What a Wonderful (Hypermiling) Couple!

Discussion in 'Volkswagen' started by Chuck, Aug 22, 2008.

  1. jamesqf

    jamesqf Well-Known Member

    There's something about this that just seems way off-base to me. This couple is interested in saving fuel, right? So they're going to fly to the US (burning quite a bit of jet fuel), and enter into a competition in which it appears they'll be driving around not to get to some place where they want/need to go, but just to show how little fuel they can use while driving? Seems to me they could save far more by not doing any of this...

    Or to put it another way, the real way to win a fuel-economy contest is not to enter :)
  2. Chuck

    Chuck just the messenger

    So you never fly?

    It's kind of off base you post non-postive stuff the vast majority of the time....and what's really strange is you not talking about your Insight in the Daily Grind - very unusual for an Insight driver - last weekend a guy was delighted to get a MIMA demo from me so he would know what his Insight will do when MIMA is installed.

    It's going to be ironic if you have a problem being called out like you just did with this couple.

    Be a bit more upbeat please.
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2008
  3. MT bucket

    MT bucket I want my MPG!

    I have almost perfected the NYCTDT? in 4 years as a messenger :p I never litter though i always recyle :p
  4. PTDixieGal

    PTDixieGal Can I go fishing now? GOOD

    That article was well-written. Nice to see some positive exposure...sure wish the AAA would've gotten onboard.
  5. PTDixieGal

    PTDixieGal Can I go fishing now? GOOD

    I'd like to add something, DeltaFlyer, if I may. I'm not a frequent flyer but I do have family that live in the Seattle area. I do have some frequent flyer miles I can use if anything happens to grandma. If I were to drive nonstop from Little Rock to Seattle I could probably make it in 36 hours depending on road conditions and the route that I take (speed limits). If you do the math, I'd come out paying more on gas than I would if I'd paid for my ticket in advance if I don't break even. Therefore in some cases it is more eco-friendly to fly instead of drive.
  6. jamesqf

    jamesqf Well-Known Member

    Haven't in several years. Just can't see burning 7-8 gph to go get a $100 hamburger somewhere. One of these days I may get back into soaring, or buy one of of the electric motor gliders, or maybe take up parasailing, but right now I have too few hours...

    As for flying commercial, I don't if I can possibly avoid it. However, you seem to have missed my point. I'm not saying that people shouldn't fly places, or even that this couple shouldn't fly to the US for a vacation if they like. It's just the basic absurdity of burn a lot of fuel to show how little you can use.

    Just find some positive stuff for me to post about.

    But that's just me. I don't see the point of going on about the details of everyday life, and to me the Insight is everyday life.
  7. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi James:

    ___If we did not have competitions, many would not be receiving 70 and 100 + from their Prius and Insight’s on the highway let alone 50 + from their Ford Ranger P/U’s. I do not know your FE but I suspect it is not nearly as good as it could be? If not, read, learn, place into practice what has been learned at comps across the USA and do so immediately. Anything less is downright unpatriotic.

    ___Good Luck

  8. Chuck

    Chuck just the messenger

    Flying to get a hamburger - you must be kidding.

    Please give this couple half a break - they live in Australia. Only 21 million live down under in the middle of the ocean. If they lived in America, it would be more practicle for them to drive - like Wayne ;)

    It's there, but you choose to ignore them....News Articles about advances in PHEVs, Honda's next hybrids, ventures T. Boone Pickens is undertaking, more. Add to that the countless improvements members have made on their fuel economy, sharing their hints....it's helped me improve my morning commute 100%. You choose to opt out of the Daily Grind and postive stories.
    None of the other Insight drivers here consider it a bore to drive, nor have the dozen or so that have taken mine for a spin. For hypermilers, any car can be interesting when it comes to improving your ride. It like others that discuss their golf game.

    The reason for CleanMPG is to be a hypermiler-friendly site to current and future hypermilers. To exchange notes, provide encouragement ;) ;) ;) , find out what does and does not work. This is the core of CleanMPG.
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2008
  9. jamesqf

    jamesqf Well-Known Member

    Not at all: it's a commonplace in flying circles. You've got a plane, and you want to fly it on a fine Sunday morning. But the problem with most airports is that they're located quite a ways from anywhere else, so you fly to airport X, grab a hamburger in the coffee shop, and then fly home. Figure the typical light plane burns about 8 gph, and there's your $100 hamburger.

    And? It seems as though you're still missing the point. So you can get from A to B using very little gas, which is a good thing if you need to get from A to B. But if your only reason for going is to show how little gas you can use, then what's the point? It'd be like me doing circuits of Washoe Lake (pretty flat 2 lane roads with few stops, where I can cruise for long stretches at 125 mpg or so) just to raise my mpg display.

    Nor do I consider my Insight a bore to drive. Though I do think that any driving which doesn't involve winding roads taken at a good speed has a pretty high boredom quotient, the Insight makes it less boring than most cars. It's talking about it that I find boring.
  10. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi James:

    ___You are the one missing the point here. I can almost guarantee that the 2.0L Jetta TDI the Taylor’s will be driving around the US will pull into the 80’s and with that, there will be a stampede for them vs. the junk FE capable vehicles everyone else is selling here in the US. By consuming a few hundred gallons, they will save the US and the world a few million over the longer term.

    ___Without the competitions, CleanMPG would not be reaching as many as it has and possibly not even exist! I have consumed a few hundred unnecessary gallons and the results of the savings are posted on the Forum banner each and every refresh.

