2017 Toyota Mirai, Prius Prime, and the Prius Two Eco around the Shell Eco-Marathon test track during a short 20-minute window opened up this morning. I staged the three vehicles next to the track two days ago and they sat until it was time to roll. It was a no warm-up launch in high 40 degree F temps and I started at a very short 3-bars of SoC dropping to two in just two blocks. She ended up at 2 bars SoC yielding maybe 128 mpg as a guess?

    2017 Shell Eco-Marathon

    [​IMG]
    2017 Toyota Prius Two Eco, Prius Prime, and Mirai FCV.

    [​IMG]
    Shell Eco-Marathon test track - 136.5 mpg over 1.9 miles.​

    The 4 mi/kWh rated Prius Prime in EV mode allowed 6.3 mi/kWh while the 76 MPGe rated Mirai provided 117.8 MPGe on the same short track loop. Not bad given the conditions imho.

    Wayne
     
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  5. Jay

    Jay Well-Known Member

    moped mpgs :eek:
     
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  6. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    I have not tried the CC in my 2015 Prius Liftback.
     
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  7. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    I am parked at a Shell on Ann Arbor Rd. in Plymouth, MI after a lengthy calibration drive. The Prius Gen 4 aFCD offset news is unfortunately not good.

    106.0 mpg over 355.6 miles indicated.
    99.53 mpg over 362.7 miles actual for. 6.5 percent over report. :(

    The top off to top off fill saw the Prius consume 3.644 gallons.

    IMG_20170501_142814.jpg
    Wayne
     
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  8. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    So , the over-report is pretty close to the 7% of my Gen 3. That's a little disappointing. However , that 100 MPG on those roads in THIS weather is pretty fantastic.
     
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  9. BillLin

    BillLin MASS: 2018 Bolt EV and 2017 Prime

    re: radar cruise control

    If I were in daily stop and crawl traffic, I may be tempted to use the RCC, but for lighter traffic, the reliance on the good and steady driving behavior of the car ahead of you would drive me nuts, i.e. I rarely come across anyone driving steadily enough for me to tag along. This is no matter how good the RCC system is. The Prime's RCC is fairly smooth and following distance is configurable between about 100 to 160 feet. But I never gave it a chance because of the lack of a steady lead vehicle. I also didn't get to try it out on hilly terrain. Oh well... the Prime's the wife's car now so I will rarely be driving it except when we drive somewhere for vacation, as we did last week.
     
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  10. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    I don't follow. Period.
     
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  11. BillLin

    BillLin MASS: 2018 Bolt EV and 2017 Prime

    Sure, Edwin. Whatever you have to tell yourself... ;) :D
     
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  12. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    While I am in IL for a another day before flying back to Calif. tomorrow, I had my mom drive her normal routine to her sisters, to my nephews, to a local hospital, to Texas Road House and back home. She started from cold with 4-bars of SoC and I reset the Prius Two Eco in her driveway.

    2017 Toyota Prius Two Eco

    [​IMG]
    Moms Drive - 32.5 mi at 77.6 mpg indicated and 33.2 mi at 72.6 mpg actual ending with 4-bars of SoC.​

    Her Prius v would have achieved in the low to mid-40s on this same route in these temps with her previous Gen Three Prius Three achieving about 50 to 51 actual on the same. The new Prius drivetrain efficiency is something to behold.

    Wayne
     
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  13. ALS

    ALS Super Moderator Staff Member

    Hi Wayne,

    I don't know about the others but I'm very impressed with the fuel mileage you and others are achieving with the new forth Generation Prius.

    Al
     
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  14. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    I'm impressed with Wayne's mom's driving !
     
  15. thunderstruck

    thunderstruck Super Moderator

    Yea, I wonder if he trained her or if she trained him. The Gen 4 is a remarkable achievement in terms of efficiency. I'm still amazed how what was billed as a single generation improvement has played out. Makes you wonder just how much further than can push the envelope. Here's my drive home tonight, typical stop and go including driving home on the freeway.
    [​IMG]
     
  16. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    In the land of “It never rains in Sunny Southern California” and $2.75 to $5.50/gallon+ gasoline, this week’s ride is courtesy of Toyota in the form of the 2017 Toyota Prius Four Touring.

    It provides a somewhat comfortable 93.1 cu. ft. of pass vol., a very large 27.4 cu. ft. of cargo vol, and lists for a somewhat steep $32,980 incl. $865 D&H, Premium. Convenience ($1,705), and Hyper Sonic Red color ($395) + TTL.

