Michelin Energy Saver A/S HCH-II

Discussion in 'Honda Hybrids' started by ioverholt, Oct 14, 2009.

  1. ioverholt

    ioverholt Member

    The recent Tire Rack tire article came out just in time for me. My car had worn out, mismatched tires when I bought it in January. I've been planning to buy new tires before the wet season starts. This year is supposed to be very wet, and everyone knows SoCal and water do not mix. :D

    I was leaning towards the Yokohama dB Super E-Specs because of higher lateral grip. I wanted to reduce rolling resistance while increasing grip. Last night I put in an order for the Michelin Energy Saver A/S. The rolling resistance was the lowest of the test bunch while handling was near the top. They also are quite a bit less expensive than the Yoko's, partly because of the current Michelin rebate.

    I'll weigh one of the stock wheels before the tires are mounted just so I know what the wheel weight actually is. I was considering changing the wheels for lighter ones, but Manuel reported the stock weight to be 12 pounds which is light enough for me.

    There are many inflation threads on the forum, but I saw one reference by Wayne to the "under pressure" article. I can't find that article. Where is it?

    I bought my tires through Costco and they use nitrogen to fill. I'll try to get them to inflate the tires to my specs, but I have a feeling they will be resistant to go above placard. SO, does anyone have experience with adding compressed air to the nitrogen fill? Are there any issues to be aware of? Should I just bleed off the nitrogen and refill with air?

  2. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    Here's the Under pressure article: http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11652

    As for filling with Nitrogen, it has no benefit for auto tires that we've been able to discern. Some places claim that nitrogen "leaks" out of the tire slower than "normal" air... completely ignoring the fact that
    1. The air is mostly nitrogen to begin with and
    2. if nitrogen does leak more slowly then you'd have ever smaller percentages of other gases every time you filled the tires.

    I hope that helps!
  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk 2010 Prius (CAN Touring) Staff Member

    Often when things are foisted on you, the most expedient course is to just carry on. I think nitrogen fill is a bit of a foist. I would just let them do their thing, likely putting the air pressure on the manufacturer's guideline, then roll 'round the corner to your local gas station and set things right. I would not worry about the nitrogen that's in there, getting diluted with regular air, etc: no big deal.

    As Sean says, ordinary air is 4/5 nitrogen, so not a a lot of difference. You could also ditch the green valve caps if you like.

    Oh, and please let us know how they work out, of course ;)
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2009
  4. 06hch2

    06hch2 Well-Known Member

    how does the weight of this tire compare to oem, and when did it last snow in lakewood?
  5. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk 2010 Prius (CAN Touring) Staff Member

    According to TireRack, both Bridgestone Insignia SE200-02 (one OEM Honda used) and Michelin Energy Saver A/S are 18 lb. That's in 195/65R15. Dunno about snow in Lakewood.
  6. ioverholt

    ioverholt Member

    Tire weight should be within a pound of stock. My car had Dunlop SP-31 tires stock (I think) because there are 2 of those still on the car. I can weigh a tire before it's mounted, but I expect it to be 18 or 19 pounds.

    I don't think I mentioned anything about snow. It is an El Nino year and driving in LA gets dicey when it's wet. Anyway, there is snow in the mountains an hour away, so having summer tires means I could not drive this car to the mountains in the winter.
  7. ioverholt

    ioverholt Member

    I had the tires mounted on Saturday. I haven't given them much of a shakedown yet. I did notice that on the freeway (grooved concrete) there is occasional squirrelyness. I couldn't see anything funky about the surface, but I felt the rear of the car moving side to side. It made me wonder if the lug bolts were all tight, but I haven't checked yet.

    I think I've heard of new tires needing some miles to "wear in". Not sure if this behavior relates to that phenomenon.

    The tires were only inflated to 37 despite the ticket being marked with inflate to sidewall. I pumped them up more last night, but I'm running much lower pressures than many others on this forum. I haven't read all the pressure posts yet and I want to see how the car handles at 45 before going higher.

    So far I am happy with the FE. When I paid more attention to the IFCD yesterday afternoon (in the morning I was hurrying), I was able to keep the gauge in the top quarter of the range relatively easy. And the inflation at that point was lower than the old tires were.

    After a couple of tanks with these tires I'll post my MPG. My data won't be that useful because the driving conditions are not well controlled. My wife mainly drives the car and she does mostly city driving without paying much attention to the IFCD. I rarely drive the car and when I do it's mostly highway. It might be hard to pick out the tire factor from the gas and mileage log.

    I'll keep my green valve caps because it makes me feel more green. :D
  8. ioverholt

    ioverholt Member

    I did a couple of braking and handling tests last night. This is with 45PSI. These tires have good grip! I could brake really hard without engaging the ABS. The tires turn in good and hold well without squealing.