    ___Good Luck

  11. Chuck

    Chuck just the messenger


    Your previous implication John & Helen Taylor fly just to get a $100 hamburger is absurd. I might believe someone from Hollywood like John Travolta would do that but they hardly fit with that group, nor would they risk making such a frivious flight to undermine their careers.

    The Taylors live in Austrailia - 21 million people. Wayne lives in Chicago....over 300 million in the US plus another 30 million Canadians nearby. Wayne does not have to fly as much. Even with businesses cutting back, they fly a lot more. By the way, the last year or so you would be hard-pressed to find an empty seat on any flight...I'd bet fuel economy per passenger would be around 70mpg.

    I'm sure you are a fair person, so I'm wondering about your silence on John Travolta flying his own 707 or this past week the video we linked of Bob Lutz, who flys his own German jet fighter?

    James, the Taylors are getting the word out there is a better way to drive. When people do, that will more than make up for their traveling....are you suggesting they just stay home and make what they do a virtual secret?

    While 70.7 lifetime mpg on an Insight is good, discussing it with others here can easily improve it...my tanks over the years have improved from 60mpg to 92mpg in the summertime...never would have done it without talking to others. You do talk quite a bit, and it's rather negative. Sorry, I don't think being cynical is cool - doing something is cool. That would include the Taylors. Just a sample of people in history with a lot of detractors.
    • Lincoln
    • Churchill
    • Martin Luther King Jr
    • Wright Brothers
    • Robert H Goddard
    • Bill Gates (sorry hobbit!)
    Who is remembered more? Is it the writers that said they would never get anything done?

    Speaking of contributions, what's yours?
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 24, 2008
  12. lightfoot

    lightfoot Reformed speeder

    I knew about this, and thanks for posting it (even though it is completely irrelevant to what this couple is doing). It made me think: the $100 hamburger is really no different from someone burning gas to drive to the mountains, strapping skis or snowboard on his feet, and going to play in the snow (perhaps using a lift which runs on electricity)? Or someone strapping a rowing shell onto their car and going to race at a regatta? Or someone towing a bass boat to a river and entering a tournament, whizzing around at 60+ mph with their 250hp outboard (OK, the 60+ mph is illegal and dangerous on our river) to catch fish that they don't even eat. These are entertainment, an important part of life, as distinct from work, school, or shopping related travel. Who are you or I to say that others should not do these things? When gas gets expensive enough they will cut back.

    The difference is that doing it in a public way as an "event" encourages others to try it as well. You driving at 125mpg and not communicating that would not accomplish this end.

    Well talking about saving fuel is what this site is about. Sorry that bores you. Personally, I used to love whizzing around corners on cars and bikes but now find driving for mpg immensely more entertaining.
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2008
  13. jamesqf

    jamesqf Well-Known Member

    When did I imply that? I don't in fact think there was any mention of them flying at all (other than as commercial passengers). I was using a simile, something I hoped would be familiar to readers, to try to get a point across.

    And how is this relevant? I don't know, and don't care, about whether the Taylors or Wayne fly in the course of their work, or for vacations, or whatever. What I'm saying is that to fly to the US specifically to drive in a contest to see who can get the best fuel economy is defeating the whole purpose of getting better fuel economy.

    There are some six billion people whom I've never mentioned by name. Why should I single out these two, or even know who they are? I don't recall either of them telling the world about how they get good gas mileage.
  14. lightfoot

    lightfoot Reformed speeder

    James, it appears that you are here just to argue and complain about increasingly inconsequential matters. Do you have anything positive to contribute? If so what?
  15. Chuck

    Chuck just the messenger

    James, as said before, you take pains to avoid the numerous upbeat material in both the news and the Daily Grind.

    Is your "contibution" here injecting negativity in nearly all your posts, then finding a way to be dismissive no matter how reasonable the reply?

    Not impressive.
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2008
  16. diamondlarry

    diamondlarry Super MPG Man/god :D

    I would only partially agree with you there. If I, by burning a gallon or two "unnecessarily" can give a bunch of people(for example just 10) an insight into how they can save a gallon or two themselves, then there is a net savings. If you multiplied that by the thousands or more people that are exposed to it by the power of the internet then my supposed "waste" of that fuel I burned is a moot point. I'm growing very tired of your posting for the apparent purpose of just being a pain in everyones backside. Take that as a warning to shape up or else.
  17. groar

    groar X-Frenchy: very

    Exactly what I was going to reply :)

    This is why this forum and other are existing : some people are "loosing" time by managing this forum, or replying to this forum, or doing tests to post results to this forum only to permit other people to improve themselves.

    Thanks to all those who are managing, replying or testing to post on this forum.

    Have fun,

  18. Chuck

    Chuck just the messenger

    Appreciate your support Denis and want to add it's good to get the perspectives of members outside of North America.
  19. pdk

    pdk Beacon of Sanity

    Let's see, in the competitions I've been a part of, I've used a total of no more than 3 gallons of gas (including warmup and force-charge time), probably only a little over 2. I have easily saved 3x that amount learning what I have from competitions and applying it to my commute. That's direct savings.
  20. diamondlarry

    diamondlarry Super MPG Man/god :D

    I've only ever been personally involved in 2 competitions myself. At the WFEC, my car burned a total of 3.13 gallons. I have since then achieved two 90+mpg tanks and am currently working on a third 90+mpg tank that is currently over 95 mpg. My highest tanks before WFEC were only in the 86 mpg range.

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