My new 2012 6MT Elantra is home

Discussion in 'Hyundai' started by schuylkill, Jun 9, 2011.

  1. schuylkill

    schuylkill Well-Known Member

    I just got it so I'm not familiar with it yet but it was a breeze to drive, no wind but 96 F and humid when I left the dealer. I used the AC on low for about the first 45 miles of the 80 or so mile ride (I didn't check exact miles etc.) but I did manage 41.1 mpg on the car's gauge, NICE on coasting down hills and staying around 60 on the interstate. I was around 37mpg with air on, it really bumped up when I turned it off. I have an UG but probably won't hook it up until Saturday. I left my civic cx at the dealers which is near where I work, I'm taking a bus down to pick it up on Saturday late afternoon. $24.50 for a one way Trailways ride and I'll have a 3-1/2 mile walk to the dealer from the bus stop. If it's raining I will call a friend from work who offered to pick me up at the bus stop. It will be my great adventure, how boring am I? The sticker was $17,550 and I paid $16,925 and the total with tax and tags was $18,129.45. I'm REALLY pleased with the mpg on my first ride.
    :woot:
     
  2. MaxxMPG

    MaxxMPG Hasta Lavista AAA-Vee Von't Be Bach

    Sounds awesome! Once you get the gauge calibrated and start exploring the capabilities, you will be amazed at how far the car travels on a tank of fuel.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2011
  3. 2RR2NV

    2RR2NV Ultimate Newbie

    CONGRATS!!!! can't wait to see some pics.
     
  4. strick3963

    strick3963 Active Member

    Congrats! I'm sure you'll love it.

    I just ordered an Ultraguage for mine and am looking forward to the improved numbers it will bring.
     
  5. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    I'd love to play with one of those to see how it compares to my '02 5spd. :D

    I'll echo the request for pictures!
     
  6. bryantest

    bryantest Member

    Pics Pics Pics! :)
     
  7. MaxxMPG

    MaxxMPG Hasta Lavista AAA-Vee Von't Be Bach

    Oh, and so you know - the '11 Elantra rides and handles real nice with tire pressures of 52 front and 42 rear. Don't ask me how I know this.
     
  8. schuylkill

    schuylkill Well-Known Member

    Just pumped mine to 46 all around, they were all at 34. I'll adjust per your insights tomorrow. Pictures are not my strong point but I'll eventually get some. It looks like the car that Wayne drove.
     
  9. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Super Moderator Staff Member

    :biglol:
     
  10. MaxxMPG

    MaxxMPG Hasta Lavista AAA-Vee Von't Be Bach

    Try what you have first and then share your findings.
    I have been reading some accounts of a rear axle hop that I would equate with too much rear roll stiffness. Many front drive cars have this trait, so I tend to use less pressure in the rear to tame the bunny hopping that front drivers tend to exhibit when cornering.
     
  11. schuylkill

    schuylkill Well-Known Member

    I didn't have any handling problems but things were definitely more sensitive, the steering is very touchy. When going over large seams on the interstate it was like a drum was being
    beaten under the car, but that was an occasional situation. Yesterday morning's commute I got 43 mpg and today 47 on the car's gauge, so unless tire wear is an issue this is a worthwhile move.
     
  12. 2RR2NV

    2RR2NV Ultimate Newbie

    guess that's something else i need to do.... time to hook up the compressor.
     
  13. schuylkill

    schuylkill Well-Known Member

    I'm very happy with my mpgs with the limited experience I have with the techniques used here. I am able to get into the low 50s on my commutes but then the congestion destroys my yield. I have been looking for alternate routes but when leaving work, with all of the construction going on, there is no escape. If things get busier at work I'll be able to work more OT and so leave later than 5:30 which should help. Yesterday I drove to my parents house in South Jersey to show them the car they bought for me and they were very impressed with all of the standard features. Their last two cars have been Camrys. I had a choice of either an accident route or a construction route on the way over and on the way home I put on the air and took it easy. I find myself being consumed by a desire to get better mpg which is both a challenge and a curse. The car is wonderful for my needs and I am certainly enjoying it. (I may have to keep the XM!)

    On a side note I am having no luck getting my sig updated with my mpg graphic. I don't see how to edit my profile. I am wondering if it is a problem with Norton which I get with my Comcast account or because I am using Chrome? Or just my lack of insight?

    Also I had my UG attached to my 98 Civic and now on the Elantra. It detected the Elantra having a MAP sensor. Does anyone know if this is correct for this car or where I can find this information? I am spoiled by the mass of information available online by the Civic community. I was able to download free shop manuals for both my 1991 and 1998 civics.
     