    My previous experience with Michelins has left me wanting more. My Volvo 940 turbo wagon had MXV4s when I bought it. Those tires screamed and slid through many turns. I put on Kumho Ecsta ASX and was much happier. My truck came with LTX M/S and they also screamed through turns. I now have Goodyear Wranglers on the front (I got them almost free) and the truck can corner much faster than it did with the Michelins.

    I'm still reading other posts about tire pressure before I decide to inflate the tires higher. My wife has no feel for what the car or tires are doing at any given moment. So I do not want to set the car up in a way that she has to plan stops or turns. Because that will just result in a crash.:eek:

  9. Jess

    Jess Well-Known Member

    Ian, how have those Michelin's been for you? Have you found them to be comparable to the OEM Dunlops or better?

  10. tstodola

    tstodola Crazy California tree hugger

    I inflated my tires (excuse me, tyres) to 40 psi the other day after reading the article on air pressure and the effect on fuel mileage. I have not had the cahones to go up to 45 psi.
    I will be checking the wear on them over the next couple of months. Yes, it is raining quite a bit here in So. Cal., so wet grip is important (now that the 2 years worth of road grit and oil have been washed away).
  11. Jess

    Jess Well-Known Member

    No worries. I ran mine at 44psi for a year or so and then bumped it to 50psi and then finally 60psi. I have over 41k on them and I noticed more of an increase in FE when I bumped them to 60psi than at 50psi.

    I look forward to hearing from your experience with them. I may have another 10k on mine and am seriously considering the Michelin's.

  12. hobbit

    hobbit He who posts articles

    I realize this is an oldish thread, but I just got a set of A/Ses
    onto my Prius. Here's a page about the swap. So far they're
    doing really well, although it's winter and once spring hits
    and they've got more miles on them we'll really see. So far
    so good in the snow, too. That's what the "A/S" is supposed to
  13. Jess

    Jess Well-Known Member

    Very nice Hobbit! I have to stop looking into these or I'm going to run out and buy some before I really need them. :D

  14. Jess

    Jess Well-Known Member

    I just bought a set of the Energy Savers from Tire Rack. They've been reduced from 112.00 to 99.00ea, plus you can get a 70.00 rebate on them.

  15. Jess

    Jess Well-Known Member

    I got my Energy Savers today! :woot:

    My Dunlops have 4/32 of tread left and part of me wants to get what I can out of them... but the other part of me is just itching to get those Michelin's on! :D

  16. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk 2010 Prius (CAN Touring) Staff Member

    Keep us posted, Jess. I predict you will crack soon... ;)
  17. Jess

    Jess Well-Known Member

    Ok guys. I need some peace of mind. I'm going to get the Energy Savers installed, but I can't for the next week or 2. Currently, I have them in a shed against the house. They're lying horizontally on cardboard, stacked 4 high. The temps have been on the cool side, upper 20F's /lower 30's in the evening and 40F's and 50's during the day.

    They've already been in there for a week. Do you think they will be okay for a another week or 2?

    Everything I read says that have to be in a cool, dry place w/o extreme temps and they should be covered. I'm considering putting each of them in a large garbage bag and/or bringing them in the house. I know my wife will have an issue w/ it, but for as much as they cost, I'm sure she can deal w/ it.

    Any thoughts?

    Thank you!

  18. Dream'R

    Dream'R Well-Known Member

    I don't think you have anything to be concernrd about regarding the temperatures. My only suggestion would be to stand them up on their treads rather than stacking them on their sides. I assume they are being kept dry.

    We'll be interested to read your comments once you get them installed. I'm not overly impressed with the OEM Dunlops for traction or cornering. I still enjoy the overall driving experience and safety, with less concern with getting that last .01 mpg from LRR tires.


  19. Jess

    Jess Well-Known Member

    Thanks Dream'R,

    I've never (knock on wood) experienced any issues w/ my Dunlops other than the fact that they're loud as hell. I'm excited to experience the difference w/ the Michelins. They are supposed to be quieter after all.

    I've read comments to have the tires vertical and other comments say horizontal. My thinking was that if they're vertical that gravity would misshape them?

    They are nice and dry. I put them in garbage bags to keep them clean. :)

  20. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk 2010 Prius (CAN Touring) Staff Member

    I've alway got either our snows (on rims) or summer tires in the garage, layed horizontally in a stack. When I got the snows put on the the tire place wrapped the regular wheels in large plastic bags. I retained those, and drape one of those over the stack of tires (and top it with a chunk of carpet and my oil change apparatus), to help keep off the dust, UV, etc.

    The whole stack doesn't sit directly on the garage slab: I've put a rubber door mat (you know the kind made from recycled tires, with open weave) under the bottom tire.

    Also, once during their duration of being stacked I typically unstacked them, take them inside, clean and wax them, check the tread, etc, so they do get a bit of a breather.

    They seem ok. I have seen a Princess Auto item, a pole with spacers for tires, but haven't bothered.

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