    Some of that price sting is simple "MSRPonomics" as it can be picked up for $5,500 off or $27,500 + TTL here in Southern Calif. today.

    2017 Toyota Prius Four Touring

    [​IMG]

    The Four Touring arrives with Bi-LED headlamps, LED taillamps, Rain sensing wipers, rear int. wiper, 17" alloys, Intelligent Parking Sonar and Parking Assist, Soft-Tex interior, Qi charger - the new Galaxy S8+ does not fit :( - EnTune Premium Audio incl. embedded NAVI and JBL Audio <-- Not worth the price imho, auto up/down on all windows, heated front seats, 3-door proximity key, and tonneu cover all std.

    On the safety front, it includes the following standard equipment: VSC, TRAC, ABS, EBD, BA, Toyota Safety Sense-P with FCW, Auto Brake Assist, BSM, RCTA, RCC, LDA w/ Steering assist, and Auto High Beams.

    It rides and handles like any hatch thanks to the Touring's sport tuned double wishbone out back and struts up-front + low profile 17s providing the road holding. Steering is not quite there but closing in.

    I have not completed a calibration run on it yet but today's drive back from the Press Fleet Handlers office in Orange, Calif. to the local grocery store here in Carlsbad, Calif. provided yet another reason why the following continues to be the Prius' Mantra from an older Jim Croce song called “Bad Bad Leroy Brown/You Don't Mess Around With Jim”.


    You don't tug on superman's cape
    You don't spit into the wind
    You don't pull the mask off that old lone ranger
    And you don't mess around with …

    [​IMG]

    A few details about the above. I used our previous 2017 Prius Two Eco 350 mile+ calibration drive which yielded an aFCD offset of a rather onerous negative 6.5 percent. Meaning the (aFCD indicated * 0.935) will give you the actual efficiency result. This Prius Four Touring may be better but until I have a few hundred miles of calibrated distance and fuel to cover those miles, this is still just an estimate.

    This drive was completed this afternoon between 02:15 pm and 03:40 pm - I used the pics time stamps - across a small swath of Southern California on the "5". Radar CC was set at 62 mph and A/C was set at 75 degrees F with front seat priority.

    There were ~ 1.5-miles of surface streets before entering the Interstate and just 5 full stops to 0 mph along the entire route. RCC handled the full stops for < 3-seconds including the acceleration back up to highway speed. The only time I touched the accelerator or brakes over the entire drive was the first 1.5-miles of surface streets including multiple lights and stop signs and the final three blocks when exiting the 5 and turning up Tamarack to a Von's grocery store. Toyota's RCC is better than every other OEMs system including Audi, "other" Toyota's, Hyundai's, Kia's, especially Honda's POS system, Ford's, and Chevrolet. Traffic was relatively light for Southern Calif. Meaning it was moving pretty well with std. slowdowns every two or three miles with on-ramps/off-ramps and an average speed high of 48 mph before hitting the last 3-miles of stop and crawl through Oceanside, California.

    The early efficiency estimate = 77.0 mpg
    The actual miles traveled = 61.2 miles
    Actual average speed = 43.2 mpg

    77+ mpg from a 52-mpg combined rated vehicle simply by setting CC with A/C keeping me very comfortable in the humid 80 to 90+ degree temps and entertained with "The Pulse" on XM is pretty amazing in my book. The only thing an owner of the Prius will do over the first 100k miles is refuel it about 150 times, provide 10 oil changes, install a set of new tires once, and maybe purchase a new set of wiper blades in about 5-years if he or she wants.

    If low total cost of ownership makes up a large part of your buying decision, it is hard to beat a 4th gen Prius. They are just too damn reliable and even more efficient.

    Wayne
     
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  17. alster

    alster Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the review Wayne. I have to agree with you on the Prius. Our 2010 Prius is getting close to 160,000 miles. With summer average mpg, calculated of course, is about 54-55 mpg. Indicated is around 58-59 mpg, of course always over reading by 3-3.5 mpg. Perhaps the most reliable car out there with hardly any maintaince to worry about. I still change my own oil at 10,000 miles using Mobil One 100% synthetic oil, 0w20, 1 gallon in and after 10,000 miles nearly one gallon comes out. When the spark plugs were changed at about 108,000 miles they looked like the could easily go another 100,000 miles, unbelievable, as a kid in the 1960's, with my 61 Ford Falcon straight 6 cyinder and 3 speed manual on the column, spark plug changes were mandatory at 10,000 miles or less, along with a new condensor and points, anybody remember that era.