  14. schuylkill

    schuylkill Well-Known Member

    I'm onto editing the signature now! And I have a vacation day off from work tomorrow:)
     
  15. schuylkill

    schuylkill Well-Known Member

    Had my best commute to work this morning with 47.2 mpg on UG which read 50.8 on car. It seems that at avg MPH over 45 the difference between the gauges is the max, 30 and under it is only maybe 1 mpg off. The UG is definitely closer to reality known when I fill up. Pumped the front tires up to 52 psi per Maxxmpg's suggestion and the car is much tighter now, it is amazing the improvement in handling. Also I have found that staying on Route 309 even with it's many lights as I hit suburbia and killing the engine is giving better results than meandering the back streets and avoiding lights as much as possible.

    I will have some pictures this weekend. We had a hail storm last week here at work and I got a couple of small dents on the roof, really have to look to see them. And of course a couple of paint chips from the trucks on Interstate 78.
     
  16. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    Very nice!! You are well on your way to much higher numbers. :D
     
  17. schuylkill

    schuylkill Well-Known Member

    Hey Sean,
    Do you have advice or cautions on FASing this new Elantra? I have been making very limited straight down hill runs with the engine off and then bump starting in 6th at 40 mph. I've had no problems with steering at these speeds and I have tested the brakes with several pumps but have yet to have them lose power assist so I don't know the limits yet, and whether they vary with speed etc. I am most concerned with any known issues with FAS and the Elantra. I certainly don't want to damage a new car in any way. I've read that batteries and starters on nonhybrid cars aren't made to FAS. That is an issue but not a great concern. How about the ECU and the car's electronics in general? I turn off all accessories before I shut down the engine, I feel better doing it that way and using the devices switches to turn them on and off.
    Regarding the ECU, it isn't normally turned off and then on again so quickly, how may this be detrimental?

    I know to hit high numbers FAS is the way to go but I am still concerned and hesitant. Any links to known accurate technical reading on how a non-hybrid car is affected by this practice would be appreciated.
     
  18. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    Hi, SchuylKill! I do indeed have quite a bit to say about FAS in non-hybrids but I'm currently on the road and as much as I love my iPhone it really isn't suited to long treatises. I'll write more when I arrive at my destination and can get at a keyboard.
     
  19. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    Okay, now I've got a physical keyboard to work with. :)

    I'll address your questions in order below.

    I have no out of the ordinary advice or cautions related to FASing your Elantra but you do need to pay careful attention to all the relevant safety concerns. First and foremost, if you can't execute all the proper actions with full knowledge of exactly how your car will react in any situation don't do this on public roads! This is very important. You have to put safety first. ALWAYS.

    The above applies to any driving behavior on public roads -- keep conditions in mind and remember that good hypermiling requires full awareness of the 360* environment around your vehicle at all times. Anticipate conditions and act accordingly.

    When executing a FAS you want to have the key in the ACC position as short a period as you can manage because safety features (such as ABS and AIRBAGS!!) are only active when the key is in the ON position. To accomplish this, put the car in neutral while releasing the accelerator, wait for the RPM to drop down to around 1K, then flip the key to the ACC position for as short a time as you can without the engine "dieseling" back on. It should be less than 3s but how much less will have to be something you discover through trial and error. If you catch the right point in the drop the engine should kill immediately and allow you to go back to the ON position very soon after. In my Elantra that is right before the lowest point the RPM drops to -- and that point is under normal idle speed. If (as in my Elantra) you find that the headlights don't work in the ACC position look for a key position between ON and ACC position that will kill the engine but not the lights -- I found one roughly 1/3 the way between with the key closest to the ON position. Using this position I can even sometimes accomplish a FAS without the ECU rebooting at all (seen as a lack of instantaneous FE readout freeze on my ScanGauge).

    Your power steering is electric so it will cut out momentarily at the initiation of the FAS but it will come back as soon as the electronics reinitialize. The difference between active and inactive power steering will be much more pronounced at low speeds and in tighter radius turns. You should practice in deserted areas -- preferably empty parking lots. Go through the power steering transitions multiple times so you are familiar with the changes while cornering -- if you aren't prepared you'll understeer when the power steering kicks out and oversteer when it comes back because of the changes in required effort. This can be anticipated and compensated for but you should stick to straight line FASes until you've developed this ability.

    You'll also lose power braking assist somewhere between 3 and 5 full presses of the brake pedal. Vacuum assist is only used when the pedal moves so if you use steady pressure when braking you shouldn't have to worry about it but find that deserted area and run it out so that you know how much force on the pedal is needed to stop your car without assist. This is crucial! You don't want to misjudge out on the road and rear end someone because you failed to apply enough pressure to stop in time! Because I know what the limits are for my car I have yet to run out of braking assist but should I hit that level for some reason, I do know how hard to press to get the same stopping power.

