rear tire wear,,lots of noise,, cupping

Discussion in 'Honda Hybrids' started by sprintman, Jun 27, 2009.

  1. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    How did you like that vehicle?
     
  2. GardenWeasel

    GardenWeasel Well-Known Member

    No quieter than the HCH. Steering a little more 'isolated'. NO TACHOMETER!! :( Gauges are kinda right-of-center.:( Seats much more comfy for my wife and myself. LOVE the hatchback concept over a trunk. LOVE that back seats fold down! :bananapartyhat:Dash is 'taller'. Transmission seems much smoother. Wife's side of car is actually SMALLER!! She has less room for her legs! (she is 6' with very long legs). But she said if I wanted to trade - fine with her! But I do love the HCH! It's all going to depend on my next appointment with my dealer... Wish we had some rumors on the 2010 HCH!
     
  3. nervousmini

    nervousmini Well-Known Member

    You have it correct:

    Perfect spec = -1 deg,39min
    Max positive allowed = +1 deg,05min
    Max negative allowed = -0 deg,45min.

    That being said, the ideal spec for the least amount of rolling resistance - but still being within Honda spec would allow you to have 0 deg camber or neutral (not pos and not neg). However I would recommend that you keep just a touch of negative for driveability, say somewhere in the area of -0 deg,30min and -0 deg,45min (or 1/2 to 3/4 degree of negative camber). Now this is just based on my general knowledge, there may be someone more familiar with Hondas that would have a different suggestion.

    Glad to help. I may not have the engineering or writing background to explain all the theory as well as psyshack and r.i.d.e, but I know what I can get to work in my own day to day job. Consider yourself a "layman" no longer:woot:
     
  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk 2010 Prius (CAN Touring) Staff Member

    My day job (except I just got canned, victim of the slow economy) was structural and steel detail drafting/checking. Also not an engineer, but you pick up a little. Largely static structures, but some rides, where dynamics come into play.

    What's the reason for negative camber? Just taking a crack at it: anytime you are cornering hard (something I rarely if ever do), a little negative camber will keep the rear end more stable and resistant to swinging out, on the outside of curve side. When all the slop in the suspension components is squeezed out by the road pushing inward at the u/s of the tire, the tire probably goes from neg camber to near vertical.

    I guess the "how much" is the issue ;)
     
  5. nervousmini

    nervousmini Well-Known Member

    Sorry to hear about your job, hope you find something else soon.

    As far as your understanding of the purpose of neg camber - you got it! How much is indeed the magic question! And it largely is a factor of purpose and design. The vehicle will be designed to work within a range of settings and is set from the factory to be "somewhere" within those specs. For those of us with more specific needs, we have to be more specific in the settings.

    Sometimes these settings are not adjustable - what you got is what you get. I'm not happy about that on the rear of my blazer :mad: , there is a bit of toe and camber I would love to get rid of back there but with no provision to adjust I'm stuck.
     
  6. Right Lane Cruiser

    Right Lane Cruiser Penguin of Notagascar

    Medel, I also add my hopes for a quick change in job situation. :(
     
  7. Kacey Green

    Kacey Green Well-Known Member

    Me too, the only thing that's been leaked (and not confirmed) is fold down rear seats.
     
  8. Kacey Green

    Kacey Green Well-Known Member

    Oh and the full model change could happen anywhere from 2010-2012 based on the rumors that they'll run the 8th gen long, most bets are on a 2011 model in 2010 sometime.


    All just speculation and conjecture at this point.
     
  9. GardenWeasel

    GardenWeasel Well-Known Member

    Nice! (fingers crossed it ends up being true!) I test drove a Prius at the dealer just south of you - maybe I'll drag my feet until September...
     