    I like the looks of the Ioniq much better than the new Prius, but that mandatory replacement of the drive belt at only 75,000 miles is a turn off. The Prius has no belts at all, which is the only car out there I believe with no belts at all. Even our 2016 Volt has a small belt on engine with no required replacement interval just inspection if I recall.
     
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  18. bestmapman

    bestmapman Fighting untruth and misinformation

    Nice Wayne. I will be curious to see what your highway technique is. My 2016 Prius 4 with ATP will let the engine turn off up to 74 MPH. I have been able to P&G at 70 MPH and get right at 60 MPG, no wind. I expect that you can do better than that. Also, I have noticed a pretty significant difference A/C off vs. A/C on. You might want to check that also.
     
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  19. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi All:

    I topped the Prius Four Touring off on Sunday morning and had Marian complete about 75 percent of the driving for the measured distance in and around San Diego Calif. The initial Garmin Elevation was indicating one of its way off elevation displays which happens on occasion.

    [​IMG]

    Initial Top off at a local Shell in Carlsbad, CA.​

    I headed out at 03:00 am this morning to complete the final aFCD calibration top off fill and knock out the steady states. By the time I reached the aFCD reset location on the 5, it was 04:00 am and traffic was beginning to build. By 04:45 am I had to call it off after completing just the 50 and 55 mph multi-direction runs due to excessive traffic side which was going to skew the results.

    Besides the waste of time, the calibration fill on the Touring indicates there was no negative offset like the Two Eco. I am happy to see that on the fully loaded Four Touring trim the offset was actually slightly positive by 1.19 percent and absolutely dead on if you used the non-calibrated and short Trip A/B/Odometer for distance. I sure wish Toyota would lock them all down like this given the production Prius Two Eco and its 6.5 percent over report we experienced a few months ago. :(

    In any case, the 82.2 mpg result from last week was actually 83.2 mpg simply by setting CC and letting the car do its thing among the Southern California afternoon maelstrom.

    As we have stated before, it is hard to put down a Prius for its prowess at staying away from the pump and now with the Two Eco, Prime, Four Touring knocked out, nothing will touch them.

    2017 Toyota Prius Four Touring aFCD Final Calibration

    [​IMG]
    Final Calibration Top off at the same Shell in Carlsbad, CA.

    [​IMG]
    Fill - 58.6 mpg over 82.2 mi - 59.3 mpg over 83.1 mi actual.​

    When it comes to other items, the Sport Tuned suspension of the Three and Four Touring trims is so much better than previous iterations. While completing the top offs, I shake the cars and trucks numerous times during the fills and the Four Touring barely rocked and returned to flat after letting go immediately. I like the Non-Touring’s ride a bit better but the looks of the low profile 17s and more engaging experience would be welcome by those that will never consider a Prius.

    Braking feel, linearity, and steering feel, are much better than the Gen 3 and the larger cargo volume of the 4th gen hatch is excellent. I placed our 2’-3” tall can recycling box into the hatch standing up and while it appears the hatch would close and the glass would be touching, it did not with about .5” of clearance between the box edge and the window glass.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Five Suggestions to Help Prius

    1. The std. 4th gen exterior, especially the vertical rear taillamps, is still problematic when it comes to consumer acceptance. Add the Primes front and rear end to the std. Prius lineup and another 10 to 20 percent may take another look at this engineering marvel.

    2. Moving inside, the white interior trim and trim pieces has got to go.

    3. And so does the sun visors that only cover half the side windows when swung out. $32k + TTL cars should not have sun visors that would be found on $4k cars in India and it is time to put this problem behind you on the Yaris, Corolla, and Prius lineup.

    4. Prime, make it seat five, not four.

    5. In addition, it is time to embrace Android Auto, especially in the base models. Prius NAVI and Voice activation is flaky. Googles Android Auto with Google Maps are superior in every respect and come on cars that can be purchased for half the price of the Four Touring and 50 percent less than a Two Eco.

    Toyota, please work on these five items and not only will consumer acceptance and sales improve, you will have made a better car in the process.

    I might have another go at the steady states after midnight on Wednesday as I will be attending the 18 Hyundai Sonata refresh and 18 Hyundai Elantra GT intro over the next 3-days here in San Diego. But first I am going back to sleep for a few hours. :)

    Wayne
     
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  20. BillLin

    BillLin MASS: 2018 Bolt EV and 2017 Prime

    Something of a TARDIS... :) (Dr. Who reference)
     
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