    The second half of safely FASing is learning how to get the engine running quickly and at will. Once again, if this isn't completely second nature (requiring no more thought than shifting gears), DON'T DO IT. One way is by using the key. This entails another interruption of power to your electrical systems (notably your headlights in most vehicles!) and there is a delay before your engine is running. You'll need to prepare for this brief interval before motive power is available.

    The second and better way is to bump start (as you've been doing). It uses no extra 12V power, doesn't interrupt any of your electrical systems, and spins the engine up more quickly than the starter can -- resulting in nearly instantaneous power availability. I recommend a two stage bump start procedure to keep clutch wear at a minimum. If you simply partially engage the clutch until the engine starts you get quite a bit of slippage and I call that a "slip start." It can be smooth but causes more wear than I'm comfortable with. To avoid this I actually use a very short duration clutch engagement to impart just enough force to barely get the engine to turn over. Once it "catches" the engine will spike in RPM and you can use this to help you rev match to the proper gear. Where possible, use at least 2 gears higher than you'd normally use for the road speed when performing the actual bump start, then shift to the proper gear for the speed. Done properly this is smooth and very fast -- I can get my Elantra bump started and in gear faster than most drivers simply shift gears and it is usually gentle enough that passengers can't tell what I've done. It also causes a lot less wear than even starting the car from a complete stop. Just run through the clutch pedal position changes quickly but smoothly -- you don't want full engagement but something close to it for just a fraction of a second. Think of the times you've seen someone spinning a basketball on his or her finger -- that person keeps the ball spinning with a quick, glancing blow to the ball every once in a while. You are trying to spin the engine over with a similar procedure and with as little drive-line shock (jarring) as you can manage.

    This brings us to the questions of battery, starter, and accessories. Firstly, a warmed up engine will start very very quickly with minimal starter activity. This is important because most starter wear is caused by heat... generated by long cranking sessions. Don't worry about wear caused by the hot engine starts -- they are too short to cause much at all. I've got the original starter in my Elantra still at over 100K miles and it has been used much more than the average for the entire time I've owned it (purchased at just 17mi on the odometer). Many other CleanMPG members have put ridiculous numbers of miles on their vehicles with constant usage of the starter and no issues -- some well over 200K miles.

    The accessories and ECU won't be damaged by cycling the power -- they are designed to cope with transient electrical conditions because things can and do go wrong with automotive systems. This shouldn't concern you.

    This leaves the battery. The 12V battery does need to be monitored when you are FASing. Make sure it is a visible gauge on your UltraGauge at all times so that you can ensure that the voltage doesn't drop too far. If your battery is in good condition, warm weather with minimal electrical load (headlights cause a significant load) you will likely have nothing to worry about. Be aware though that the more you FAS the less time the alternator is active for charging the 12V. With headlights (or other heavy electrical loads) on, you should watch the voltage and start the car before it drops below about 11.7 or so in order to avoid damaging the lead plates inside the battery. I dip lower than that at times but my battery is an Optima Yellow Top deep cycle (very expensive but has totally been worth the purchase price for headlight, wipers, and cold weather FASing). The higher the electrical load and/or the colder the ambient temperature you have to deal with, the shorter engine off time you can utilize while still keeping the battery within a safe voltage range. You don't want to get stranded because you flattened your battery too far!

    Bump starting will help by eliminating the starter power requirements but if your battery starts getting low simply alternate FAS and NICE-ON (coasting in neutral while the engine is idling) to increase charging time. If you find that the battery slowly drops in charge over several days due to FASing you can also hook up trickle charger while the car is parked at home to help offset the lack of alternator charging -- both Andrew and I do that with our cars because we spend more time with the engine off than on when driving. ;)

    You are right to be cautious about this -- driving any vehicle is flat out dangerous and traffic conditions are continuing to deteriorate because drivers refuse to acknowledge this simple fact. However, most of the danger in FASing can be directly attributed to environmental concerns (traffic behavior, emergency situations you weren't prepared for, lack of familiarity with all behavior of your vehicle with the engine off, etc) which can be avoided with anticipation and full understanding of your vehicle's characteristics. There is almost none to the hardware/electronics in the vehicle.

    I hope the above has helped and please continue to ask questions as they occur to you! We want you to improve your mileage safely and we'll be happy to assist in any way possible to help you achieve this goal.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2011
  20. 2RR2NV

    2RR2NV Ultimate Newbie

    you MT guys have it SOOOOOOO gewd!!
     

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