  10. Kacey Green

    Kacey Green Well-Known Member

    Just south like next door, or on my side of Cola (in Irmo, that dealer was the one I sold my Prius to)
     
  11. GardenWeasel

    GardenWeasel Well-Known Member

    "south like next door" is it. New dealer...
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2009
  12. Kacey Green

    Kacey Green Well-Known Member

    If you do go 'Yota Go to Jim Hudson and tell Mr. Curley (one of their managers) Kacey Green @ Midlands Honda Sent you please. They treated me the way I treat my customers.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2009
  13. psyshack

    psyshack He who posts articles

    If I may:

    On a FWD car with a multilink rear end 0 to 1 is ideal. All you want is the rear to follow the front. Much like a dog dragging it's butt across the yard or your carpet. With a FWD car, even a HCHII with multilink out back. The multilink will keep the camber in ratio with wheel travel. Very tight! You want grip. But at the same time a uniform pattern of rolling resistance. If you have a lot of negative then your rolling on the inside of the tire. But with the common short sidewall height more times that not,,,, you will not roll the tire over on the full tread in a corner and have a loose rear end.

    If you have multilink front and rear,,, say like a Accord if you lower the car the front wheels don't need work. But the rear will squat out very bad. Thus the needed camber kits. If your driving demands good handling. Then dropping a Accord will give you great results on if you address the rear. On a FWD car when you get on the gas they suck up the front wheels and straighten that up. The rear squats. Its called weight shift. If the rear is already negative any at all and you drop it. You have more under power.

    Just because of the improved camber on the HCHII it sticks better in corners with bad expansion joints on a clover leaf we drive weekly than my 06 EX Sedan. The rear end would jump out bad! But stay on the gas and let the car wag it's ass put it back on the tires for a good bite. And it would straighten up. While the HCHII can't and will not do the same clover leaf as fast. It's not due to the tires or the camber. It's the crappy CVT! Thus the whole car drifts with the front and rear suspension in chaos. And the stability control lost! It just wont's to stop the car. No were near as good and a joke compared to the MZ3 system.

    To drive a HCHII with to much negative camber must be a nightmare.
     
  14. GardenWeasel

    GardenWeasel Well-Known Member

    I love my Honda dealer! :D I'm getting control arm replacement next week. Really good news! :Banane25:So here comes the bad news - shop says all 4 of my tires are badly worn and need replacing. That is especially important because the control arm replacement comes with an alignment...

    Would this be the right time to replace one of my rear springs too? (left rear of car, measured to edge of fender is 25.5 inches, and right rear is 26.25 inches. Left side is visibly lower than the right side from rear). I'm tempted to call and have a new rear spring waiting and ready to be installed concurrent with control arms installation...

    Kacey - sorry I missed meeting you today!
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2009
  15. nervousmini

    nervousmini Well-Known Member

    Damn psyshack.....You really know your suspension!:D

    I don't think I could have explained it any better, and I consider myself pretty strong in that area.

    p.s. love that MZ3 setup as well - so stable and predictable.
     
  16. psyshack

    psyshack He who posts articles

    Make them replace the spring! I had to have the same spring replaced on my 06 Civic. My 06 EX was trash. And also had the camber issue. I got rid of the car before idiot Honda would admit there was a issue. No issues with my wonderful Mazda3.
     
  17. psyshack

    psyshack He who posts articles

    If BMW was to make a cheap FWD car it would be the MZ3! It has been a joy to own and drive. Makes you wonder what Honda and others are thinking. :D
     
  18. Kacey Green

    Kacey Green Well-Known Member

    Hopefully next time.
     
  19. GardenWeasel

    GardenWeasel Well-Known Member

    I'm starting to get antsy about the 2010.... add a sun roof to the rumored fold down rear seats and I'll be downright 'distracted' waiting for the new HCH!:banane58:
     
  20. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk 2010 Prius (CAN Touring) Staff Member

    Fold-down rear seats would likely also bring the Civic Hybrid trunk volume inline with reg Civic. We couldn't quite shoehorn two full size suitcases into our '06's trunk last night, on an airport run, meaning the rear seat passengers were sharing accomodation with a suitcase.

    Sorry: I appreciate this is getting off-topic.
     

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